Very accurate.

The P90 is a bit after my time but I have played with it on a few occasions, personally I could never get used to the Bullpup designs while others prefer it.

I've never fired the bullpups, but the few people I know who have really like it. I have never heard of any of them being a match rifle, though. I can see they'd be fast to get on target and effective in a close-in environment (say, less than 50 yds).

Back in the olden days, a gun was really an edged weapon (like a pike) with a bullet fired out of the end. The poor sod carrying the thing got his one shot and then hacked at his enemy. This theory reached it's maximum development with the British and the Brown Bess--with tactics to match the design of the weapon. Dense company of men in ranks with sequenced fire followed by bayonet work in close. Muskets and then rifles continued with the alternative use as a pike through WWI, the last war where generals though it was a good idea to use bayonet charges against machine guns.

Since then bayonets have been rarely used except as a last resort or under extraordinary circumstances. Given a bayonet situation, I'd rather have an '03 Springfield than a bullpup design. In other words, is the bayonet now as much a relict of former tactics as a saber?

B

The bayonet would come in handy if you have to reload, he who has to reload first does not write the history book in most cases.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.7x28mm scroll down....


SB193 Sub Sonic

The SB193 cartridge features a 3.6 g (55 grain) Sierra Game King FMJBT (Full Metal Jacket Boat Tail) projectile. The SB193's low muzzle velocity eliminates the distinctive "crack" created by supersonic rounds when used in conjunction with the P90 Gemtech sound suppressor. The SB193 suffers from greatly reduced penetration and range, but benefits from slightly lower recoil. The white colored bullet tip can identify SB193 subsonic ammunition. Its sale to civilians is restricted by FN

As Diametrical, has already stated...at sub-sonic speed that, .22 cal is marginal at best, with poor penetration /stopping power....aka .22lr/ 135ft. enrgy......lol

It's a no brainer....A .30 cal at sub-sonic speed has far better penetration/range than a .22 lr........
http://www.quarterbore.com/300whisper/index.html

With all that fancy education, you still dont have the smarts too admit that your wrong!!...............

__________________
Matt (SD,CA)

1984 300SD.. White/Chrome Bunts..Green

1997 2500 Dodge Ram 5.9 Cummins 12 Valve 36 PSI of Boost = 400+hp & 800+tQ .. ..Greenspeed

2004 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 Quad Cab Cummins 5.9 H.O "596hp/1225tq" 6 spd. Man. Leather Heated seats/Loaded..Flame Red....GREENSPEED

Global warming...Doing my part, Smokin da hippies..

Fight the good fight!......

You're comparing a P90 with a 22LR? now thats LOL. Where in a F--- did you get 22LR from it has nothing to do with this, are you drunk or on something?

Thread starter.......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRyLEBGX5ag
Its pretty quite with a silencer as well, though not as quite as an MP5.
__________________

Howie.... Hello.....

Remember this.... post #7....

Howie:
Not really, the small calibers penetrate armor better. The MP7 is the upcoming sub of choice which is 4.6X30, speed rules with body armor, holes in vitals trump energy.............

Knock knock.....anyone home..............A 224 cal. 55gr bullet @1050fps sub-sonic....the penetration is going to the same as a .22lr.....duh

And you do mortgage loans?.....................Thanks for the warning...If you cant figure out that a .30 cal. 150gr bullet is much powerful/devastating... than .22cal 55gr bullet traveling at the same speed....Ah hell no ....no money deals with you....,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

__________________
Matt (SD,CA)

1984 300SD.. White/Chrome Bunts..Green

1997 2500 Dodge Ram 5.9 Cummins 12 Valve 36 PSI of Boost = 400+hp & 800+tQ .. ..Greenspeed

2004 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 Quad Cab Cummins 5.9 H.O "596hp/1225tq" 6 spd. Man. Leather Heated seats/Loaded..Flame Red....GREENSPEED

Global warming...Doing my part, Smokin da hippies..

Fight the good fight!......

Already answered that, its too much for you to comprehend shoooo go away.

If you compare shot-for-shot then yes, a larger mass carries more energy than a smaller mass at equal velocity. E = 0.5mv^2. However, the weapon is not used as a single shot firearm at long range. It is an urban weapon and is rapid fired at close range. 2-3 shot groups fired in very close succession means that the group has 2-3 times the energy on target as a single shot. Because it has minimal recoil and swings on target quickly, the 2-3 shot groups get on target more quickly than a long-gun, given the constraints of human reaction time and strength -- Take two objects of equal mass: can you lift & turn them equally if one is quite long relative to the other?

I know you know this B, but add the MP7, it is designed specifically for close quarters and armor piercing ammunition which is the reason it used a fast smaller caliber bullet, the smaller bullet penetrates armor better because it has less surface area to penetrate. If you want to do a home experiment get a piece of cardboard and see how much energy it takes to push a sharpened pencil through, then get anything blunt of the same or larger diameter and see what happens. People get the misconception that 5.56 and smaller are less effective because they picture the little 22LR they played with as kids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjY0Us7NOns

That's the sectional density argument you made earlier, to which nobody responded.
The flip side of the armor piercing bullets argument is that if you have two bullets of equal energy then the one with larger diameter will impart more energy to the target than the smaller -- the smaller may pass through the target (carrying energy beyond the target) rather than staying in the target and distributing the energy internally.

There is no one-size-fits-all answer. But in close quarters fighting (urban warfare) you don't need long gun accuracy or down-range energy. Worse, with high velocity rounds in a ricochet-rich environment, everybody is in danger rather than just the enemy.

Right, bullets flying through walls killing the team in the next room is not a good thing.

With a 50 round mag you shouldn't have that problem!

__________________
1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

Well if you think about it, its commen sense. Most urban warefare is close, in a city chances of you shooting at someone who is more than 100-200 feet away max is slim. Probably they are going to be 20-50 feet away and you are going to see them for a second as they run into a building.

So what would you want, an M14 or an MP7/P90. The M14 is big, long, has a lot of kick, and if you hit a concrete wall could come back at you. Or it could go through them and hit one of your guys on the other side. The smaller round is more than enough at those distances, more so the modern high speed rounds.

Its like in WW2 in towns, the MP40's, and Thompsons were worth their weight in gold. Entering a building with a Garand or K98 must suck.


I remember once a Navy Seal was talking about the old 9mm vs 45 debate. He said "if I enter a room and put one in your head and two in your heart, your not going to know the difference."

__________________
1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

Thats three seconds on the trigger a a few taps if you are not aiming you'll go though it fast.

Thats true, guess practicing reloading is important!

__________________
1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200