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  #16  
Old 01-31-2009, 05:23 AM
iwrock's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMAllison View Post

You can keep your water, and mosquitos too (we used to chase them with tennis rackets); I'll take brown grass in summer and 65 degree warm spells in winter.
x2.

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  #17  
Old 01-31-2009, 05:29 AM
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I thought the reason that the Hoover Dam was built...oooo....some how many years ago was to provide a lake that would act as a reservoir for the desert region in and around Southern California and Southern Nevada, and also act as a source for hydroelectric generated power...

Obviously, there wasn't ENOUGH rainfall back THEN to sustain agricultural positions in the southern reaches of Nevada and California, so how does global warming TODAY explain the lack of moisture back then?

Christ!!!!! The wackos flake out and forget their dang history and they want cash to fix something that wasn't broke to begin with...man moved in and altered the landscape...

You want water? Move out of the area where it wasn't intended to begin with or put up with what's available...

Not enough? Then get rid of the illegals and you can have some of the water they are taking from you...just quit asking us folks out East, North and South of you to give you something you're wasting or giving away for nothing the way it is now....

Geesh!!! What the hell are they teaching them folks in Californication Schools anyways? "HowToBeg 101"????
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Last edited by mgburg; 01-31-2009 at 01:10 PM. Reason: Spelling...I dun lefted out a 'r'....duh!
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  #18  
Old 01-31-2009, 06:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgburg View Post

Geesh!!! What the hell are they teaching them folks in Califonication Schools anyways? "HowToBeg 101"????
No money for income tax refunds right now.....so says CA's chief accountant.


Vou...chers.....for you...and you...and you and you and yo-oou.

So long, farewell, Auf wiedersehen, good night,
I hate to go and leave this pretty sight.
So long, farewell, Auf wiedersehen, adieu,
Adieu, adieu, to yieu and yieu and yieu.
Dum dee dee dum dum dum dum dum.......Dum dee dum dum dum!


Why my daughter is moving to CA to work in Beverly Hills is beyond me.. but hey, she's free and 24...
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  #19  
Old 01-31-2009, 09:00 AM
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If the state can give IOU's for tax refunds, can the citizens give IOU's for tax payments ? Seems only fair to me.
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  #20  
Old 01-31-2009, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Botnst View Post
Not a peep.

I wonder what the long-term average rainfall pattern is for any given state. I have looked it up for my own and it had some surprises, but most of it was what I would expect.

For people interested in drought data (in addition to just arguing about it) Google "Modified Palmer Drought Index". The site is user hostile but you'll probably figure it out.

The index is more than rainfall alone and provides a more comprehensive view of drought from an agricultural perspective.

B
Interesting stuff, this Palmer Index.

I was sitting on the porch one evening last week, glass of bourbon in hand, reflecting on the lack of rain here and what would cause such a thing...then it hit me like ton of bricks: la Nina!!! In the winter, most of our moisture comes out of the eastern Pacific. The rain is triggered by cold fronts from the northern tier, lifting the unstable air Pacific mass. No moisture in the air is because of lower Pacific water temps...so, I looked it up and sure as hell, eastern Pacific water temps are -.7C from average and have been that way for about 3 months now. I also read that it takes 5 months of .5C below average water temps for it to qualify as a la Nina event.

La Nina or not, we've installed a patented pivot irrigation system in the front clover patch and are running liquid gold (rural water) onto it. And, I'm almost done with Frankenstein's water trailer (400gal military potable water tank on a mil generator trailer with 5hp pump and spray/fire accessories).

By Dog, I'm gonna have some clover even if it hair-lips the Pope.
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  #21  
Old 01-31-2009, 09:47 AM
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You live in the Southern California desert, and you get your water through an aquaduct that steals the water from the Colorado. Then, you complain about having water problems and a drought (no kidding, really?) and use that anecdotal evidence to support your theory that Al Gore and the global warming bunch are right. Because what happens in California certainly must be a primary indicator of the WHOLE WORLD. Man, how self-centered can you be?

Most of the earth's temps can be attributed to water vapor, clouds, and sun spots; the earth's temperature is not constant; temps go up, temps go down. Man has been watching that temp change since 1850 (150 years; I'm not sure they teach math at Berkeley anymore), and we humans have been around for 6 MILLION years. Are the temps rising? Yes, but they've done that thousands of times in the past. Will the temps fall? Certainly, they will because they've done that thousands of times in the past.

You point to your 2009 California drought in the desert then boldly proclaim that you're right and that the world is heating up and that Al Gore and the global warming bunch are right. They're right that the temps are rising for the time being, but they're wrong about the "why" it's rising. The earth is larger than man and more complex than man; we should reduce our pollutants because it's good for us in the long run, we should take care of our planet because it's our home, but to think we're capable of destroying the planet is insane.
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Last edited by POS; 01-31-2009 at 10:01 AM.
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  #22  
Old 01-31-2009, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by POS View Post
You live in the Southern California desert, and you get your water through an aquaduct that steals the water from the Colorado. Then, you complain about having water problems and a drought (no kidding, really?) and use that anecdotal evidence to support your theory that Al Gore and the global warming bunch are right. Because what happens in California certainly must be a primary indicator of the WHOLE WORLD. Man, how self-centered can you be?

Most of the earth's temps can be attributed to water vapor, clouds, and sun spots; the earth's temperature is not constant; temps go up, temps go down. Man has been watching that temp change since 1850 (150 years; I'm not sure they teach math at Berkeley anymore), and we humans have been around for 6 MILLION years. Are the temps rising? Yes, but they've done that thousands of times in the past. Will the temps fall? Certainly, they will because they've done that thousands of times in the past.

You point to your 2009 California drought in the desert then boldly proclaim that you're right and that the world is heating up and that Al Gore and the global warming bunch are right. They're right that the temps are rising for the time being, but they're wrong about the "why" it's rising. The earth is larger than man and more complex than man; we should reduce our pollutants because it's good for us in the long run, we should take care of our planet because it's our home, but to think we're capable of destroying the planet is insane.
Hah!
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  #23  
Old 01-31-2009, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by cmac2012 View Post
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/01/30/MNC615JNHB.DTL&hw=drought&sn=001&sc=1000

Look at the facts and leave your damn spin out of it.... Seek the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
California's 'Green Jobs' Experiment Isn't Going Well

By STEPHEN MOORE
Los Angeles

Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger was all smiles in 2006 when he signed into law the toughest anti-global-warming regulations of any state. Mr. Schwarzenegger and his green supporters boasted that the regulations would steer California into a prosperous era of green jobs, renewable energy, and technological leadership. Instead, since 2007 -- in anticipation of the new mandates -- California has led the nation in job losses.

The regulations created a cap-and-trade system, similar to proposed federal global-warming measures, by limiting the CO2 that utilities, trucking companies and other businesses can emit, and imposed steep new taxes on companies that exceed the caps. Since energy is an input in everything that's produced, this will raise the cost of production inside California's borders.

Now, as the Golden State prepares to implement this regulatory scheme, employers are howling. It's become clear to nearly everyone that the plan's backers have underestimated its negative impact and exaggerated the benefits. "We've been sold a false bill of goods," is how Republican Assemblyman Roger Niello, who has been the GOP's point man on environmental issues in the legislature, put it to me.

The environmental plan was built on the notion that imposing some $23 billion of new taxes and fees on households (through higher electricity bills) and employers will cost the economy nothing, while also reducing greenhouse gases. Almost no one believes that anymore except for the five members of the California Air Resources Board (CARB). This is the state's air-quality regulator, which voted unanimously in December to stick with the cap-and-trade system despite the recession. CARB justified its go-ahead by issuing what almost all experts agree is a rigged study on the economic impact of the cap-and-trade system. The study concludes that the plan "will not only significantly reduce California's greenhouse gas emissions, but will also have a net positive effect on California's economic growth through 2020."

This finding elicited a chorus of hallelujahs from environmental groups. The state finally discovered a do-good policy that pays for itself. Californians can still scurry around in their cars, heat up their Jacuzzis, and help save the planet. But there was a problem. The CARB had commissioned five economists from around the country to critique this study. They panned it.

Harvard's Robert Stavins, chairman of the federal Environmental Protection Agency's economic advisory committee under Bill Clinton, told me that "None of us knew who the other reviewers were, but we all came up with almost the same conclusion. The report was severely flawed and systematically underestimated costs." Another reviewer, UCLA Prof. Matthew E. Kahn, a supporter of the new regulations, criticized the "free lunch" aspect of the report. "The net dollar costs of each of these regulations is likely to be much larger than is reported," he concluded. Mr. Stavins points out that if these regulations are a net boon for businesses and the economy, "why would you need to impose regulations like cap and trade?"

The Sacramento Bee, which has editorialized in support of the new regulations, was aghast at CARB's twisted science. We have to "be candid about the real costs of the transition," a cautionary editorial advised. "Energy prices will rise, and major capital investment will be needed in public transit and new transmission lines. Industries that are energy intensive will move elsewhere."

The green lobby has lectured us for years that global warming is all about the sanctity of science. Those who question the "scientific consensus" on catastrophic atmospheric changes are belittled as "deniers." Now, in assessing the costs, the greens readily cook the books and throw good science out the window. "To most of the most strident supporters of this legislation," says Mr. Niello, "the economic costs don't really matter anyway, because we are supposedly facing an environmental apocalypse."

Mr. Schwarzenegger fits into that camp. He recently declared: "I recommend very strongly that we move forward . . . . You will always have people saying this will lose jobs."

Meanwhile, the state is losing jobs, a lot of them. California's unemployment rate hit 9.3% in December, up from 4.9% in December 2006. There are now 1.5 million Californians out of work. The state has the fourth-highest housing foreclosure rate in the nation, has lost more businesses than any state in recent years, and is facing a $40 billion deficit. With cap and trade firmly in place, the economic situation is only likely to get worse.

Other states are plundering the Golden State's industries by convincing businesses to pick up stakes and move out before the cap-and-trade earthquake hits. Governors and Washington politicians who want to reduce their "carbon footprint," but are worried about the more immediate crises of cascading unemployment, unbalanced budgets, and the housing-market collapse, would be wise not to follow California's lead. Green policies have a tendency to push states into the red.

Mr. Moore is senior economics writer for the Wall Street Journal editorial page.
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  #24  
Old 01-31-2009, 01:28 PM
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I see some of you are seriously geography-challenged. Look at a map and see where and how big the Sierra Nevada mountain range is.

La-Nina certainly plays a role and reduces precipitation by cooling the eastern Pacific waters. That combined with somewhat above-average air temperatures eats away at the snowpack on which parts of CA and NV rely on for their water supply. That's pretty much the gist of it.
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  #25  
Old 01-31-2009, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
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Would you date a girl who didn't?


*I* sure wouldn't.

Yuck.


Epic FAIL.
That kind of attitude is part of the problem. Think about it for a while. Unless your daily job is being a mechanic or coal miner or something filthy like that, why do you need to shower everyday? FYI in my household we don't necessarily shower every day. Think what you want, but I assure you you wouldn't know if you met us unless we told you.
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  #26  
Old 01-31-2009, 02:07 PM
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CA. has...oh...let's say about 40% coastal waters consisting of...OCEAN...

Sure, it's salt, but what's the problem with building a few de-salination plants and PROVIDING YOURSELVES WITH YOUR OWN WATER????

Because of the "cap-and-trade" Green-rules? Can't build your own infrastructures because "...it MIGHT ruin the habitat of the spotted-slimy-bellied-dirt-sucker-aphid that inhabits the undersides of displaced pre-neo-educated neanderthalian rocks in the corner of the lot where Funk & Wagnall used to keep their hermetically-sealed mayonnaise jars stored?

Who painted themselves in a corner?

This is my point about wacko enviromentalists and the whole leftists' way of thinking...(BTW, they sure appear to be about the same folks, don't they?)

WE/L: "I don't care about later, I want/demand that it be done, MY WAY NOW OR SOMEBODY WILL DIE!!!" (eventually)

COMMON SENSE: "But look at what these rules/regulations will mean to everyone else downstream from your problem. Isn't there another way to get to the root of the problem?"

WE/L: "NO! I NEED THIS NOW OR SOMEBODY WILL DIE!"

CS: "Wait...we found the source of the problem...it's too much of you in too little of a space...we need to move a few things and then, maybe you'll be able to breathe...."

WE/L: "NO! WE NEED TO DO WHAT WE WANT NOW OR SOMEONE WILL DIE! I'VE GOT MONEY RIDING ON THIS CRAP AND I'M NOT WAITING FOR ANYONE ELSE'S RHYME OR REASON TO MAKE ME POOR AGAIN! IF I DON'T GET MY WAY...SOMEBODY IS GOING TO DIE...OR THEIR FRONT-DOOR STEPS WILL BE VERY WET!"

And so it goes...we're told that the sky is falling...yet, the earth keeps turning and we continue to get our noses bent out of shape by the "Chicken-Littles" from the greener side of the fence, who continue to convince "some" of us that they know more than anyone else...when with a little common sense, you can see what the real problem is and it has nothing to do with "green-house gases" or "Global Warming" ... it's too little rain...

There's always BEEN TOO LITTLE RAIN...that's why FDR (Remember him?) got a "works-program" (Remember those? Mom and Dad talked about them and A&E shows cute little snippetts of B/W film from those days... ) to build this little earthen dam to make this really big lake so water could be siphoned off and routed to farmlands where farmlands had NEVER EXISTED BEFORE and to supply WATER to a GROWING CALIFORNIFICATION POPULATION (Which, BTW, contributes very little substance-wise to the nutritional/moral fiber of this nation...as of late... ) and to supply electricity to the surrounding areas (Which, again, didn't have (cheap) electricity available back then...)

Now, you take that particular infrastructure, never expand or improve on it, overload it over the period of the past 70 years or so...you take any money you made, spend it like drunken sailors on shore-leave, never once thinking that you're going to need to expand, improve, or look for alternative methods of obtaining a VITAL RESOURCE such as WATER....and you expect the Federal Government (Taxpayers) to come running in and KYAs?

Here's a clue...

Shut down your borders and kick out those that got there illegally...shut down some of those do-nothing industries and ration your water 'til you either build up your infrastructure or the State finally falls into the ocean...

Better yet, rent or buy the "SIMS" game and see IF there's anyone that can "simulate" a way out of the problems you've created for yourselves...only this time, the "game" is real and you don't get to go out for cake, ice-cream and a "toe-massage" when "GAME OVER" pops up on the screen..

The people of Californication screwed themselves with no fore-thought and/or short-sighted legislation and enviromentalist crap-science. They heard about how this stuff has consequences and they didn't want to hear about it...they wanted what they wanted, they were in a position of power to get it and they figured that someone else could "fix" any problems that would be encountered, or that had been brought up. And now, they want help from the very people they've been *****ing about and bad-mouthing?

Here's an even better idea...call up any of your local space-cadet movie-stars/starlettes and have any of them hug a tree, or squeeze a rock, for a drink of water...they live right next to you and they'd be happy to make the "...world a better place to be in..."

Yep, your own back yard...call us when you folks can breath again and you have a pot to **ss in...
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'10 - Dakota SXT - Daily Ride / ≈ 172.5K
.'76 - 450SLC - 107.024.12 / < .89.20 K
..'77 - 280E - 123.033.12 / > 128.20 K
...'67 - El Camino - 283ci / > 207.00 K
....'75 - Yamaha - 650XS / < 21.00 K
.....'87 - G20 Sportvan / > 206.00 K
......'85 - 4WINNS 160 I.O. / 140hp
.......'74 - Honda CT70 / Real 125

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. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ~ Yogi Berra ~
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  #27  
Old 01-31-2009, 02:33 PM
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I agree showering every day is unnecessary, thats a huge waste of energy and water. Every other day is usually fine unless you do stuff that gets you sweaty or dirty. Since most Americans are fat blobs, every other day is fine. In fact, the exercise of showering is probably their peak of physical activity during the week. Especially in Texas, the FAT state. *Flame suit on*
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  #28  
Old 01-31-2009, 02:39 PM
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Well that's the paradox. The fatter you get, the more you sweat, doing fewer activities. There's a club in town that caters to fat people, brags about the fact that 65% of Kern County women are overweight, and now they have a place to come and dance! You should see the support beams downstairs.

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