Would ending prohibition 2.0 work? Or even be possible? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

cmac2012 · #1 03-02-2009, 11:18 PM

Even George Schultz says that we will never get a handle on the illegal drug trade until we take the huge profits out of it. It's tempting to think that some or perhaps much of the violence on our borders could be reduced if govt. provided the same drugs (with major strictures) for much lower prices.

There is no way this is just a Mexican problem. The demand that enriches traffickers comes from here. Many of the assault weapons that give the cartels a heavy advantage in firepower come from the US. And if Mexico does collapse in a big way, Lord help us, we're almost certain to see illegal migration beyond our wildest fears. At some point, with more and more onerous poverty pushing them, it would be like trying to keep volcanic ash from covering the ground. Or to keep freezing water molecules from breaking apart mountains.

But then I consider the details. What, is our govt. going to go into the business of procuring and packaging marijuana and cocaine? I mean if we went with state operated "drugstores" like the WA state liquor stores, that would be the most efficient at insuring that the proceeds went to reduce the taxpayer burden. Not to mention administering the necessary social programs.

That's supposedly the benefit of needle exchange programs: the state has a captive audience for counseling. Some claim that it actually works to some degree, that a lot of these people are lost souls and a little positive human interaction can put them on a better path. But, whoa, that would be a massive social program. Then again, perhaps the monies gained from selling the stuff and way reduced interdiction costs would be more than enough.

But would all drugs be made legal? Weed, coke, and perhaps heroin are one thing but meth is a hard one. I mean maybe, if people were allowed only a small amount and had to jump through hoops to get it. But that would only encourage the black market to get up and running again.

But we're losing the war on drugs, methinks, as it's currently being waged.

kerry · #2 03-03-2009, 12:04 AM

Was talking to a woman in Mexico over Xmas arguing that the only way to stop the violence in Mexico was legalization in the US. I agree. Perhaps these tough economic times will be enough to push drugs over the edge of legalization. Anyone heard any projections on tax revenue on drugs? How do the Dutch do it? Definitely need some kind of user license though like a driver's license. Probably should do the same with alcohol at the same time.

10fords · #3 03-03-2009, 01:09 AM

I've never seen anyone passed out in the gutter with a joint in their hand. Iv'e never been on a call where a guy beat his wife because he was stoned. Meth on the other hand is a hideous drug.It destroys lives and should never be legalized. Almost every suicide call I have been on was meth related. People don't do meth in small quantities or occasionally. It is a lifestyle that is almost impossible to escape (without dying). I don't think heroin would be a good one to legalize either.

cmac2012 · #4 03-03-2009, 01:26 AM

I agree with about all of that. I used to drive cab and I saw plenty of drunks acting crazy or violent but never a pot head.

Meth and heroin are seriously bad news. The only reason to legalize them would be to stop the drug gang warfare. If the cartels lost the profit from grass and coke they'd just move all their resources to meth and heroin.

It's hard to say if Mexico really is that close to collapse from this, I mean it's bound to be lot healthier economically than Pakistan, the other country our intel services classify as a potential failed state.

Whether or not counseling, etc. would really be of any use with meth or heroin addicts is a tough one. Various studies indicate that counseling/treatment is much more cost effective than interdiction out of country or at the border.

t walgamuth · #5 03-03-2009, 06:14 AM

Some form of legalization is the only solution.

Clearly what we have now is not working.

link · #6 03-03-2009, 11:14 AM

Many misunderstand the purpose of the war on drugs. Most think it a combat with those who cultivate, manufacture or distribute drugs. This is incorrect. The war on drugs is an opportunity to use the drug trade for a massive expansion of government and also to help support military/industry complex that makes the tools of warfare.

The war on drugs is akin to a water wheel placed in a stream. It does work but in the end makes for little change to the stream. 30 plus years of this “war” have made for absolutely no reduction in drug use in the US and elsewhere, but it has justified an enormous expense that pretends to “fight” the drug trade. How much smaller would our own Coast Guard be if many of their missions were not to patrol for
marijuana distributors? Same question for the DEA, and border patrols, as just 2 more examples.

Legalizing marijuana would serve to 1) reduce expenses in the form of lowered demands for police forces throughout the US, and probably the world over; 2) reduce committed fees for court and prison related expenses; 3) capture a vast revenue stream, and 4) encourage legal cultivation throughout the world.

Government would not likely get into the cultivation business itself. No reason for it. Government would establish grades and taxation, and leave cultivation and distribution to private industry. Further, many new industries would spring up over night. Those selling growing supplies would expand significantly and would those selling paraphernalia.

Then there are the many business which would cater to marijuana use. Imagine Starbucks, where you could get coffee and a treat along with 20 varieties of premium pot. Each ranging from a single “hit” to a mixed blend. Cough. Makes yer eyes red just thinking about it.

Imagine the increase of sales for Clear Eyes and Pop Tarts! But seriously, along with this should come manditory education on the topic. Education would supplant some of the efforts that currently go to policing.

Other countries would likely remove the cloak from the cultivation of this highly profitable substance. The revenue generated would likely rival many of the biggest current industries.

Perhaps during O's second term, something along these lines will start to happen.

pj67coll · #7 03-03-2009, 12:38 PM

There should be no such thing as an illegal drug. The lesson of the prohibition should be clear enough. Humans are stupid and will drink, shootup, smoke whatever they want, especially if it's illegal. If you are stupid enough to do any of the above that should be your issue and yours alone. The only time any one else should become involved is if the idiots actions adversely affect an inocent third party. Now whereas posession of any kind of narcotic shoudl be legalized. Drug dealers, in my opinion should be far more seriously hounded.

- Peter.

Botnst · #8 03-03-2009, 12:54 PM

Farking stupid-arsed laws.

Matt L · #9 03-03-2009, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

Drug dealers, in my opinion should be far more seriously hounded.

- Peter.

Without these,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

Farking stupid-arsed laws.

those drug dealers would look a whole lot like your neighborhood liquor store. Nice neighborhoods have nicer liquor stores too.

aklim · #10 03-03-2009, 02:05 PM

Here is where a problem is. Even if we legalized it, there are many parts of the world that will not. So, it can be slowed down but NOT stopped. We need to realize that before we go any further.

pj67coll · #11 03-03-2009, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

Here is where a problem is. Even if we legalized it, there are many parts of the world that will not. So, it can be slowed down but NOT stopped. We need to realize that before we go any further.

Don't care about the rest of the world. My concern is with the US.

- Peter.

A264172 · #12 03-03-2009, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

There should be no such thing as an illegal drug. The lesson of the prohibition should be clear enough. Humans are stupid and will drink, shootup, smoke whatever they want, especially if it's illegal. If you are stupid enough to do any of the above that should be your issue and yours alone. The only time any one else should become involved is if the idiots actions adversely affect an inocent third party. ...

- Peter.

Couldn't agree more.

A264172 · #13 03-03-2009, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

Here is where a problem is. Even if we legalized it, there are many parts of the world that will not. So, it can be slowed down but NOT stopped. We need to realize that before we go any further.

I don't think I understand what you mean.

But we can't solve the worlds problems for them, only our own.