Madoff Assets 826 Million - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

aklim · #31 04-02-2009, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by POS

I guess I was right - you are jaded.

Because I'm an honest person who believes in myself, I believe most people are honest and do good things without reason. I trust people I don't know because I am trustworthy myself.

Partially. I was jaded a long time before 25.

Trust is earned, not given. I trust my dogs and my wife and a few others. I test people in subtle ways before I determine if they are trustworthy and to what extent. I distrust all others.

Before you say it, no, I am not miserable. Quite the opposite. I have few disappointments and a few pleasant surprises when the "subjects" pass the tests. Of course, even if they do pass the tests I am always testing. Just in case I missed something or they turned for the worse.

SwampYankee · #32 04-02-2009, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Nice 1969 Rybo. Nice boat, don't think its worth $2.2 in this market.

Sure is purdy! Wish I could help them recoup some of that money...

cmbdiesel · #33 04-02-2009, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by POS

I guess I was right - you are jaded. Because I'm an honest person who believes in myself, I believe most people are honest and do good things without reason. I trust people I don't know because I am trustworthy myself.

What he said.

WVOtoGO · #34 04-02-2009, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmbdiesel

What he said.

X2

aklim · #35 04-02-2009, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WVOtoGO

X2

x3

Fulcrum525 · #36 04-02-2009, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by POS

Because I'm an honest person who believes in myself, I believe most people are honest and do good things without reason. I trust people I don't know because I am trustworthy myself.

As am I. I have gotten burned for it but I continue to be honest because it is a part of who I am. I still believe that the majority of people are fundamentally good.

Fitz · #37 04-02-2009, 01:34 PM

I feel some sympathy for Madoff's investors, especially the ones who weren't aware they were invested with Madoff, like some pension holders. What I'm not in favor of is any type of government bailout for his victims, based on the failure of the SEC to properly supervise Madoff's activities. That's where this is ultimately heading.

aklim · #38 04-02-2009, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz

I feel some sympathy for Madoff's investors, especially the ones who weren't aware they were invested with Madoff, like some pension holders. What I'm not in favor of is any type of government bailout for his victims, based on the failure of the SEC to properly supervise Madoff's activities. That's where this is ultimately heading.

Hopefully some of them will sue the SEC for not properly investigating him.

Fitz · #39 04-02-2009, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

Hopefully some of them will sue the SEC for not properly investigating him.

You'd think that Steven Spielberg is sophisticated enough to do his own due diligence, but if safety was what these people were after they should have invested in T-Bills. Instead they were after high-yield returns and there is always risk associated with higher yields.

As one of his investors admitted, Madoff was SO successful at beating the market, it was always assumed that Madoff was doing something illegal. They just thought it was insider trading or something of that sort.

Madoff was very politically connected and had a lot of pull on Wall Street. That's what kept the SEC out of his books.

aklim · #40 04-02-2009, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fitz

You'd think that Steven Spielberg is sophisticated enough to do his own due diligence, but if safety was what these people were after they should have invested in T-Bills. Instead they were after high-yield returns and there is always risk associated with higher yields.

As one of his investors admitted, Madoff was SO successful at beating the market, it was always assumed that Madoff was doing something illegal. They just thought it was insider trading or something of that sort.

Madoff was very politically connected and had a lot of pull on Wall Street. That's what kept the SEC out of his books.

I think the problem was that he simply delegated it to someone and didn't bother to track it well. You see, because you are knowledgeable doesn't mean you do exercise due diligence. Just because I can have gay sex doesn't mean I will engage in it.

And if they thought he was doing something illegal, why would they continue to invest in him? I mean, like everything in business, you have to expect some up and some down. They just got lazy and left it on cruise control and raked in the cash. This time, they got caught.

Maybe the SEC should be fried. This is the problem not the rules. There is no point in having more rules if you will not enforce it. So what if the govt steps in and dishes out more rules? Rule books are good for paperweights if you don't read and enforce them.

POS · #41 04-02-2009, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

Maybe the SEC should be fried. This is the problem not the rules. There is no point in having more rules if you will not enforce it. So what if the govt steps in and dishes out more rules? Rule books are good for paperweights if you don't read and enforce them.

Now that's something I can agree with!

MTUpower · #42 04-02-2009, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

Compared to what other convertible sportfish? I can't think of one that would be worth more that was semi-custom other than maybe a vintage Tiffany or Hines-Farley (which are much more custom than Rybovich ever was).

You could get a Hatteras of the same size and vintage for 1/3$ of the Rybo. They were all cold molded plastic over triple plank mahogany afaik. Dad had a Runner ('92/'93) that was a PITA b/c of the triple 300 Mercury o/bs, which was the company's last experiment. That mold, however, has been sold to Dusky, who now uses it as their 30' open dayboat. Somebody else in VA (not Dusky) bought one of their other molds that is in production. Maybe Judge Yachts or similar.

Merritt and ACY come to mind. Both are uber high quality and just as or more expensive. You only need one buyer to make the sale- but I'd think the value was close to 1 than 2.2 if indeed it was bristol condition; depending on power and documented history. A well kept cold molded hull does not fall in value more quickly than a glass hull. In fact, cold molded hull's tend to keep value better than glass hulls providing that the hull is taken care of. Either way, it's too small for my tastes.

Fitz · #43 04-02-2009, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

I think the problem was that he simply delegated it to someone and didn't bother to track it well. You see, because you are knowledgeable doesn't mean you do exercise due diligence. Just because I can have gay sex doesn't mean I will engage in it.

Spielberg's account with Madoff wasn't insured by the federal government, was it?

If you want to send him a check to help cover his losses go ahead, but I had my own losses in the market last year and still have taxes to pay on what profit I was able to make.

When you talk about suing the SEC, who do you think will be paying any cash settlement that might be awarded?

Quote:

And if they thought he was doing something illegal, why would they continue to invest in him?

Here's the story, and for some the obvious answer is greed...

Quote:

I Knew Bernie Madoff Was Cheating, That's Why I Invested with Him

From ClusterStock.com, Dec. 12, 2008:

Interesting tidbits coming in about Bernie Madoff (read indictment here).
Specifically, we're hearing that the smart money KNEW Bernie had to be cheating, because the returns he was generating were impossibly good. Many Wall Streeters suspected the wrong rigged game, though: They thought it was insider trading, not a Ponzi scheme. And here's the best part: That's why they invested with him.
For years and years I've heard people say that [Bernie's] investment performance was too good to be true. The returns were too steady -- like GE earnings under Welch -- and too high given the supposed strategy.

One Madoff investor, himself a legend, told me that Madoff's performance "just doesn't make sense. The numbers can't be straight." Another sophisticated Madoff investor actually went through trade confirms in order to reverse-engineer the strategy and said, "it doesn't add up."

So why did these smart and skeptical investors keep investing? They, like many Madoff investors, assumed Madoff was somehow illegally trading on information from his market-making business for their benefit. They didn't consider the possibility that he was clean on that score but running a good old-fashioned Ponzi scheme.

And another from Whitney Tilson:

One friend who saw this coming said Madoff had his own broker-dealer and a relative as his finance guy; another friend said he was suspicious because of the 1-2%/month returns with never a down month (much less quarter or year), combined with never showing a a down month (much less quarter or year), combined with never showing anyone his portfolio. 99% of the time, if it sounds too good to be true, IT IS!

http://tiny.cc/171wN

Hatterasguy · #44 04-03-2009, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

Compared to what other convertible sportfish? I can't think of one that would be worth more that was semi-custom other than maybe a vintage Tiffany or Hines-Farley (which are much more custom than Rybovich ever was).

You could get a Hatteras of the same size and vintage for 1/3$ of the Rybo. They were all cold molded plastic over triple plank mahogany afaik. Dad had a Runner ('92/'93) that was a PITA b/c of the triple 300 Mercury o/bs, which was the company's last experiment. That mold, however, has been sold to Dusky, who now uses it as their 30' open dayboat. Somebody else in VA (not Dusky) bought one of their other molds that is in production. Maybe Judge Yachts or similar.

Good point.

My friend has a very early wood Hurley Hatteras 47, that looks just like a Rybo. Because one of the founders of Rybovich whoes name escapes me now had a heavy hand in designing it. So its kind of a Rybovich built by Hatteras on the side, interesting story. Most people mistake it for a Rybovich, and think it was built in the 80's, actualy its very early 70's just ahead of its time. Its not cold molded either its planked with juniper, if I remember correctly.

SwampYankee · #45 04-03-2009, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Good point.

My friend has a very early wood Hurley Hatteras 47, that looks just like a Rybo. Because one of the founders of Rybovich whoes name escapes me now had a heavy hand in designing it. So its kind of a Rybovich built by Hatteras on the side, interesting story. Most people mistake it for a Rybovich, and think it was built in the 80's, actualy its very early 70's just ahead of its time. Its not cold molded either its planked with juniper, if I remember correctly.

There is nothing classier than a wood yacht. When you can afford to have all of the work done by someone else.

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