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  #1  
Old 08-25-2009, 08:35 AM
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Universal health care in Ireland..........

...I was getting ready for work and listening to cnn in the background. Apparently they just had a big cancer summit in Ireland over the past few days. cnn's Dr. Sanjay Gupta was there and corralled the Public Health Minister for Ireland over in to the corner for an interview. Apparently Ireland was a European holdout, and just went through the "reform" of their healthcare a few years back and went with 'healthcare for all.'

The Irish fellow didn't even try to defend his own system. I waited for him to say, "We're still working the kinks out....", but I didn't hear it.

Off the top of my head, I recall that the Irish guy said they spent 40% of their collected tax revenue in 2008 on public healthcare, to the detriment of many other services. This part is fuzzy, but I also believe he said in the order of 2/3 of the Country still paid for some partial or full insurance, because the public system sucks.

The hip replacement waiting time, for instance was months, ect......

The healthcare thing isn't going to affect me directly in the slightest, unless my taxes go up to fund the program, but I recommend trying to find a transcript of Dr. Gupta's interview of Ireland's Health Minister to you rich guys left over from the 60's who are staring knee & hip replacements and bypasses in the face.

Off to work. All the protesting I can afford today.
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  #2  
Old 08-25-2009, 09:20 AM
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We don't have to copy Ireland
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  #3  
Old 08-25-2009, 09:28 AM
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In other news, the VA has a 400,000 case backlog.
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  #4  
Old 08-25-2009, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by John Doe View Post

Off to work. All the protesting I can afford today.
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  #5  
Old 08-25-2009, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by tankdriver View Post
We don't have to copy Ireland

Yeah, your're right. It would be stupid to study historical models, and smart to start out cold, thinking we can make it work where others can't. If you watch the interview, you'll note the highlighted comparison of what is being proposed here vs. what Ireland has done

Just food for thought--I think that Gupta guy did a pretty good interview. It was very informative to me, and I forgot to mention the part that gave me the most pause: apparently the people that buy the supp. policies, are the people that want to be able to choose their doctors, which in some cases they have had all their lives. That may not mean much to someone who doesn't have children, or has been a welfare recipient or public clinic client their whole lives, but it means a lot to me. I certainly see where someone without health insurance would not have much concern, and would be lucky just to get a doctor period, but if I'm going to pay for it, I want to be able to choose.
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Old 08-25-2009, 10:46 AM
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along these same lines, I've read that some U.S. hospitals along the U.S./Canadian border regularly receive visits from Canadian citizens. seems Canadians are placed on a waiting list for much needed surgeries. they come to the U.S. and can get the needed surgery NOW.

Socialism: A chicken in every pot, only the government supplied chicken died of bacterial infections. eat up kids, don't leave any government chicken on your plate!
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  #7  
Old 08-25-2009, 10:54 AM
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I've always wondered what model the new health care system is being modeled on.
It wouldn't supprise me at all to find out the arrogant *******s in Washington started from scratch.

Danny
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  #8  
Old 08-25-2009, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by HuskyMan View Post
along these same lines, I've read that some U.S. hospitals along the U.S./Canadian border regularly receive visits from Canadian citizens. seems Canadians are placed on a waiting list for much needed surgeries. they come to the U.S. and can get the needed surgery NOW.

Socialism: A chicken in every pot, only the government supplied chicken died of bacterial infections. eat up kids, don't leave any government chicken on your plate!
I've told this about 50 times here, but one of my best friends is an expat that bounces from the Netherlands to Germany and now lives in France, and while in Germany, as a full-time employee with full benefits, he went to Thailand and paid cash to have surgery during his (paid, six week, state mandated) vacation time, because he was going to have to wait for over a year for surgery to remove a tumor on his neck. The guy is a reporter, and had this brown golf ball growing out of his neck, and he was about to be transferred to a desk.

Seems like "A Chicken in Every Pot, a Car in Every Garage", was a quote misattributed to Herbert Hoover, but in fact was a Republican Party jingle, supposed to tout prosperity of a Republican regime right before the depression hit. I don't think throwing around the terms Socialism and Communism helps point out the problems with the healthcare reform proposals. Kind of thins down the argument to the tone of right wing email forwards.
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Old 08-25-2009, 11:06 AM
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I can't tell you how many patients I have seen from Europe who have "public healthcare" and couldn't wait 6 years to have reconstruction done, so they opted to pay out of poocket and come to the US instead.
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  #10  
Old 08-25-2009, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Mistress View Post
I can't tell you how many patients I have seen from Europe who have "public healthcare" and couldn't wait 6 years to have reconstruction done, so they opted to pay out of poocket and come to the US instead.
Put on your rose colored feel good glasses and you won't see them anymore

And who says we have to model it after Europe's system anyway.....oh yeah, half the people in favour of the plan.
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  #11  
Old 08-25-2009, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by John Doe View Post
Put on your rose colored feel good glasses and you won't see them anymore

And who says we have to model it after Europe's system anyway.....oh yeah, half the people in favour of the plan.
I'd rather keep my money in my pocket, and purchase health insurance as i feel fit.
I know what I make per year
I know what I pay out per year
my gross vs net is a rather large number already
If it comes to a point, where I'm suddenly mandated to provide healthcare insurance to employees (and quite possibly their entire family) and maintain their current pay rate.... I'm just going to close my doors and walk away.
might as well start flipping burgers, because there is absolutely no way I can stay afloat in a situation like that...

its sad.
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  #12  
Old 08-25-2009, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by matthias08 View Post
I'd rather keep my money in my pocket, and purchase health insurance as i feel fit.
I know what I make per year
I know what I pay out per year
my gross vs net is a rather large number already
If it comes to a point, where I'm suddenly mandated to provide healthcare insurance to employees (and quite possibly their entire family) and maintain their current pay rate.... I'm just going to close my doors and walk away.
might as well start flipping burgers, because there is absolutely no way I can stay afloat in a situation like that...

its sad.
That one's easy. Just switch them to private contract positions. I've noticed in the job listings, the number of contract positions in my field is getting close to half.
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  #13  
Old 08-25-2009, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinsCE View Post
That one's easy. Just switch them to private contract positions. I've noticed in the job listings, the number of contract positions in my field is getting close to half.
Its not easy, actually. Subcontract employees present all sorts of complexities, respondeat superior comes to mind as a glaring one: You send a contract employee out to a jobsite and he blows up your server through negligence, but in the normal course and scope of his duties. You call your liability carrier. They tell you to get laid, because subs aren't covered. They are supposed to carry their own liability coverage to meet that definition of "subcontractor." Your contract employee says, "hey man, you ain't paying me enough to carry a bond and my own liability insurance, so get laid."

And in reality, you would have never gotten the bid for the job anyway, because nobody would hire a farmed out subcontractor that has no liability coverage.
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  #14  
Old 08-25-2009, 01:41 PM
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With out public health care my mom would have most likely been dead. She's fighting cancer for the last seven years, don't think she could stay insured in this country and get the help she needs.
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  #15  
Old 08-25-2009, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistress View Post
I can't tell you how many patients I have seen from Europe who have "public healthcare" and couldn't wait 6 years to have reconstruction done, so they opted to pay out of poocket and come to the US instead.
Was that old Europe or new Europe ? and were they seeking elective surgeries ?
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