The EPA has now declared carbon dioxide to be a toxin and harmful to humans. Therefore, the way the Clean Air Act is written, they're allowed to come up with their own regulations without getting Congressional approval prior to enacting them.

For 2012 to 2016 vehicles, the standard for CO2 emissions will be 250 grams per mile. As it stands right now, no vehicle with an internal combustion engine of any type will be able to meet those standards. Not even a Toyota Prius hybrid will be able to meet those standards for highway driving - it can barely squeak under for stop and go city driving where it's making heavy use of it's battery pack - but for cruising on the interstate, forget it.

Even a 2009 VW TDI - one of the cleanest, most fuel efficient diesels out there - comes in at 340 grams per mile. It will be verboten as well under the new rules.

They will also be monitoring how many miles you drive per year. If they determine you've driven an excessive amount of miles, above what's needed for commuting to work and other daily chores, you'll be hit with a tax or fine for excessive carbon emissions. And if they approve the new rules for the Federal Reserve they're discussing, they can debit said taxes/fines straight from your bank account without telling you a thing.

Guess they had to come up with some way to force people to buy GMC's new electric golf carts.

And if you think going electric will get you of the hook, guess again - they've approved having monitoring devices in electrics and plug-in hybrids that will tell the utility when the vehicle is on charge - and allow thw utility to charge you a "special" vehicle recharge rate - and believe me, it'll be special when you see the bill and realize you're being charged double or triple the going rate for charging your vehicle - I've already seen this happen in years past with other utilities that offered separate billing and special rates for those with electric vehicles - I know, I've owned an electric vehicle as a hobby for better than 15 years.

Guess they've decided to limit the resources the unwashed masses can use and when/where/how far they can travel, so Al Gore can continue using his Gulfstream.

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Just say "NO" to Ethanol - Drive Diesel

Mitchell Oates
Mooresville, NC
'87 300D 212K miles
'87 300D 151K miles - R.I.P. 12/08
'05 Jeep Liberty CRD 67K miles
Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club

Carbon Dioxide IS toxic.

1%, as can occur in a crowded auditorium with poor ventilation, can cause drowsiness with prolonged exposure.[2]
At 2% it is mildly narcotic and causes increased blood pressure and pulse rate, and causes reduced hearing.[41]
At about 5% it causes stimulation of the respiratory centre, dizziness, confusion and difficulty in breathing accompanied by headache and shortness of breath.[41]. In addition at this concentration panic attacks may occur.[43][44]
At about 8% it causes headache, sweating, dim vision, tremor and loss of consciousness after exposure for between five and ten minutes.


That's just a cut/paste from wikipedia.

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-tp


1990 300SE "Corinne"- 145k daily driver - street modified differential - PARTING OUT OR SELLING SOON - PORTLAND OR. AREA - PM ME FOR DETAILS
1988 560SEL "Gunther"- 190K passes anything except a gas station
1997 S420 - 265k just bought it with a rebuilt trans. Lovely condition

ok CO2 is toxic to humans... DUH its our exhaust! It also happens that is food for all the plant life on earth. Its called nature! its a balance. I come from a family of farmers. You think with hundreds of achers of trees we would have done our part in scrubbing CO2 out of the air.

Back the F!@# off Al Gore, get a shovel and plant some trees. make a positive impact, don't try and control others.

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So what laws did those SOB's in DC pass now? Link please?


The EPA can ask for whatever it wants, but if its not practical they don't get it. The car companies will cry and go running to Congress to get it fixed.

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1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

Say there, Sparky . . . got a credible source for the spew or have you been drinkin' deeply from some homebrew?

Here is an actual story from this week, I assume this is what we are talking about:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/08/science/earth/08epa.html?_r=1

BTW . . . a 2009 BMW M3 emits about 290 grams of carbon dioxide per kilometer (466.9/mile) while a 2009 Toyota Prius emits about 90 (144/mile).

Also, the 250 gram/mile number being bandied about is the "corporate average" for the entire model line, not the max for every vehicle.

The White House wants to require vehicles to average no more than 250 grams of carbon dioxide emissions per mile by 2016 -- though automakers will be able to earn credits toward meeting the requirements. The European Union is going much further: It has mandated that automakers average 130 grams per mile by 2015.

Honda had a fleet-wide 23.6 mpg fuel economy average, emitting 376 grams per mile of carbon dioxide -- a heat-trapping greenhouse gas -- in the 2009 model year.

Hyundai had 23.4 mpg. and 380 grams per mile of carbon dioxide

Toyota Motor Corp., which was tied for first in 2007, slipped to third with a 23.2 mpg and 383 grams per mile.

Volkswagen AG was fourth, while Nissan Motor Co. and BMW AG were tied for fifth at 21.6 mpg.

Detroit's Big Three finished in the last three spots. Ford Motor Co. was in seventh with a 20.5 mpg; and 434 grams per mile average. General Motors Co. was in eighth at 19.9 mpg; and 447 grams per mile. and Chrysler was in last at 18.7 mpg and 476 grams per mile.

It's time to disband the EPA. All the cars and truck emissions have been cleaned up, and possibly over cleaned for that matter. Much of our heavy industry has been driven away. Just like electric cars (actually coal powered cars) the problem doesn't go away, it just gets moved somewhere else. The one good thing that comes to mind is if it weren't for the EPA, we'd still be driving cars with points and carburetors. It's time to address the real 8000# gorilla in the room- over immigration and over population.

CLIMATEGATE is the magic word. No laws have been passed on the grand scale so far, but they are working hard to set the framework for more future rippoffs.

It's a major global scam where every nation is meant to buy in.

As everybody should know at this point, the human caused Global Warming proposal and it's scientific backing is a scam of unprecedented proportion.

The recent surfacing of emails containing evidence of fraudulent alteration of scientific data came just in time for the "Big Bang" climate conreference in Copenhagen, Denmark.

Just google "Climategate" and it'll take you on a journey of unknown scientific controversy.

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Right, Wiki ...who?

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This sounds like 1971 all over again. The same stories about how this or that cannot be done, how terrible all of this is going be and how much it is all going to cost.

But Republican Presidents Nixon and Ford saw to it that auto emission's rules did come to pass and we are all better off for it.

I was recently walking across a parking lot where a gasoline smell so strong was present I though someones tank had developed a leak. Turns out it was just an out of tune 1965 pick-up driving across the lot. Then I remembered that the air used to always smell like that.

As far as the toxicity of CO2 goes... I worked on setting up a pipeline in the 1980's that transported CO2 from an underground formation to an oilfield where the CO2 was injected to improve oil recovery rates. Engineering thought the line could be built without a number of safety devices since CO2 was thought to be non-harmful to humans.

An independent lab was consulted on this matter, and we were then informed by the upper management that full safety requirements would be in place regarding anything that had to do with CO2. When we got the Materals Data sheet on CO2 it was somewhat eye-opening as to how bad this stuff is. The line was built using the most stringent safety devices available at the time, and no one was allowed to work on the line without air packs at the ready. We were told to treat it like H2S (Hydrogen Sulfide).

I've seen a lot of proposed rules come out of the EPA that never came to pass. What to watch for will be called Final Rule, and this will not come about until everyone has had their say. From what I have seen that can take many, many years.

Forget emissions.


Focus on fuel economy.

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-Typos courtesy of my mobile phone.

Balance is the key. You can die from drinking too much water. Happened here in Cal a while back when some nimrod radio hosts held a "hold your wee for a wii" contest where people competed to see who could not pee the longest while drinking massive amounts of water. One woman died.

If we had 100 times the CO2 in atmosphere I'm sure some organisms would be OK with that. Others probably not.

Trees are good. Trees in the world are diminishing in numbers and mass in a big way.

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1986 300SDL, 362K
1984 300D, 138K

Obama wanted something to crow about in Copenhagen. He couldn't get the Senate to swallow cap & trade. So Lisa Jackson stepped up like a good soldier. New Jersey's gain is America's loss. Stand by folks. NJ is the most highly regulated place in the country for development. Rediculous.
Hmmm. I wonder if she knew it was time to jump NJ's Dem. Ship?
http://enviropoliticsblog.blogspot.com/2008/12/njs-lisa-jackson-may-get-top-epa-job.html

The question of her having the authority to act in this manner will no doubt be litigated.

something doesn't "add" up here....