Using the term "what are you smoking" is nothing but irritating/offensive to the person who you are choosing to have a discussion with.

Have you driven an Insight Tyler? It sounds like you haven't and are assuming they are as dull to drive as a Prius.

I drove a five speed early insight and found it engaging to drive, reminded me of a 240d stick but faster. The mileage of course is about 2.5 times what a 240 will do.

A friend of mine let me know he has a '97 Golf he is looking to get rid of and I can borrow if the cabriolet sells and I need wheels. Lets see where this goes lol.




I need to read up on the insight IMA system.. I know the battery is nothing more than 1500 industrial D cell batteries.

this comes with a tdi and 6 speed! http://blogs.vw.com/beetle/21st-century-beetle-here-watch-footage-direct-york-city-reveal-event/

I saw, I like it. I dig the 16" old school style wheels too

I assume it's a 2.slo? The 2.0 ABA motor in those cars is a real gem. Not the most powerful, or fuel efficient... but they'll run and run and run as long as you keep oil in them, and replace the ignition coil every now and again. You should get into the 30s on the highway if it's a stick... and the price difference between the 2.0 and a TDI would buy a lot of fuel! The timing belt on the ABA is lickity split easy to do, and also due every 60,000 miles.

The bushings for the manual's shift linkage like to wear, but they're not hard to replace either. When everything is right the old 020 manual transmission is a great driving, great shifting box. Many feel that the change to cable shift on the more powerful cars was no a step forward.

Of course if it's an automatic I wouldn't pay very much. A 1997 might have the 01M autobox... a great improvement on the 096.... they last twice as long sometimes! (IE 130,000 miles). Couple that with a first gear that's too tall and 4th that's too short and you don't get the best use of what power the motor has.

-J

I've read that some people simply dump the 68# battery pack and enjoy the extra trunk space. You lose some city FE but highway stays about the same.

Definitely. Lack of research before posting is too...

TheDon, I have a 1st-gen Honda Insight, and let me tell you that it's a great car! I have a CVT (automatic) and mainly drive city with lots of traffic lights and with speeds from 0 up to 40+mph yet still get an average of 54mpg. Right now I'm averaging 58mpg with all city driving. The freeway is where the Insight shines--I get anywhere from 60+mpg to 70+mpg. Anything below 50mpg on the freeway is rare, and I get 55+mpg without effort. I don't draft much (just don't like getting the front fascia sandblasted by tiny pebbles), but if traffic permits, I try not to drive no faster than 65mph and can achieve 70+mpg consistently. I'm not a hypermiler by any means, but I anticipate stops and scan ahead for traffic conditions/speeds to increase fuel efficiency.

The Honda IMA system does not allow for full-electric drive. The electric motor is there to assist the ICE. Some people think this is what a true hybrid should be while others think it's inferior to hybrids that can run on full electric under certain speeds, such as the Prius.

If you want power and speed, then the Insight isn't for you, but the car is not designed as a sports car, but it sorta drives like one! I think it has sufficient power for what it needs to do. I like it's low seating position, S2000 steering wheel, aluminum construction (no rust), and form-follows-function design. It's also an easy car to work on despite it being a hybrid. Just don't mess with the IMA battery/components--leave that to skilled technicians.

If you can find one, go for it! With gas prices, hybrids tend to go up in price. You may pay a premium if the seller knows what he has. Make sure it has had a new IMA battery replaced under warranty, if not, make sure the warranty still applies. Btw, the manual gets even better mpg. I get over 500 miles on about 9.5 gallons (tanks holds 10.6g). Go to InsightCentral for further info.

edit to add: Don't let the battery aspect of this car scare you away. If you can't find one for sale or one that meets your budget, consider a 1st-gen Prius if you want better gas mileage. More space yet probably not as good on gas as the Insight. I really like the new CR-Z, but it's EPA rating is nothing near the 1st-gen Insight's EPA rating, let alone it's real-world mpg rating. I've read that some can get around 50mpg in their CR-Z, but it seems that is done with some effort and even getting that mpg number isn't always consistent. The Insight gets 50mpg without effort.

Why so needlessly adversarial? I don't understand why you need to have a belittling, snarky tone. Looking through your posts I see the a similar tone in alot of them. You're not the type of person I usually bother to get into an exchange with; normally its pointless. This will be my last post addressing you, so you can have the last word. I don't care.

Do you honestly expect everyone spend lots of time researching before posting their opinions? By no means do I expect to be taken as an expert on hybrids. Obviously I'm biased against them, alot of people are. I've never driven this particular car, only Civic and Prius hybrids so I have no idea. I also don't follow the market, but assume that one pushing with over 150k is still going to cost 5k+. I thought I read somewhere that Honda or Toyota aren't sure about their batteries lasting efficiently much past 150k, but I could be wrong. I also understand the effort it takes to build them does not make up for how "green" they are, but I'm sure there's plenty of evidence to the contrary.

30 MPG vs 60 MPG obviously will pay for itself in time. The great unknown is how well these cars are going to hold up past the 10 year, 150k mark.

Its nice to hear from an actual owner. Thank you. If one comes my way at the right price, I would jump on it in a heart beat. Even a dead battery wouldn't scare me away. It would be interesting to see what is possible with a current LIpo battery pack.
Well at least that part is true.

Oh yes, I'll heartily admit it. I'd be happy to be wrong about the long term prospects of these cars. There hasn't been rampant failures of older hybrids yet, and if there was I'm sure some enterprising after-market company would swoop in a bring the prices down if there was a demand.

What got me on the wrong foot with hybrids is how people have favored them so heavily instead of diesels. Even Mercedes has decided to offer a number of hybrid models here, but denies us their diesel counterparts. I'm also put off by the stereotypical hybrid driver. :D

Like I said, I'm happy to be proven wrong as long as its not laced with snarky condescension.

Joe just get a diesel hybrid, like this one:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5EyC_89TE0...18f66059df.jpg

Don't get me wrong, this isn't a member or even forum specific thing for me. I'm cranky everywhere because people in general don't tend to spend a few minutes in order to determine whether the latest/greatest bit of information on whatever subject is reasonable/applicable. I'm just cranky when I see bull and there is a lot of it, mostly not intentional and especially second hand (I read... I heard... Someone told me... and so on).

And yes, people should spend a few seconds searching before they post something, opinion or not. For example, battery lifespan with fairly constant use is ~200k-350k miles, which is the fifth link down on a search for "prius battery pack lifespan". IMO the problem isn't that you're biased against hybrids, the problem is you aren't spending a few minutes to see if any of what you've been exposed to holds water before you pass on whatever piece of info.