The GOP primary just keeps getting weirder. I really thought Gingrich was on his way to the nomination. What has caused his what seems to be an overnight catastrophic meltdown? Wasn't he nutty enough for the AM radio set with all his arresting judges and repealing child labor talk? But what I find even stranger, is that the polls are now showing that Ron Paul might actually win the Iowa primary. I thought he was 'crazy' according to the orthodox GOP crowd? I think Paul is actually the only real threat to Obama. The more the general voters see of the other GOP guys during the debate circuses, the more Obama's approval rating goes up. But if it comes down to a three way race with Paul running third party, I think Paul has a good chance at winning, because even a guy like me will consider voting for him because Paul is the only candidate in the race who promises to end the insane defense spending, which I think is at the heart of all this nation's problems. I think I might just take the good with the bad if Paul has a chance. But this puts the GOP in a conundrum. While Paul has a damned good chance to pull 34% of the vote in a three way race, there is no way he'd pull 50% in a two way match up. So my question is to the GOP crowd, if Paul looks like he's got traction, what are you going to do? And has Santorum, the most unappealing guy in the race, become all that is left to the anti-Romeny, no-way Paul crowd? Is that what it has come down to?

The Rick Santorum moment that was never supposed to happen - Opening Shot - Salon.com

And is all of this the sign of an impending total crack up of the GOP?

http://www.salon.com/2011/12/21/the_gops_dangerous_divide/

Stay tuned!
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You mentioned in one of your posts awhile back that the lobbyists were the at the core of our nations problems....I'm paraphrasing.

They have no doubt helped defense spending go completely out of control.

I agree with both of your comments.

The way I see it - back in the early 50s(or earlier) - the USSR elitist and our crooks got together and said "let's make some $$$".

Neither side ever had any intention of blowing up the other.

$$$ would have stopped flowing.

The wall came down in '89 and we continue to serve as the worlds police force.

When will it end ?

I doubt Paul could be the incumbent, but he is far more refreshing than the other group of goofs.

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I think the Founding Fathers gave the President the veto pen for times like these. Both the Republican and Democratic congressional contingents are in the pockets of the defense lobby. They pass out the factories and jobs to those who co-operate as they line the pockets of their stooges with "campaign contributions", aka "legalized bribery". The only way to stop them is to put in place a president who will veto this insanity and force them to stop. That is a powerful argument for rank-and-file Democrats to vote for Paul, because they are sick to death of death and murder being more important than the human beings who make up this country. I know I am. Ending this insane defense establishment will be painful at first, but it would free up billions to deal with our debt and that can be invested in learning how to produce products the world actually wants.

Which is just fine by me. I was a staunch, non-religious Conservative all through my high school and college years. Initially, since growing up in CT, it was my way of rebelling. Then as I got older, I realized that while I generally tended to agree with the Republicans on many fiscal matters there was a great divide when it came to social issues. The Republican Party has gotten more and more foreign to me over the last 15-20 years. Eventually the political b.s. and finger pointed soured me to the process all together, to the point where I just dropped politics cold-turkey.

I, for one, would love to see the traditional two-party system come crumbling down. While I think Ron Paul is nutty, I tend to agree with him, a lot more than the other "candidates." It will be interesting to see what the GOP will do if Paul gets a head of steam since they've really ignored and tried to discount him.

Do you ever foresee a fracture in the Democratic Party? I think the end of the traditional Republican Party is near but the Dems seem to be a lot better at keeping all of their ducks (from voters through candidates to the Party) in a row come election time, no matter how much dissension there may be prior.

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...except that the veto is all or nothing. Congress loves the rider, joining distasteful crap to useful legislation, and often the myriad items have nothing to do with one another.

Sometimes they call the result "bipartisan support," but often that is code for "screw the taxpayer... again."

The so-called line item veto isn't really the solution, in part because the problem is the process itself...including lobbyists and entrenched career politicians. The idea of a "representative" government has become nearly a joke.

The idea of Ron Paul winning the Republican nomination is absurd.

The idea of Ron Paul winning any electoral votes as a 3rd party candidate is equally absurd. (well, maybe NH or VT).
Were he to be the Republican nominee, it would be lights out before 8:00pm EST. A McGovern or Mondale rerun.

Threat to Obama? Ridiculous. IMHO, of course.

I've listened to him in a couple of these "debates" and he's got difficulty stringing 3 coherent sentences together. Then his decibel meter goes on overload and his shrill voice leaves one wondering where the guy with the straight-jacket is waiting off-stage.

All Of Ron Paul's Responses At The ABC Iowa GOP Debate - YouTube
Ron Paul Highlights at the Fox News Iowa GOP Debate - YouTube


And he still needs a new tailor. IMHO, of course

i don't think too much of Romney but he continues to behave like an adult, unlike the other sometimes pretty nutty R's.

I still think it will be Romney against Obama in the fall.

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

The Democratic Party is much older than the GOP, it was founded by Jefferson and then remolded several times, quite radically under Jackson, who was called "Jack Ass" by his detractors, from which we get the modern donkey symbol. The original Democrats would have more in common with Ron Paul than they would with Nancy Pelosi or Newt Gingrich. Their basic tenet was that the US should be as small d- democratic as much as possible and as small-r republican as little as possible. They hated national banks and government spending, and loved state's rights. My how times have changed, but on the core issue of a more democratic government, all flavors at all times of the Democratic Party have continued to maintain that as the defining difference between the two parties, to this day. Google "The Jacksonian Revolution" to learn more, it was one of the most important events in US history that no one ever heard of.

The last time it went thru wrenching change was in the Civil Rights era, when the conservative wing of the Democratic Party, based in the US South, left to become today's GOP-RWNJ conservatives, all over whether or not black people were real humans or not. Interestingly, the GOP had gone thru a similar experience earlier in the century, back in the days when they were the liberals, when the liberal wing of the GOP known as the "progressives", split from the GOP big-business-wing to form the Progressive Party under Teddy Roosevelt, the last real Republican liberal. This was also the closest a third party ever came to winning an election. The Progressives eventually became the liberal wing of the Democratic Party, where they stand today. Just about everything I personally believe in, a strong federal government, a strong anti-corporate anti-trust policy, strong environmental legislation and women's rights, a "speak softly and carry a big stick" defense policy, and national health insurance, all originated in the Progressive movement and it's leader, TR. Another little known fact: It was Teddy Roosevelt, that bad old commie, who first proposed national health insurance, in other words, Republicans invented the idea. Not today's Republicans, for sure.

So what we really see is an ebb and flow of the party wings as history changes. Right now we are seeing the closing act of the "Dixiecrats" movement, an anti-immigrant, pro-white, Evangelical southern based rural movement that has taken one form or another in the US since the end of the Civil War, playing out. My experience with these people is that they are selfish, hate filled bigots who seem to be against everything, and for nothing. Since the 1960's, they have fought modernity and a fair and just society for everyone, all in the name of preserving the status quo of Leave it To Beaver Land. The Democrats were glad to be rid of them, and the GOP will soon be wishing the same.

The GOP is doing its best to become a regional Southern party. I used to regularly vote GOP, in fact, I donated money and voted for John McCain in the 2000 election. I stopped for the same reasons you have cited. They have included all kinds of religious based issues into the national debate, and religion and politics are a stupid mix. I used to vote on who I thought was right for the times, sometimes we needed strong fiscal management, so I voted for Reagan. Other times, we needed to progress as a country and grant rights to homosexuals and allow women the right to be free to choose their own destiny, so I voted Democrat. Today, I see no reason to vote for what the Republican Party has become. Bush showed us that their reputation for fiscal discipline was a big fat joke, and the rest of the crowd's love of fascist ideology based in religion makes me want to vomit on them, not vote for them. I doubt we will see any serious split in the Democrats at this point, it will only become stronger as the demographics of the country change to more minority and more poor, with the newly impoverished Republicans moving more and more to the Democratic party, as we saw in the 1930s.

I agree.
I also think that Gingrich would smoke Obama in debates, but get smoked in the election were he to be pitted against Obama. Newt Gingrich is a smart man. Bill Clinton enjoyed working with him as speaker.

Bill O'Reilly vs. Bill Clinton (part 2) (12/20/2011) - YouTube

Obama would chew ass and spit Gingrich. The guy is a loose cannon poppinjay and Obama would hang his contradictions around his neck like a cobra. He only looks good in the debates because he knows how to do "talk radio sound bite", something that substitutes for actually thinking in the GOP. That ain't going to work in the general election, just ask Sarah Palin. I've never heard Clinton use the word "enjoy" to describe his relationship with Gingrich. Clinton played him like a violin and in the end helped in his destruction, what pals.

Alas, such a debate won't occur.

Clinton said it last night on O'Reilly and used the word "enjoy".. watch the linked clip. Cut to around 2:50 or so.

I would say this pretty much sums it all up

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Mike Murrell
1991 300-SEL - Model 126
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"Fräulein"

I hope it does turn out ( these folks having to join the reality club)--it certainly would do the people who associated themselves with that lot some good - rather than thinking that would automatically make them a inside member.

I like the way Newt is all bemoaning the negative ads being run against him in Iowa. Newt, who coined the phrase 'Go negative and do it early', is now having his own way of running being used against him and he is very unhappy about it.

I also like the way Newt is claiming how he balanced the budget and created 11 million jobs and on and on. I was paying attention during those years and I seem to recall Newt shutting down the government and then bringing about the biggest loss in Republican Party history. Then he was fined for doing the same thing he accused Jim Wright of doing. I thought that was weird since while Wright was never proven to have done the thing Newt claimed Newt was guilty of it and fined $300,000 grand for doing it.

Then he was fired from his position as Speaker.

So if anyone is wondering why Newt is dropping in the polls.... It is because other Republicans are reminding people of this, or informing people of this for the first time, and people are shocked to find the real Newt is not the Newt who shows up on Fox News. And while there are many Republicans who will carry water for the party there are a lot of them that will not.

The truth will out.

staunch staunch staunch is a weird word. It's sounds like a word someone would use if they were constipated.

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