This '93 E150 has a factory R-12 charge label, no R-134a conversion label, and charge valves that look very much like R-134a push-on fittings. Did Ford use non-threaded fittings before switching to R-134a?



For the stupid question of the day - is there a way to tell R-12 from R-134a?

Sixto
87 300D

Chemical analysis would tell the difference, right?

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daw_two
Germantown, TN

Links:
Sold last car --- 05/2012 1984 300D Light Ivory, Red interior
Cluster Needles Paint
New Old Stock (NOS) parts

Past:
3/2008 1986 300SDL "Coda"
04/2010 1965 190D(c) "Ben"
& many more

This is quite surprising. I wonder if maybe the lines have been changed after it came from the factory as an R12 car?

FWIW, by Federal Law, the fittings are supposed to match the refrigerant therein. For cars that have been modified by individuals, this means NOTHING in that there might be any refrigerant under the Sun in the system regardless of the fittings. For the Mfg.'s OTOH I can't imagine them not matching the fittings with the installed refrigerant.

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2001 SLK 320 six speed manual
2014 Porsche Cayenne six speed manual

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Yes, most any auto a/c shop has a Refrigerant Identifier instrument they can connect and tell you if 134 or 12 are in the system.

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2001 SLK 320 six speed manual
2014 Porsche Cayenne six speed manual

Annoy a Liberal, Read the Constitution

In the automotive field you go by the low side fitting. The fittings you show with the funny high side is correct for a r12 system. The high side could take either a screw on or a quick connect hose. They had to keep the low side the same as all other R12 systems. Before the R134 came out, we had a hose for the low side of all cars and a box of high side adapters as each manufacturer had a different high side. Well, not all manufacturers but many had different high side connections. Such is the automotive world. Now, as far as what it has in it at this time is anybody's guess.

Paul

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84 500 SEL (307,xxx miles)

ford went to 134 in the explorers in 1994 looks like the went to it in 93 in some vans. Shops have testers that will tell you what refrigerant is inside but i would say its safe to assume its 134.
What is the system doing? maybe we can help

Sorry Omega, but in today's refrigerant world it is NEVER safe to assume that a system contains a particular refrigerant. The only way to know is by connecting a refrigerant identifier.

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2001 SLK 320 six speed manual
2014 Porsche Cayenne six speed manual

Annoy a Liberal, Read the Constitution

I'd second that advice, especially on a used vehicle where you have no idea what the PO may have done to the system.

On my wrecked 87 300D when I bought it, there was a sticker under the hood where a shop in Fla had done the R134 conversion - listing the amount of freon and ester oil they'd put in. But they'd only converted the high side fitting to R134 - the low side fitting was still the original threaded R12 type! Guess since they had the necessary adapters in their shop, they just didn't bother with the "extra" work. Made it a PITA for me though, having to pay to go thru all the appropriate steps to get a low side R134 adapter installed.

On the second 87, both fittings had been converted to R134 type - but there was no sticker under the hood for the system having been converted to R134 - either the shop that did it blew it off, or it was a DIY job by a PO.

Best advice - if there's any doubt, take it to a shop and have them check it out.

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Mitchell Oates
Mooresville, NC
'87 300D 212K miles
'87 300D 151K miles - R.I.P. 12/08
'05 Jeep Liberty CRD 67K miles
Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club

The sticker is required by Federal law, but very few converted vehicles ever get it. Even when the sticker is there, it really doesn't tell you much. There are WAY too many people that will put whatever refrigerant for whatever reason in whatever car violating Federal law and don't think twice about it. For this reason, you best use a Refrigerant Identifier if you're not 100% sure of the vehicles refrigerant history.

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2001 SLK 320 six speed manual
2014 Porsche Cayenne six speed manual

Annoy a Liberal, Read the Constitution

Sorry A&R unless he owns a recovery machine that can become contaminated it doesnt matter.

I've had conversion stickers on two of my cars but both times the information was almost illegible as the writing wears off.

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2009 ML320 Bluetec
1985 300CD
1981 300TD

Past Mercedes
1979 300TD
1982 300TD
2000 E320 4Matic Wagon
1998 E430
1984 300SD
1980 300SD

If you have no respect for Federal Law, and you are going to evacuate and recharge anyway, you are correct!

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2001 SLK 320 six speed manual
2014 Porsche Cayenne six speed manual

Annoy a Liberal, Read the Constitution

Even if the sticker is legible, there are so many cowboys out there putting every refrigerant under the Sun in anything with a compressor, unless you know the real history, the sticker doesn't mean much.

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2014 Porsche Cayenne six speed manual

Annoy a Liberal, Read the Constitution

What law are you talking about and how would it be broken?

Although Section 609 of the Act does not govern retrofitting, Section 612 of the Act, which describes the Agency's Significant New Alternatives Policy (SNAP) program, does require that when retrofitting a CFC-12 vehicle for use with another refrigerant, the technician must first extract the CFC-12, must cover the CFC-12 label with a label that indicates the new refrigerant in the system and other information, and must affix new fittings unique to that refrigerant. In addition, if a technician is retrofitting a vehicle to a refrigerant that contains R-22, the technician must ensure that only barrier hoses are used in the A/C system. Finally, if the system includes a pressure relief device, the technician must install a high-pressure compressor shutoff switch to prevent the compressor from increasing pressure until the refrigerant is vented.

Off of the epa website.

To many blends out there to just assume.

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