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spdrun 02-12-2013 11:27 PM

Alternative energy development trust fund
 
... funded by fossil fuel tax revenues. Mentioned in SOTU - I like the idea.

neumann 02-12-2013 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun (Post 3099069)
... funded by fossil fuel tax revenues. Mentioned in SOTU - I like the idea.


if the alternatives are so great why do they need subsidies?
free market and oh so good feelings should suffice, no?

spdrun 02-12-2013 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neumann (Post 3099073)
if the alternatives are so great why do they need subsidies?
free market and oh so good feelings should suffice, no?

Because long-term environmental costs aren't factored into the "cheaper" forms of energy. Also, new technologies become cheaper as economies of scale come into play, but those economies don't develop unless the technology is rolled out.

neumann 02-12-2013 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun (Post 3099078)
Because long-term environmental costs aren't factored into the "cheaper" forms of energy. Also, new technologies become cheaper as economies of scale come into play, but those economies don't develop unless the technology is rolled out.

bs. what are the long term environmental costs for creating And implementing alternative energy technologies? solar is going to go bust worldwide because govts are drastically cutting subsidies and net metering incentives. windmills are not efficient enough to make a substantial difference until storage issues are addressed, battery technology is still below par and EV as the darling of automotive manufacturers is being cut as well in favor of hybrids.

I am all for alternative energy but don't tax me to get it off the ground.

As for the world running out of oil and old school energy sources that's also bs. As new technology comes on line we are finding more and more every month.

Why not use existing resources and modify how they are being used? inflow the technology to care for the emissions and other by products that are so evil.

tbomachines 02-13-2013 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neumann (Post 3099083)
Why not use existing resources and modify how they are being used? inflow the technology to care for the emissions and other by products that are so evil.

Totally being devil's advocate and not necessarily my own opinion, but I'd guess because those resources are finite?

spdrun 02-13-2013 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neumann (Post 3099083)
bs. what are the long term environmental costs for creating And implementing alternative energy technologies? solar is going to go bust worldwide because govts are drastically cutting subsidies and net metering incentives.

Sounds like Obama will attempt to raise subsidies in the US. Good for him, hope he succeeds. It's really damn stupid to let 100W per square foot of energy go to waste.

Even if we cut energy use by 50%, we'll STILL be making an immense contribution to global warming. And Americans seem to be terrified of nuclear power, so that leaves wind, solar, hydro, and geothermal, until (if) controlled fusion is perfected.

Txjake 02-13-2013 12:29 AM

There is no MMGW.......

compress ignite 02-13-2013 12:29 AM

I HATE the principal of "Subsidies" of any Kind !
 
It ALWAYS SMACKS of Industry/Commercial Graft to purchase Legislators, with
the Quid Pro Quo being the "Manufactured" Supports/Subsidies.

BUT the Petroleum Industry (world wide) has SO inveigled itself into our governments ,
TO BE ABLE TO CRUSH ANY ENERGY SYSTEMA that's NOT under their control
as to make Some subsidization of Alternative Energy "Ramp-Ups"necessary.

Locally,Shell and it's partner El Paso Oil are attempting to begin export of
LNG (Shale produced by "Fracking",which causes Earthquakes in East Texas)
to FOREIGN entities IN THE NAME OF THEIR PROFIT!!!!!!!!

The Phenomenon of Fracking has made available SOOOO much Natural Gas
that Vladimir Putin's Oligarchy is no longer able to "Blackmail" the E.U. over
N.G. supplies!

"Fracking" is the practice of forcing Fracking Fluids underground to break up
the Shale N.G. formations [Works Great!] BUT the Damn POISONOUS fluid
ALWAYS ends up in the DRINKING WATER!!!!!!
"FRACKING" has been proven to cause Earthquakes,where it's been used in
East Texas.

The Hoors at the Oil Conspirators are SELLING OUR N.G. (In LNG form) for
MONEY OVERSEAS,when WE (North America) COULD be using IT to be
completely ENERGY independent !
War Profiteers!!

(I'm still amazed that the Pumps @ any Filling Station allow me to purchase
Fuel of any kind,given all the Hades I've subjected the Oil Producers to
over the last 45 years!)

spdrun 02-13-2013 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Txjake (Post 3099092)
There is no MMGW.......

A matter of your opinion, no doubt.

neumann 02-13-2013 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomachines (Post 3099087)
Totally being devil's advocate and not necessarily my own opinion, but I'd guess because those resources are finite?


finite it what terms? 20, 50, 100, 500 years? peak oil is a joke :). it's been force fed to the masses for geopolitical engineering and wealth transfer.

tbomachines 02-13-2013 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neumann (Post 3099096)
finite it what terms? 20, 50, 100, 500 years? peak oil is a joke :). it's been force fed to the masses for geopolitical engineering and wealth transfer.

Are fossil fuels still not finite when dug out?

spdrun 02-13-2013 11:10 AM

SunPower stock hopped up to 10.2 from 9.7 yesterday after this news (and some rating upgrades). Temporarily of course, but it's still at 9.9. Not. Too. Shabby.

rscurtis 02-13-2013 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun (Post 3099094)
A matter of your opinion, no doubt.

My opinion too. It's another form of "control". Look how well it worked for Al Gore.

spdrun 02-13-2013 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rscurtis (Post 3099304)
My opinion too. It's another form of "control". Look how well it worked for Al Gore.

Yeah, stupid Dumbericans elected a moron who got us into two wars, yet didn't have the b@lls to ask for higher taxes to pay for them, instead. Yay for this country. I voted Libertarian that year, but am not ashamed that I thought of Al Gore as the lesser of the two evils.

Is a law that mandates city sewer or a septic tank, as opposed to dumping excrement into the street, also a "form of control?" Here Obama isn't even discussing mandating anything outright. Just making the more environmentally harmful options more expensive while cheapening the better options.

Botnst 02-13-2013 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun (Post 3099078)
Because long-term environmental costs aren't factored into the "cheaper" forms of energy. Also, new technologies become cheaper as economies of scale come into play, but those economies don't develop unless the technology is rolled out.

Who anointed you keeper of the long-term truth?


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