Most Crowded Gun Show I've Ever Been To - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

pj67coll · #16 02-17-2013, 12:09 PM

What's the issue with Coyotes?

-Peter.

Air&Road · #17 02-17-2013, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jplinville

For the last 20 or so years, the gun shows I go to has a booth before the entrance to the show where weapons are checked for ammo, then cable tied in such a fashion that it wont fire. The weapons on display at the shows are also cable tied in the same way. If there's an accidental discharge, it's generally not inside the building, it's in the parking lot or at the booth near the entrance.

Dealers will generally cut the cable tie for you so you can check the action and such, but always put one back on after you are done inspecting the possible purchase.

My last show, I was made to drop my mag, prove the chamber was clear, and my personal carry weapon was tied back. I dropped my mag in my pocket, re-holstered my weapon, and enjoyed the show. Although I hate feeling naked like that, I saw the number of off duty officers moonlighting as security for the show, and felt a little more at ease.

A gun show is the last place I would expect a shooting to happen, accidental or otherwise. I'm sure there's statistics out there to prove it...just as many as the studies to disprove it. I won't bother locating any, because the point is moot.

Anyway, back to topic of scopes. What are you scoping, Larry? It's easy to drop as much on optics as the rifle is worth. Today's "cheap" optics are light years ahead of where they were 40 years ago. I'd stay away from lighted reticles right now, as the price is higher than it should be due to demand...everybody is wanting to outfit their new purchases, and there are plenty of them.

As I said, the cheapest possible scope now is far beyond what I put on there over 30 years ago. I am hoping that upgrading the scope will at least partially compensate for the downgrade of my vision over that period.

I thought about buying something in a varmint caliber, but elected to stay with my .308. I still have my notebook with the hollow point boat tail recipe that has worked so well in that rifle over the years. .308 is not the perfect round for the task at hand, but there are certainly worse choices. I don't think I will be able to make the long shots that I used to be capable of anyway.

I got about halfway through this 1200 table show and very few optics vendors. The first guy instead of trying to talk me into buying one of the many he had on hand, he very honestly recommended that I go buy A Leopould LX R. He said it would be very well suited for my purposes. I was impressed with his honesty for doing the right thing instead of setting the hook on me.

I kept going and found a manufacturer that showed me some impressive scopes that were a brand I never heard of and it was going to take about $300 to buy one from him to experiment with. At that point I had been carrying a rifle that belonged to my brother that he wanted me to sell for him. I was tired of carrying it, so I went back to the highest bidder and got my money.

I then picked up the walk from where I had been, now knowing how to spot an IR scope at first glance. I saw one in a case that was higher power than I wanted but it was marked $150. I looked it over and it was in good shape albeit with a weak battery. I lifted the battery to make sure there was no corrosion and told the guy I'd give him a hundred bucks for it. He hesitated so i thanked him and started to walk off and he said okay. It is some off brand 4 to 12, adjustable objective, and is a one inch tube so I thought I might be able to use my existing rings.

I went a few more aisle and found optics vendors galore, wouldn't you know it? I asked a question about a night scope and got the rundown. In the course of the conversation I told him that I was gong to try what I had bought and then maybe catch up with him at a later show. He saw the price sticker on my scope and politely said I hope you didn't pay that for it. I told him that I had only paid a hundred. He showed me some of his cheaper scopes that were newer technology with German glass. They were quite impressive, and one of them even less than what I had paid.

I was impressed with the guy and got his card. If I find it necessary I will have to decide whether to upgrade the illuminated reticle or buy the night scope.

I got home and did some measuring and the large OD of the scope will prevent me from using my existing rings. They are too short. They are the old Leopould style so I will have to get taller ones. One thing leads to another but I will go ahead and get the rings and mount the scope to experiment with. Given the expense of ammo to zero it with, I am almost considering buying one of his cheap scopes and 30MM rings, but what the heck this way I get to enjoy some more shooting and I have enough components on hand to press out about 200 rounds.

Basically between the reading I did before the show and what I learned at the show I know that with some shooting and maybe some more money spent I can get where I need to be.

Like you say, the cheap stuff today is way better than what is now on the rifle. BTW the rifle is a Remington 742 that I've had for almost 40 years. I have been around some other automatics, but this particular rifle can shoot a group almost as tight as bolt. At least it could when a younger Larry was shooting it.

Air&Road · #18 02-17-2013, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elchivito

My coyote call is a rooster in a crate out in the middle of the pasture, me in the mesquites fifty or so yards away. Worked on a Bobcat recently too. No camo, no high tech. EZ PZ

So does this mean your signal to activate the call is the Sun coming up?

Hatterasguy · #19 02-17-2013, 12:22 PM

Generally with optics you get what you pay for. NV for $600 is not going to be very good. For good NV your going to spend some money.

Your best bet and bang for your buck depending on what magnification you want is to get something from Trijicon.
Trijicon, Inc.

Their illuminated AccuPoint series is a great scope that competes very favorable against high end European scopes that cost 3-4 times as much. They also use their fiber optic technology to illuminate the scope in low light, ie early morning or dusk so you can take shots that you wouldn't be able to with a none illuminated scope. The 3-9x40 is going on my AR eventually.

Also don't forget to get a good mount, LaRue makes some of the best.

cmac2012 · #20 02-17-2013, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Air&Road

Yes it is quite interesting.

Thank God Oscar Pistorius had guns in the house with which to defend himself. God only knows what might have happened without them.

Air&Road · #21 02-17-2013, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Generally with optics you get what you pay for. NV for $600 is not going to be very good. For good NV your going to spend some money.

Your best bet and bang for your buck depending on what magnification you want is to get something from Trijicon.
Trijicon, Inc.

Their illuminated AccuPoint series is a great scope that competes very favorable against high end European scopes that cost 3-4 times as much. They also use their fiber optic technology to illuminate the scope in low light, ie early morning or dusk so you can take shots that you wouldn't be able to with a none illuminated scope. The 3-9x40 is going on my AR eventually.

Also don't forget to get a good mount, LaRue makes some of the best.

Not the first trijicon endorsement I've read. The rifle has a really solid scope mount system that has been on it 40+ years. I think it is called the Leopould style. I just need taller rings.

I took the cheapie scope out the back door this morning and it is amazing. I have yet to look through it at dawn though.

I will not use high power for shooting but for positive identification. When I was on the coyote campaign about twenty years ago I shot a dog. It was a really long shot that I was quite proud of only to find that it was a dog. It was very clearly not anyone's pet unless they had dumped it long before. A wild dog can do more damage than coyotes, so it probably wasn't a bad thing, but I really hated that I had shot a dog. I don't want to repeat that, but the odds of that happening again are quite slim since I don't think I can make long shots like that as I once could.

Pooka · #22 02-17-2013, 04:47 PM

Some scope buying advice for older folks.....

Being older than almost anyone else on Earth is not always as much fun as it sounds. One thing that suffers is your vision and your ability to see colors.

I have lost the ability to see some wavelengths of red, which is no big deal except that many scopes today have that point of light thing in them and it is always red. I just have to take someones word for it that there is a red dot inside the scope because it is invisible to me.

I have heard of scopes with green dots, but I have never tried one.

The point of this is: If you are of advanced age you may want to consider not going with a scope that depends on anything red lighting up inside of it since it is just a matter of time before you will wonder what is wrong with the scope. The answer will be the scope is just fine, but your eyeballs are getting worn out.

I guess I am lucky to have learned to shoot without a scope and I have never found one that was of any advantage to me. I also can't get the hang of that shooting a pistol while holding it with both hands thing, so I guess it all depends on what you learned when you were first starting out.

Air&Road · #23 02-17-2013, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pooka

Some scope buying advice for older folks.....

Being older than almost anyone else on Earth is not always as much fun as it sounds. One thing that suffers is your vision and your ability to see colors.

I have lost the ability to see some wavelengths of red, which is no big deal except that many scopes today have that point of light thing in them and it is always red. I just have to take someones word for it that there is a red dot inside the scope because it is invisible to me.

I have heard of scopes with green dots, but I have never tried one.

The point of this is: If you are of advanced age you may want to consider not going with a scope that depends on anything red lighting up inside of it since it is just a matter of time before you will wonder what is wrong with the scope. The answer will be the scope is just fine, but your eyeballs are getting worn out.

I guess I am lucky to have learned to shoot without a scope and I have never found one that was of any advantage to me. I also can't get the hang of that shooting a pistol while holding it with both hands thing, so I guess it all depends on what you learned when you were first starting out.

At this point I have no color problems at all, and didn't even know it was something that went away with age. The scope I bought has only red and I can see it fine. If the problem were to ever arise for me I can simply turn off the illiumination and use the normal crosshairs.

The more modern scopes I looked at yesterday could be switched to red or green. There was even at least one with blue.

There was a time that I was EXTREMELY proficient with iron sights. In the Army I qualified expert with the M14 and was able to take out the pop up human silhouette targets at 350 meters. I am still reasonably proficient with iron sights for my age. When I was waging the coyote war about 20 years ago, I had a chance opportunity with only my iron sight Marlin 30-30 at hand and bagged the coyote at about 100 yards. Part luck, seeing it in the first place, but I like to think that there was marksmanship involved with the shot.

I don't expect that I will get very many close shots at coyotes even calling them in, thus a scope will definitely give me better odds for success.

I love to plink with the ,22 companion to the 30-30, a model 39A. I think that keeps my iron sight shooting relatively proficient. IMHO shooting proficiency is one of those things that can go away badly without practice. I never fired a rifle with a scope until after I was out of the Army.

What is your effective range on something the size of a coyote and with what rifle?

t walgamuth · #24 02-17-2013, 05:33 PM

I'm not sure I could hit anything with iron sights anymore with my eyes. I cannot focus on both sights any more since one or the other is blurry.

t walgamuth · #25 02-17-2013, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jplinville

For the last 20 or so years, the gun shows I go to has a booth before the entrance to the show where weapons are checked for ammo, then cable tied in such a fashion that it wont fire. The weapons on display at the shows are also cable tied in the same way. If there's an accidental discharge, it's generally not inside the building, it's in the parking lot or at the booth near the entrance.

Dealers will generally cut the cable tie for you so you can check the action and such, but always put one back on after you are done inspecting the possible purchase.

My last show, I was made to drop my mag, prove the chamber was clear, and my personal carry weapon was tied back. I dropped my mag in my pocket, re-holstered my weapon, and enjoyed the show. Although I hate feeling naked like that, I saw the number of off duty officers moonlighting as security for the show, and felt a little more at ease.

A gun show is the last place I would expect a shooting to happen, accidental or otherwise. I'm sure there's statistics out there to prove it...just as many as the studies to disprove it. I won't bother locating any, because the point is moot.

Anyway, back to topic of scopes. What are you scoping, Larry? It's easy to drop as much on optics as the rifle is worth. Today's "cheap" optics are light years ahead of where they were 40 years ago. I'd stay away from lighted reticles right now, as the price is higher than it should be due to demand...everybody is wanting to outfit their new purchases, and there are plenty of them.

Your comment that all the accidental shootings at gun shows happen in the parking lot does not make me feel any safer at a gun show!

I stopped deer hunting because of all the doofus's in the woods blowing stray bullets everywhere and I wouldn't expect the gun shows to have a much higher level of patrons.

jplinville · #26 02-17-2013, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Your comment that all the accidental shootings at gun shows happen in the parking lot does not make me feel any safer at a gun show!

I stopped deer hunting because of all the doofus's in the woods blowing stray bullets everywhere and I wouldn't expect the gun shows to have a much higher level of patrons.

You probably have a higher chance of being shot at the range than you do at a gun show...Probably an even higher chance of dying in a car wreck on the way to the show instead of being shot at a show.

Grab a flashlight, a helmet, a bullet proof vest, and a book and hide in the closet in your basement...you may be safer there.

Skid Row Joe · #27 02-17-2013, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Your comment that all the accidental shootings at gun shows happen in the parking lot does not make me feel any safer at a gun show!

I stopped deer hunting because of all the doofus's in the woods blowing stray bullets everywhere and I wouldn't expect the gun shows to have a much higher level of patrons.

RE: Gun shows and personal safety.......

It honestly did not cross my mind before posting yesterday here, that it would be an argument one way or the other when I made my previous post yesterday.

To me, it wouldn't take a very high degree of reasoning OR common sense to realize that gun shows and their associated parking areas are a dangerous place to be because of the inordinate high degree/possibility of taking a round from accidental/careless discharge.

My alma mater military academy has an annual skeet shoot competition. I wouldn't be within a mile of that range if a competition were in progress. Am I too cautious? I don't think so. Just using my head.

Guns don't scare me - guns in other ppls' hands is what scares me........

Air&Road · #28 02-17-2013, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Your comment that all the accidental shootings at gun shows happen in the parking lot does not make me feel any safer at a gun show!

I stopped deer hunting because of all the doofus's in the woods blowing stray bullets everywhere and I wouldn't expect the gun shows to have a much higher level of patrons.

It's easy to understand why you gave up hunting in that environment. I gave it up years ago just because. I have a few hanging on the wall that I'm proud of so it was time to do something else.

It's different here though because we hunt on private land. I've had very little problem with trespassers and I know what is happening on this and surrounding places.

The reason I chimed in on your post though was to tell about something I read years ago, I think in "The Deer Hunters Bible". Wherever it was, they told a true story about a city boy that was hunting on public land where they had to come out through a checkpoint. When the city boy stopped and was asked if he had success he excitedly and proudly proclaimed that he had bagged a really nice deer. The warden asked to see it and the city boy, with a huge smile on his face threw back a canvas in his trailer and underneath was a mule.

Air&Road · #29 02-17-2013, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe

RE: Gun shows and personal safety.......

It honestly did not cross my mind before posting yesterday here, that it would be an argument one way or the other when I made my previous post yesterday.

To me, it wouldn't take a very high degree of reasoning OR common sense to realize that gun shows and their associated parking areas are a dangerous place to be because of the inordinate high degree/possibility of taking a round from accidental/careless discharge.

My alma mater military academy has an annual skeet shoot competition. I wouldn't be within a mile of that range if a competition were in progress. Am I too cautious? I don't think so. Just using my head.

Guns don't scare me - guns in other ppls' hands is what scares me........

So do they not have any rules and safety procedures at that tournament? The club I've shot at for about fifteen years has been in heavy operation since 1960 with no incidents whatever.

Air&Road · #30 02-17-2013, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jplinville

You probably have a higher chance of being shot at the range than you do at a gun show...Probably an even higher chance of dying in a car wreck on the way to the show instead of being shot at a show.

Grab a flashlight, a helmet, a bullet proof vest, and a book and hide in the closet in your basement...you may be safer there.

Yeah, it's really difficult to think of anywhere that someone could go and be safe. I consider the Dallas area streets and highways much more dangerous than our local skeet and trap club.