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  #1  
Old 06-10-2013, 10:29 PM
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AVGAS/Jet fuel prices.

Any fly boys tell me why airport fuel prices are over $6:20 a gallon ?...and how come?...and do international flights to Europe pay these prices?

ref: AirNav: Fuel Price Report


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  #2  
Old 06-10-2013, 10:38 PM
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Unlikely anything flying to Europe (short of some tiny airline flying cargo in a DC-6) will be using AVGAS. So they're paying closer to $3.80-$4.50 per gallon for jet fuel.

As to why: aviation fuel is a specialty product, and quality control has to be a lot higher than road fuel. Get some water in gasoline, and some cars stall out and need to have the fuel system drained. Water in aviation fuel might mean landing in an inconvenient (read, wet or rocky) spot. Plus it has to maintain its characteristics from 50 below to 100 above zero, maybe on the same flight.

Even with lower taxes, this adds up.
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  #3  
Old 06-10-2013, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spdrun View Post
.......................... and quality control has to be a lot higher than road fuel. Get some water in gasoline, and some cars stall out and need to have the fuel system drained. Water in aviation fuel might mean landing in an inconvenient (read, wet or rocky) spot. Plus it has to maintain its characteristics from 50 below to 100 above zero, maybe on the same flight. .............
Understood, but JET FUEL at OKC is over $5.50 a gallon.............some higher.

KOKC Will Rogers World Airport Oklahoma City, OK
AAR Aircraft Services-Oklahoma Phillips 66
FS $5.98
31-May
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Atlantic Aviation Avfuel
FS $6.49
10-Jun
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
KPWA
9 NNW Wiley Post Airport Oklahoma City, OK
VALAIR Aviation
Call for volume discounts Phillips 66
FS $6.20
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Atlantic Aviation = Avfuel
FS $6.21
10-Jun
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
KRCE
12 WNW Clarence E Page Municipal Airport Oklahoma City, OK
Mid-Continent Airmotive
FS $6.45
31-May
----------------------------------------------------------------------------


I always thought JET A was cheaper than AVGAS in the USA. I expected it high in the UK with road fuel around $8.00 a gallon ( volume to volume....ie: Imperial Gallon vs US Gallon. ) Paid $3:50.9 in Norman today for Regular.




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Old 06-10-2013, 11:14 PM
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This is why auto gas STC's are popular...
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  #5  
Old 06-11-2013, 12:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KarTek View Post
This is why auto gas STC's are popular...
I take it you mean Supplemental Type Certification. IE: Aircraft engine certified for automotive gasoline?

My buddy fuels his 1953 Taylor Craft with Premium instead of LL as the engine was built and certified for 91 octane road fuel a few years ago on it's overhaul..trouble with that was, last year we stalled on run up. Found no water in the glass and took off next run up okay.




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  #6  
Old 06-11-2013, 05:41 AM
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Unhappy So, ---- I guess maybe...

I need to tell my g/f to forget about buying that turbocharged BROOM she has been eyeing at the dealership..
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  #7  
Old 06-11-2013, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spdrun View Post
Unlikely anything flying to Europe (short of some tiny airline flying cargo in a DC-6) will be using AVGAS. So they're paying closer to $3.80-$4.50 per gallon for jet fuel.

As to why: aviation fuel is a specialty product, and quality control has to be a lot higher than road fuel. Get some water in gasoline, and some cars stall out and need to have the fuel system drained. Water in aviation fuel might mean landing in an inconvenient (read, wet or rocky) spot. Plus it has to maintain its characteristics from 50 below to 100 above zero, maybe on the same flight.

Even with lower taxes, this adds up.

That is only PART of the reason for high avgas prices. There is a hefty tax on it that is SUPPOSED to go to supporting GA. As a GA pilot, I'm hard pressed to see any of the "support" that I pay for.
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:29 AM
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Jet A in this area runs from $3.97 to $6.40. The inexpensive sources are self service. Taxi to the pump, feed it a credit/debit card and fill 'er up.

100LL Avgas ranges from $4.50 to $7.90.

These prices are off of my Foreflight App on my IPhone and are updated daily.
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  #9  
Old 06-11-2013, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Air&Road View Post
That is only PART of the reason for high avgas prices. There is a hefty tax on it that is SUPPOSED to go to supporting GA. As a GA pilot, I'm hard pressed to see any of the "support" that I pay for.
Isn't that just it? What, support is coming back to us? I've got my microscope out and I can't find any of it. Here's one thing I've got figured out: The oil gods and the insurance gods have got us by the balls.
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  #10  
Old 06-11-2013, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim B. View Post
I need to tell my g/f to forget about buying that turbocharged BROOM she has been eyeing at the dealership..
As long as she dosent need to kick start it !
You could always get her a magic carpet !
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  #11  
Old 06-11-2013, 11:05 AM
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And me, I'm flying in my taxi,
Taking tips, and getting stoned,
I go flying so high, when I'm stoned.
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Old 06-11-2013, 11:09 AM
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That was a great, GREAT song MTI!
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  #13  
Old 06-11-2013, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkveuro View Post
I take it you mean Supplemental Type Certification. IE: Aircraft engine certified for automotive gasoline?

My buddy fuels his 1953 Taylor Craft with Premium instead of LL as the engine was built and certified for 91 octane road fuel a few years ago on it's overhaul..trouble with that was, last year we stalled on run up. Found no water in the glass and took off next run up okay.

.
Not sure why mo-gas would cause it to stall unless it was really bad fuel. 91 should burn easier than 100. I know I always was taught to pull carb heat and run it back to low idle during the run up to make sure it won't stall. On a hot day, low idle and heat on, the thing will just barely run on the ground.
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  #14  
Old 06-12-2013, 09:42 PM
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Just a guess based on about 40 years of experience....

AvGas is refined to a very high standard. This adds costs.

AvGas is transported to a very high standard and some of it is lost to premium grade at the beginning and end of each batch when tanks are switched. It is called 'cut to protect' and the the tank cuts at the tank farms are always made to protect the quality of the superior product, which is anything air related.

Jet is always sent with a batch of diesel in front of it and in back of it. When it reaches the airport about 500 bbls of Jet is delivered to the diesel tank since it takes a lot of Jet to water down diesel and almost no diesel at all to turn a tank of Jet into a tank of weed killer.

The cost of the downgraded Jet or AvGas is figured into the retail price.

Delivery to Military bases is somewhat similar, but different in ways that they don't want providers to discuss. Let's just say they are 'stringent'.

At the moment there are three refineries offline in the midwest and this is impacting the price of all grades of fuel in this region. One is down for a scheduled repair job and two others went offline due to accidents. Since the trend in refinery construction for the last 40 years has been to expand and not build new then an accident at a refinery has the effect of taking three old style refineries offline.

But they should be back in a week or two, so maybe prices will inch down during the month of July.
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Old 06-12-2013, 10:07 PM
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A fellow who runs a local FBO told me that there is only one refinery in the USA still making Avgas and they don't make it year-round. The price fluctuates based on the availability of the stock from that one source.

Dunno if that's true.

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