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  #1  
Old 12-05-2013, 12:51 PM
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US 30 in PA ....

between Gettysburg and approximately York should be renamed the Tomas de Torquemada Highway. Who came up with the bright idea of having stretches of 3-lane highway miles long, but with the center lane reserved for left turns, no passing allowed? (!)

Yes, there are some 4-lane stretches, but if you're stuck behind a truck doing 30, you're S.O.L.

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Old 12-05-2013, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by spdrun View Post
between Gettysburg and approximately York should be renamed the Tomas de Torquemada Highway. Who came up with the bright idea of having stretches of 3-lane highway miles long, but with the center lane reserved for left turns, no passing allowed? (!)

Yes, there are some 4-lane stretches, but if you're stuck behind a truck doing 30, you're S.O.L.
Yep, I avoid that stretch if I can. The speed limit along that road is also something less than desirable.

From where I am, if I'm heading to York I'll take 27 up through Westminster, then back roads from Manchester, Maryland to Shrewsbury, Pennsylvania and then up on I-83.

I usually find an excuse not to travel between Gettysburg and York on that road.
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Old 12-05-2013, 04:48 PM
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Do you remember when PA had many 3 lane highways--with the center lane for "passing".? In reality, the center lane was for whoever got there first, and they just stayed there. That was a system devised for head-on collisions.
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Old 12-05-2013, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by MS Fowler View Post
Do you remember when PA had many 3 lane highways--with the center lane for "passing".? In reality, the center lane was for whoever got there first, and they just stayed there. That was a system devised for head-on collisions.
Most other places have the center lane alternate between sides, so you have one lane, then a double-yellow, then two lanes going the other way.

I've also seen a "reversible" center lane, with a "dotted" double-yellow on one side, but that's mostly in the West and northern New England. One side still has priority for use, but both sides are allowed to use it.
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Old 12-05-2013, 05:40 PM
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My Dad was born in Bucks County, PA and always referred to the third (middle) lane as the 'suicide' lane.

Jim
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Old 12-05-2013, 06:45 PM
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We had some like that near south bend. I believe it was the Lincoln highway. Dad always drove in the center lane until someone came from the other way in it.
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
We had some like that near south bend. I believe it was the Lincoln highway. Dad always drove in the center lane until someone came from the other way in it.
Two such people with strong wills makes quite a mess.
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Old 12-06-2013, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by spdrun View Post
between Gettysburg and approximately York should be renamed the Tomas de Torquemada Highway. Who came up with the bright idea of having stretches of 3-lane highway miles long, but with the center lane reserved for left turns, no passing allowed? (!)

Yes, there are some 4-lane stretches, but if you're stuck behind a truck doing 30, you're S.O.L.
Clearly you people hired Louisiana highway engineers to design the system.
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Old 12-06-2013, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by spdrun View Post
between Gettysburg and approximately York should be renamed the Tomas de Torquemada Highway. Who came up with the bright idea of having stretches of 3-lane highway miles long, but with the center lane reserved for left turns, no passing allowed? (!)

Yes, there are some 4-lane stretches, but if you're stuck behind a truck doing 30, you're S.O.L.
That was probably a high accident area if it does not have cloverleaf entrance and exits. I live in an area that has a four lane 55/mph speed limit that has a regular county road intersection approx. every mile. Driving on that road is like driving on the interstate without modern interchanges. In that area most of the accidents are caused when a car is waiting to make a left turn with the wheels already turned to the left. Then it is hit from behind pushing it into traffic coming from the opposite direction at 55+ MPH, many of which are fatal accidents. Could you imagine driving on an interstate in wet/slippery conditions and making a left turn from the left lane across oncoming traffic.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:21 AM
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That was probably a high accident area if it does not have cloverleaf entrance and exits. I live in an area that has a four lane 55/mph speed limit that has a regular county road intersection approx. every mile. Driving on that road is like driving on the interstate without modern interchanges. In that area most of the accidents are caused when a car is waiting to make a left turn with the wheels already turned to the left. Then it is hit from behind pushing it into traffic coming from the opposite direction at 55+ MPH, many of which are fatal accidents. Could you imagine driving on an interstate in wet/slippery conditions and making a left turn from the left lane across oncoming traffic.
4-lane 55 mph roads without modern interchanges are very common in Maryland, VA, and parts of NY state. What you're talking about isn't unusual in the least.
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Old 12-06-2013, 11:34 AM
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4-lane 55 mph roads without modern interchanges are very common in Maryland, VA, and parts of NY state. What you're talking about isn't unusual in the least.
I am sure it is fine in some areas, but there needs to be some areas that do provide for left turns when both sides of traffic are traveling at 55/MPH. the area I am describing is in the region of steel mills, with heavy truck traffic, in the snow belt. Also the toll roads are being avoided due to the cost shifting the traffic to these local four lane roads with no median dividing oncoming traffic. In these areas you can be the safest driver on earth and be the third or fourth vehicle involved in a major accident, not a fender bender. Another thing that i have noticed is the amount of these accidents that involve drivers that are 70 plus years of age. There are some of them that grew up in these areas and did not experience the traffic loads as we have them today.
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  #12  
Old 12-07-2013, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by spdrun View Post
between Gettysburg and approximately York should be renamed the Tomas de Torquemada Highway. Who came up with the bright idea of having stretches of 3-lane highway miles long, but with the center lane reserved for left turns, no passing allowed? (!)

Yes, there are some 4-lane stretches, but if you're stuck behind a truck doing 30, you're S.O.L.
Question: Is the middle lane marked for "left turn only"? If not, it looks like it can be used for passing vehicles moving in the same direction.


" 3309. Driving on roadways laned for traffic.

Whenever any roadway has been divided into two or more clearly marked lanes for traffic the following rules in addition to all others not inconsistent therewith shall apply:

(1) Driving within single lane.--A vehicle shall be driven as nearly as practicable entirely within a single lane and shall not be moved from the lane until the driver has first ascertained that the movement can be made with safety.

(2) Three lane roadways.--Upon a roadway which is divided into three lanes and provides for two-way movement of traffic, a vehicle shall not be driven in the center lane except when overtaking and passing another vehicle traveling in the same direction when the center lane is clear of traffic within a safe distance, or in preparation for making a left turn, or where the center lane is allocated exclusively to traffic moving in the same direction that the vehicle is proceeding and the allocation is designated by official traffic-control devices.

(3) Lanes limited to specific use.--Official traffic-control devices may be erected to restrict the use of specified lanes to specified classes or types of traffic or vehicles, including multioccupant vehicles or car pools, and drivers of vehicles shall obey the directions of every such device.

(4) Prohibitions against changing lanes.--Official traffic-control devices may be installed prohibiting the changing of lanes on a section of roadway and drivers of vehicles shall obey the directions of every such device.





Cross References. Section 3309 is referred to in sections 1603, 3326 of this title.



3310. Following too closely........................... "

Title 75 - PA General Assembly


Might want to print that & carry it in with you, if it is current law.
It's not the TPKE, but it's better than being delayed unnecessarily.
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  #13  
Old 12-07-2013, 11:22 AM
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Yes, there were signs marking it as a turn-only lane every half-mile or so.
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  #14  
Old 12-07-2013, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by spdrun View Post
Yes, there were signs marking it as a turn-only lane every half-mile or so.
Oh. Well, you're S.O.L. then. There's only so much they can do with the Lincoln Highway....
Pennsylvania Highways:* US 30
I've gone out that way a number of times on a motorcycle from Wilmington- trips to the HD plant in York. ( Harley used to have their museum located there before they moved it to Milwaukee in the late 90's ) They had a road improvement project between Lancaster & York back then. It was no place to be stuck in stop & go traffic on a hot July afternoon alongside an iron head Sportster, lemme tell ya.
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Old 12-07-2013, 04:36 PM
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Not sure of the highway number but was in Penn. About seven in the morning I was cruising along and observed two vehicles still in the centre lane smashed really bad.

There were no tow trucks or police present but the injured passengers seemed to be nowhere around. There had to be some carnage from the state of the vehicles.

It looked like two vehicle going in the opposite direction decided to use the cenre lane simultainiously. Anyways there was an old railway styled diner just past the accident site and what I observed made me feel like stopping there for at least a coffee.

Three customers in the place including me and this obviously was a busy place before the major interstates took most of the traffic off it. An old couple still running it and it had two railroad stye additions or wings. Could have sat 100-150 people in it's prime period..

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