Just a word of warning that VW techs don't know how to fix these things.

A friend of mine who drives ALOT of miles a year bought a new TDI sportwag last summer, and has already racked up 20k miles. During our last cold snap the car had stalling issues and eventually quit. Towed into the local dealer. First phone call they told him they were replacing the fuel pump... he assumed they meant delivery pump, but turned out to be the Injection pump. Made no sense to replace that.

When that didn't fix the problem, they had no idea how to proceed. A specialist flew in and told them to replace the motor, said there's some TSB about condensation building up in the intercooler and hydrolocking the engine. Once again, made zero sense.

2 months and he still does not have his car back. Can you imagine if this car was out of warranty? Cars are getting so complicated, techs don't know where to begin without plugging in and a step by step computerized process. Rather than repairing, they can only replace things and hope.

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1985 500SL Euro w/ AMG bits 130k
1984 300SD Turbodiesel 192k
1980 240D Stick China 188k
2001 CLK55 AMG 101k
2007 S600 Biturbo 149k Overheated Project, IT'S ALIVE!!!

Lemons exist, VW has known issues with their high-pressure fuel pumps. BTW - I remember that my family had a similar experience with an Olds wagon some time in the 80s, nothing new here.

Normally their factory representative would be very competent. Something strange here. Usually at least one mechanic at a dealership is up to speed as well.

Intermittent stalling might be really hard to locate though as whatever causes it has to be present only when the stalling occurs usually.

Several years ago our son in law purchased a new ford car. It would randomly stall out usually at the worse of times.

Ford spent considerable time and money on that one without locating it. Problem was solved when the car burnt because of the ignition switch problem. It had not been recalled yet for it and I suspected it may have even been the source of the intermittent stalling as well.

Intermittent problems are the worst. I had a coolant leak that took months to locate because it only leaked once in a while. Turned out it was a loose hose clamp.

That dealer story does sound a bit odd, but as long as it's under warranty and a loaner is provided, they can mess about all they want.

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Whoever said there's nothing more expensive than a cheap Mercedes never had a cheap Jaguar.

83 300D Turbo with manual conversion, early W126 vented front rotors and H4 headlights 400,xxx miles
08 Suzuki GSX-R600 M4 Slip-on 22,xxx miles
88 Jaguar XJS V12 94,xxx miles. Work in progress.

It was intermittent, then permanent. Had to be towed in.

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1985 500SL Euro w/ AMG bits 130k
1984 300SD Turbodiesel 192k
1980 240D Stick China 188k
2001 CLK55 AMG 101k
2007 S600 Biturbo 149k Overheated Project, IT'S ALIVE!!!

In Michigan that would be lemoned for sure.

Give all the technical data to the people who post on Diesel Discussion and offer $500 reward to the first person with the correct diagnosis.

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1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

After they replaced the engine I would look for a lemon law lawyer. If they are not competent to diagnose the problem they surely are not competent to replace the engine. That car will never be the same.

If they didn't check out the dealership before taking the car for repairs they probably won't hire a competent lawyer either but good luck anyway.

Probably better check for an arbitration agreement in the paperwork. Maybe call the insurance company. I would call VW and give them my feelings about the dealer.

I had VW techs diagnose a bad hub bearing as "tire rubbing the fender liner". There was no way the tire contacted the fender liner in any possible position of the steering and suspension.

They messed around until the warranty was up and finally admitted it was the wheel bearing and offered to replace it for the discounted price of something like $500.

I bought a $25 bearing from AutoZone and about an hour of my time to put it in...

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-Evan


Benz Fleet:
1968 UNIMOG 404.114
1998 E300
2008 E63


Non-Benz Fleet:
1992 Aerostar
1993 MR2
2000 F250

They are the only dealer in town... and have a terrible reputation when it comes to sales and service. Bob shopped around before buying one 300 miles away. Gave the local dealer a shot to match the price, they said it was impossible to match because it's under their supposed "cost". Said the same thing to me when I was shopping for a GTI a few years ago. They tried to sell me a car with 9,000 miles for only $1000 off sticker.

I had a 2012 GTI and dumped it after 6 months because I wasn't feeling it and already starting to show problems. Seats fraying, intermittent rattles, wheel finish and factory paint flaws. Went to the dealer to check on these issues, service manager said he would get with VW and get back to me. A-hole never returned my calls.

They also sold a used Jetta to a friend of mine who returned for odd noises right after purchase while still under the used car warranty. Told him they were normal and not to worry about them. Starter would drag on the flywheel until it finally crapped... this time out of the 30 day warranty and he paid out of pocket.

Same place has 1990s for Escorts and other crap they gave $500 for in trade with $4995 asking prices in hopes of hooking a sucker on a buy here pay here deal.

The owner does commercials and always seems a little sauced.

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1985 500SL Euro w/ AMG bits 130k
1984 300SD Turbodiesel 192k
1980 240D Stick China 188k
2001 CLK55 AMG 101k
2007 S600 Biturbo 149k Overheated Project, IT'S ALIVE!!!

In Canada I found customer service pathetic from the company itself. You have to have a strong dealer service and policy enabler or you may pretty well be up the creek without a paddle.

Phoning volkswagon about issues gets you little usually. They may not be the worse out there but are poor enough to take volkswagon off our list as a car supplier now. Their diesels are far too complex to be backed up as they are today. Some replacement part prices are also verging on the insane. Chrysler is another brand where you want to find a dealer with at least some integrity.

Volkswagen should have stuck to evolving the Beetle.....

VW cars aren't that bad... yes they have some faults but it's not loonie bin incomprehensible. The problem is the dealers are completely useless. The techs aren't encouraged to have any troubleshooting skills, they just throw parts as the problem until a fix sticks.

The intercooler icing / hydrolocking issue is a real bummer. Cars have been having that problem since they introduced that common rail motor in 2009, yet the only fix they have out now doesn't seem to be solving the problem.

See this thread: Mk6 Jetta: Hard Start / No Start - Intercooler icing discussion in here! - TDIClub Forums

Basically what happens is when it's cold out the moisture in the intake air from the low pressure EGR (which is taken after the Cat and DPF... think of the steam coming out of the exhaust on a cold day) condenses on the cold front mount intercooler and pools up. It freezes to the fins while you're moving, but when you stop the heat from the engine bay melts it and it pools in the bottom of the intercooler, and is then sucked into the motor upon startup. 1 oz of water is all it takes to hydrolock a TDI.

Good news is the Passat's air to water intercooler isn't affected by this... a major part of why we got a Passat over a JSW.

If VCDS wasn't available I don't think I would own a modern VW. The lack of a good scan tool is a major reason I didn't get a CDI Benz when we were looking at cars a year and a half ago. VW is approaching MB levels of repair costs though... the exhaust and turbo on a new CR car cost over $5500!

-J

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1991 350SDL. 230,000 miles (new motor @ 150,000). Blown head gasket

Tesla Model 3. 205,000 miles. Been to 48 states!
Past: A fleet of VW TDIs.... including a V10,a Dieselgate Passat, and 2 ECOdiesels.
2014 Cadillac ELR
2013 Fiat 500E.

You would think that a compression check, or oil pressure issue would need to be proven before complete engine replacement. I would hope that the dealership in question gets a once over from VW or VW has an on going problem.

nothing is impossible for a dealer.

A chrysler dealership told my friend he needed a new transmission on his 2005 6-speed manual wrangler.

Why he asks, well sir, because the gears are welded together and the tranny is blown.

This grave diagnosis was delivered after he drove the car across town to the dealership and dropped it off with his "blown" gearbox. Complaint was a clicking in reverse.

He argued, they replaced the gearbox under warranty, clicking noise was still there. Turned out it was the spider gears in the diff were slightly chipped.


Its a sad state of affairs that the direct sales representatives for enormous numbers of brand new cars from many different companies are totally incompetent as far as repair, but its the reality we live with. A dealer that can actually repair a dealer sold vehicle properly and diagnosis it with skill is rare.

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