2001 Chrysler Town and Country 3.8L no-start, no-run

[Mike D]

Anybody familiar with these P.O.S.'s? Got one which would randomly quit and now won't even crank.

Battery changed, terminals cleaned, grounds checked and cleaned, same for positive leads. All relays/fuses tested, checked for fraying of wires (Frick, there's a shyte storm of wires in this bastid!), hair pulled out, used pretty much all of my favorite curse words, sacrificed four or five ponds of skin scraped from my hands and forearms, unplugged, cleaned and dielectric applied to both the ECM and power bus connector, used both sets of keys, checked for loose frayed wiring under the dash, verified starter operation by jumping starter relay.

Turn key, lights on dash come on, self test cycles, radio operates, windows go up and down, power doors open and close, locks operate properly. Turn key to "start" position, dash lights stay on, radio and accessories go off (as normal for the start cycle), no "click", no nothing. Release key to "run" position, radio goes back on and accessories re-activate.

One thing I do note is formerly I had to depress the button on the key fob to activate the start system and I would hear a "click" of a relay or something activating. Now when I press the button I get nothing. Yes, yes, I've moved the gear selector into different positions.

I've got the big-assed Chrysler shop manual which is of absolutely zero help. The first step they have is to "connect the DRB III scanner" which appears to be a tool used only by Mopar.

Codes? No codes or at least none I can read with my $99 scanner. Wouldn't matter anyway since I replaced the battery and all the codes were cleared.

I don't want to just throw money at it. The computer is available for $300 plus the cost of getting it "flashed" to match my VIN, the "SKIM" (vehicle anti-theft device required for this POS) is available for $150 + flashing.

This is 17 year old van with 150+K miles on it and an iffy transmission. The wife uses it to transport the grand kid and I use it as a grocery getter. I doubt we put 50 miles a week on it.

I know the former owner and he was absolutely pedantic when it came to car care and record keeping.

So, anyway, anybody have any experience with the Chrysler/Jeep electronics nightmares?

[Zulfiqar]

I worked on a 98 caravan with a similar issue, the problem was a bad starter. The wiring goes from key to relay coil - the NSS controls the other side of the relay coil and also taps into the PCM (signalling the txn is in P/N)

The bridge side of the relay was powered from a large fuse in the fuse box. (cant recall the no.)

[jplinville]

Not that it may help or hinder your problem, but what you're describing is similiar to what I had with a 96 Neon...the problem there ended up being a cam sensor that the dealer screwed up when they replaced the head.

Sent from my SM-T820 using Tapatalk

[Mike D]

Originally Posted by Zulfiqar

I worked on a 98 caravan with a similar issue, the problem was a bad starter. The wiring goes from key to relay coil - the NSS controls the other side of the relay coil and also taps into the PCM (signalling the txn is in P/N)

The bridge side of the relay was powered from a large fuse in the fuse box. (cant recall the no.)

Thanks for the reply.

"verified starter operation by jumping starter relay. "

Thought about that but jumping the starter relay engages the starter just fine. Key on, jumper installed, starter cranks but no fire.

So, for some reason the relay/bus is not getting the signal.

Can't see why the starter not being engaged would randomly shut the engine down.

This one is being a real pisser. Trying to avoid having the van towed to the dealer just so's they can lie to me and charge me $600.00.

[Mike D]

Originally Posted by jplinville

Not that it may help or hinder your problem, but what you're describing is similiar to what I had with a 96 Neon...the problem there ended up being a cam sensor that the dealer screwed up when they replaced the head.

Sent from my SM-T820 using Tapatalk

Would the engine crank and not fire? I can't even get this bugger to crank.

[Zulfiqar]

Originally Posted by Mike D

Thanks for the reply.

"verified starter operation by jumping starter relay. "

Thought about that but jumping the starter relay engages the starter just fine. Key on, jumper installed, starter cranks but no fire.

So, for some reason the relay/bus is not getting the signal.

Can't see why the starter not being engaged would randomly shut the engine down.

This one is being a real pisser. Trying to avoid having the van towed to the dealer just so's they can lie to me and charge me $600.00.

by jumper you mean you jumped the load side of the relay, this confirms that the starter is good and the large fuse for it is good.

Test the other two points of the relay (the coil side) - one side of it is from key and one side is from NSS (which also splices into the PCM to tell it that the van is in P/N) - Considering that chrysler didnt change massively from 98 to 01

[Mike D]

I'll double check the relay socket for switched power and grounds. I'm pretty sure I verified the "no power supplied" condition but I've been checking so many things I might have overlooked it.

This shouldn't have any effect in regards to the stalling condition but who knows what the "engineers" at Chrysler contrived.

[Zulfiqar]

Originally Posted by Mike D

I'll double check the relay socket for switched power and grounds. I'm pretty sure I verified the "no power supplied" condition but I've been checking so many things I might have overlooked it.

This shouldn't have any effect in regards to the stalling condition but who knows what the "engineers" at Chrysler contrived.

The Auto Shutdown relay that Chrysler cars use are a right pain.

anything off the normal - BANG - ASD relay kicks - no power anywhere.

[Mike D]

Well, YOU'RE not filling me with confidence.

Dunno whether the start relay is supposed to go high, low or ground on the activation leg as I can't find squat regarding voltages in the fricking shop manual.

[P.C.]

It sounds as if the van is equipped with a remote starting system. Is it a factory system, or is it aftermarket? Does it also have an alarm system? If so, is it factory or aftermarket?

[Zulfiqar]

Originally Posted by Mike D

Well, YOU'RE not filling me with confidence.

Dunno whether the start relay is supposed to go high, low or ground on the activation leg as I can't find squat regarding voltages in the fricking shop manual.

The ASD relay is controlled on the switch side by the PCM, it supplies ground on or off. The load side of the relay powers up the injectors, coils and fuel pump.

If in any case the PCM doesnt see a crank sensor input or timing sync input (cam sensor) or extreme long crank to start, the PCM switches off the ASD relay and cuts power.

[Mike D]

Originally Posted by P.C.

It sounds as if the van is equipped with a remote starting system. Is it a factory system, or is it aftermarket? Does it also have an alarm system? If so, is it factory or aftermarket?

No remote start.

Alarm system unfortunately. The original Mopar setup and a dealer installed system.

The dealer system has been removed and the spliced wires repaired but the original is intact.

[Mike D]

Originally Posted by Zulfiqar

The ASD relay is controlled on the switch side by the PCM, it supplies ground on or off. The load side of the relay powers up the injectors, coils and fuel pump.

If in any case the PCM doesnt see a crank sensor input or timing sync input (cam sensor) or extreme long crank to start, the PCM switches off the ASD relay and cuts power.

Hmm, I might give jumping the ASD relay a go and try the starter bypass again. If I can get it running I can at least drive it to the dealer or find someone else who has the required scanner.

I did locate some schematics, sort of, they might throw some light on the problem.

[Mike D]

My signature line is looking more and more appealing right about now.

[Air&Road]

Is this vehicle new enough to have a CAN network? If so, look up the PIN numbers in the ALCL connector under the dash and check it. If the circuit is broken you will have a no start.