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  #16  
Old 06-15-2018, 10:51 AM
I miss my MBZ
 
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I would. its sedan-sized diesel (with a stick) - no one else sells those in the US.

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  #17  
Old 06-17-2018, 09:57 PM
BodhiBenz1987's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Angel View Post
I would. its sedan-sized diesel (with a stick) - no one else sells those in the US.
The Chevy Cruze sedan and hatch are both still available with a diesel and a stick. I just bought one of the sedans in April. Stick going away for 2019 (but diesel with auto staying), but can still be had for now.
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  #18  
Old 06-17-2018, 10:10 PM
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Jaguar has been offering a Diesel version of the XE for a couple of years.
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  #19  
Old 06-18-2018, 05:55 AM
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Audi CEO arrested on risk he may suppress evidence

Quote:
Munich prosecutors said that Audi Chief Executive Rupert Stadler was arrested on Monday because investigators saw the risk that he might seek to suppress evidence in connection with a diesel emissions probe.

"The suspect has been seen by a judge, who has ordered him to be remanded in custody," the prosecutors' office said in a statement.

The prosecutors' office last week widened its emissions cheating probe into Volkswagen's luxury brand Audi to include Stadler among the suspects accused of fraud and false advertising.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/18/audi-ceo-arrested-volkswagen-says.html
That's going to make marketing diesels to customers a bit awkward.
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  #20  
Old 06-18-2018, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grzpdlr View Post
Well in this case California AQMD said the road test NOX was 40 times the static test so it's pretty dirty.
I know there are a lot of people around here that just want to yell 'cheater, cheater, cheater' and fine VW out of business and I certainly don't condone what VW did but don't you think you need to get a little more info/background before your throw around the 40 times dirtier comment? Think maybe it might need some clarification?

I don't know what the 'static test' is and I'm not much up on the specific procedures used in EPA testing but the amount of pollution that's going out the tailpipe is directly proportional to the amount of throttle the user is requesting with their foot. On the face of it I don't find it at all remarkable that in some facets of operation a fully certified EPA car in the real world would emit 40X the amount of pollution that it did on a test stand. A car in steady-state cruise at 30MPH is going to emit a lot less crap than one run at wide open throttle up a hill for example.

I own two of the apparently 'cheating' Mercedes diesels, I have no idea if they are part of the 'cheating' scheme but I can tell you that from my perspective they seem to be pretty damn clean. These are the first Diesels I've ever owned that emit NO perceptible smoke even under extended full throttle applications at night and you never even smell the tell-tale diesel exhaust scent unless you get on your knees and stick your nose directly into the tailpipe. Seems to me like some people around here want to leave the impression that the 'cheating' diesels are rolling coal and emitting clouds of illegal smoke? Not true.

How much of the '40x' increase in apparent emissions is due to 'cheating' vs the parameters of operation when the on-the-road readings were taken?

Have the researchers tested a non-cheating car diesel car under the same circumstances to see if the pollution dropped to acceptable levels? Is here even a published EPA spec at the same conditions the readings were taken?

Have the researches done instrumented tests on gasoline powered cars under the same conditions to see how their emissions compare to test standards?

Seems like some of the questions I'd want to have answered before I started the 'cheating, cheating, cheating' mantra is I was interested in a fair presentation of the associated issues.
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  #21  
Old 06-18-2018, 01:13 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimFreeh View Post
I know there are a lot of people around here that just want to yell 'cheater, cheater, cheater' and fine VW out of business and I certainly don't condone what VW did but don't you think you need to get a little more info/background before your throw around the 40 times dirtier comment? Think maybe it might need some clarification?

I don't know what the 'static test' is and I'm not much up on the specific procedures used in EPA testing but the amount of pollution that's going out the tailpipe is directly proportional to the amount of throttle the user is requesting with their foot. On the face of it I don't find it at all remarkable that in some facets of operation a fully certified EPA car in the real world would emit 40X the amount of pollution that it did on a test stand. A car in steady-state cruise at 30MPH is going to emit a lot less crap than one run at wide open throttle up a hill for example.

I own two of the apparently 'cheating' Mercedes diesels, I have no idea if they are part of the 'cheating' scheme but I can tell you that from my perspective they seem to be pretty damn clean. These are the first Diesels I've ever owned that emit NO perceptible smoke even under extended full throttle applications at night and you never even smell the tell-tale diesel exhaust scent unless you get on your knees and stick your nose directly into the tailpipe. Seems to me like some people around here want to leave the impression that the 'cheating' diesels are rolling coal and emitting clouds of illegal smoke? Not true.

How much of the '40x' increase in apparent emissions is due to 'cheating' vs the parameters of operation when the on-the-road readings were taken?

Have the researchers tested a non-cheating car diesel car under the same circumstances to see if the pollution dropped to acceptable levels? Is here even a published EPA spec at the same conditions the readings were taken?

Have the researches done instrumented tests on gasoline powered cars under the same conditions to see how their emissions compare to test standards?

Seems like some of the questions I'd want to have answered before I started the 'cheating, cheating, cheating' mantra is I was interested in a fair presentation of the associated issues.
Yes, good post Tim.
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  #22  
Old 06-18-2018, 01:17 PM
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Their CEO just got arrested and the peanut gallery goes "cheating? What cheating? I don't see no cheating.
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  #23  
Old 06-18-2018, 05:02 PM
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Angry

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimFreeh View Post
I know there are a lot of people around here that just want to yell 'cheater, cheater, cheater' and fine VW out of business and I certainly don't condone what VW did but don't you think you need to get a little more info/background before your throw around the 40 times dirtier comment? Think maybe it might need some clarification?
I’m not sure what would prompt you to spend so much effort to flaunt ignorance. So let’s review what actually happened. A researcher at (of all places) U of West Virginia set out to prove that “clean Diesel” cars performed as advertised in the real world. As exhaust analyzer was rigged to fit in the trunk, and performance was measured under real road conditions. The surprise result was that NOx levels were 40x the EPA limit. The results were checked and rechecked by the University, CARB and the EPA. They considered the possibility that the EPA rolling road test was somehow flawed or miscalibrated. Eventually, they discovered that VW’s ECU microcode would only engage the pollution systems when the steering angle sensor and wheel speeds were consistent with a rolling road test. It was an outright fraud, even VW admitted it. This was all over the press as well as the tech journals, so go find a link and read.

As for the rest of your nonsense: NOx is odorless and colorless, you won’t see it, no matter how hard you look. The VW controversy triggered researchers to check other makes, which is how the Mercedes problem was found. The EPA will probably revise testing procedures after CARB does the hard work of developing new standards. All the relevant pollution limits are embedded in CARB or EPA rules, which are public record.
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  #24  
Old 06-19-2018, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by tjts1 View Post
Their CEO just got arrested and the peanut gallery goes "cheating? What cheating? I don't see no cheating.
Interesting position from a guy that has posted pictures and instructions on how to disable the EGR system in his E300D right here on the Peachparts forum.

You know what the EGR system is for right?

Are you heading down to the nearest jail to turn yourself in for doing EXACTLY what you're accusing the VW executives of doing?

You OK with posting contact information so that the EPA can get in touch with you about the penalties for disabling a pollution control device?
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  #25  
Old 06-19-2018, 07:08 PM
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One problem with the remaining elevated pollution from volkswagons. Is that it is a very bad chemical. I finally got around to dropping by a Canadian dealer today.

It takes them nine hours labor to get the cars acceptable. They are adding a fluid fed exhaust system. Plus reprogramming the computer to leave the emission equipment in operation.

So I asked the question if I purchased one can I get the computer unrestored to what it was leaving the new exhaust system operational.By an independent.

He asked why I would do this? I said for a longer term Vokswagon salesperson you should know. . The so called cheating was implemented because of the massive carbon buildup problems those engines were having. Volkswagon was seeing far too many warranty claims.

At the price you are asking for the reprogrammed and reworked ones. Will you in writing guarantee that the engine will not have major carbonizing problems?

Well we cannot do that he states. Typically with that company always hiding something. They had an assortment of them on their lot brought up to the new standards. !9k Canadian to 22K Canadian. Our dollar is worth about thirty cents less currently than the American dollar.
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  #26  
Old 06-19-2018, 10:18 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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Interesting.
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..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #27  
Old 06-20-2018, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimFreeh View Post
Interesting position from a guy that has posted pictures and instructions on how to disable the EGR system in his E300D right here on the Peachparts forum.

You know what the EGR system is for right?

Are you heading down to the nearest jail to turn yourself in for doing EXACTLY what you're accusing the VW executives of doing?

You OK with posting contact information so that the EPA can get in touch with you about the penalties for disabling a pollution control device?
LOL when all else fails resort to personal attacks.
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Last edited by tjts1; 06-20-2018 at 09:00 PM.
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  #28  
Old 07-25-2018, 11:32 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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Today I filed for a buy back. It says I'll be able to sell mine back for over 20K. I doubt it because I am not the original buyer, but filed and await the final paperwork.
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #29  
Old 07-29-2018, 08:15 PM
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The irony is that the pollution involved in the crushing, transport, and rework of all those cars, likely far outweighs any of the "excess" pollution they would have produced had they just been left to live out their lives on the road. The production of hundreds of thousands of cars to replace them will produce vastly more pollution.

Meanwhile there's an endless amount of cars out there that run horribly and pollute as much as 50 of those TDI's put together, and tons of states (like mine) that have no emissions rules or inspections of any sort.
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  #30  
Old 07-29-2018, 10:06 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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Yep.

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..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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