Flying (Piloting) - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

No Gas · #1 12-10-2002, 12:06 AM

Several folks on the "jobs" page started talking about flying. So I thought we should start a flying line so here goes.

Lets hear about it your Piloting stories,ratings, airplanes, ect.

I will start; I have an ATP/CFI and own a 47 Cessna 140 that I fly for fun. I gave up Flight Instructing as a sideline due to Tort fears. I would like to race Sailplanes when I retire. This would require selling my 140 though and I need to keep it as my girls want to learn to fly it.

Mark

The Warden · #2 12-10-2002, 12:45 AM

I've got 19 hours in PA-28-140 Cherokees. I was one lesson away from soloing when I ran out of $$.

I eventually want to fly commercial airliners for a living...gotta get through school first, though, eh?

cornrow · #3 12-10-2002, 01:00 AM

I'm very interested in learning how to fly. I was thinking about first buying a plane, probably an old Cessna 172 and then learning on that plane. Is that possible? I assume it would be cheaper if it is possible because I wouldn't have to pay for plane rental. Is there somewhere where I can find statistics about range, fuel economy, and operating costs for various planes? Any comments on my plan?

Thanks,

Ty

MikeTangas · #4 12-10-2002, 01:27 AM

Not a pilot, but plenty of "unofficial" stick time, fixed wing and one rotary outing.

My most memorable experience, 1981 I think. Took off from Houston Hobby in a Cessna 152 (??) for Houma, LA. Company VP owned the plane and was transporting myself and one other boat skipper to ferry back a couple rigs. No sooner had we left the runway and the controls were handed off to me. Flew almost to touchdown in Houma without a hitch, but turned down the experience of taking on a controlled crash (landing).

It's not that I didn't want to, it's because I was physically and mentally beat. It was my longest single period of stick time, but what wore me out was I flew through the leading edge of Hurricane Alicia. It was a lot of work to maintain altitude within 100 feet +/- with all the updrafts and downblasts. An experience I'll never forget.

dmorrison · #5 12-10-2002, 03:08 AM

I fly a little bit *G*

I'm a Captain for American Airlines.
I have ATP MEL/SEL DC-9 type.
Flight Engineer turbojet
CFII but I have let that expire.
I have around 16,500 hours, I don't keep a logbook anymore. The company does. If It gets to where I need to have log book for a job interview. There won't be any jobs out there for pilots. We furlough in reverse senority and I have 10,786 pilots below me at American.

Want to buy an airplane to learn how to fly

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/index.shtml

Looking here will give you an idea of cost.
I would suggest you rent the aircraft for your Private Pilots license. Puting $20-30,000 intoan aircraft tofind out you don't like it is pretty exoensive. Plus the 40-50 hours you fly while getting your Private license will allow you to make a more informed decision.
I have never owned an aircraft. My best friend is a United Captain and has owned 2. He is also building an aircraft. A RV8.

The saying in the airlne industry is that if it Fly's, Floats or ( I won't say) it's cheaper to rent.

The Warden
How do you plan on geting your flight experience?
Consider the Air Force Reserves or Air National guard. You can also do it by civilian flying. My son is doing it this way. His eyes won't let him fly in the military.

I was a Weather Officer in the Air Force then I went to Pilot training with the Air Force reserved and flew C-141's at Charleston AFB.

Dave

The Warden · #6 12-10-2002, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dmorrison
The Warden
How do you plan on geting your flight experience?
Consider the Air Force Reserves or Air National guard. You can also do it by civilian flying. My son is doing it this way. His eyes won't let him fly in the military.

I wish the USAF would let me fly. Unless they changed their policy in the last couple years, my eyes aren't good enough. I can (and have) pass a civilian medical exam with ease (with my glasses on, I'm almost 20/20; without 'em I'm about 20/200 I believe), but I don't think there's any way the USAF would take me...too bad in a way; I wouldn't mind flying C-5A's to get my hours up

Just wondering, what forms of civilian flying would you suggest? Lessons? Just scrambling the $$ to fly on your own? I love getting all the input I can...I know it's a long way to the top, but I can either fret over it or start working on it...although right now I'm just working on getting enough $$ to finish up getting my private license...I was sooo close when I ran out of $$ a few years ago

Also, Dave, I assume you have some form of college degree...if I may ask, in what, and how far did you go? I was told that it doesn't really matter to the airlines what your major was, as long as you've gotten at least as far as a Bachelor's...I decided to major in history as this would provide a back-up in case I wind up being unable to fly for some reason...but, again, it'd be nice to hear some more definiteive input, eh?

Thanks!

engatwork · #7 12-10-2002, 06:54 AM

When I was growing up my father purchased a 1973 Piper Cherokee Archer - PA-28-180. We took flying lessons together and I picked up my private rating at 18. I flew into Washington National and Hartsfield International in that plane in addition to trips up and down the eastern coast of Fla. I was fortunate enough to be able to take it off to college with me during the late 70's. It would impress the heck out of those gals when I would pick em up for a date in my BMW and ride out to the airport to go up in the plane. It was really neat during a full moon evening flight.
He finally sold it in the early 80's. I rarely fly nowadays - don't have time and don't have anywhere I had rather be

.

Ali Al-Chalabi · #8 12-10-2002, 09:50 AM

I am currently studying to be an airline pilot at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University. Learning to fly is a grat experience, I can not think of anything that I would rather do. And the fact that one day I will be getting paid to fly is just icing on the cake.

airfoill · #9 12-10-2002, 11:01 AM

Hello everybody,

I'm glad to know there are other pilots and those interested in flying visiting this website.

I received my private pilots license in 1986 and also have an instrument rating. I currently own a turbocharged Mooney M20F. I bought this plane back in 1992 and have had it since then. It's an extremely capable and fun airplane for cross country flights.

Currently I have about 1,200 hours...most of them in my Mooney. I've taken trips as far west as Las Vegas, Nevada and as far east as Key West, Florida.

Herb
'82 240D
'87 300SDL
'92 300D 2.5 Turbo

dmorrison · #10 12-10-2002, 12:29 PM

Flying/ your eyes and the military.
The Navy now allows either RK or PK. Check with a Navy flight surgeon for the details. The Air Force has relaxed their eye requirements. It use to be 20/20 until your 23 Bday then 20/70 correctable. Check to see what it is.
The services are really hurting for pilots so supply and demand kicks in and the standard lowers.
BUT the obligation after the 1 year of Pilot Training is 10 years in the Air Force. Thats a large chunk of your life.
If my son did qualify for AF UPT I would have him go Reserves or guard. Reserves are easier to get into.
Alas he cant. I got him his Private just prior to entering Oklahoma State University ( pilot program) . We had intended to get him his Private SEL/MEL and instrument rating before going to OSU. We were going to start his lessons Sept. 12, the day I was supposed to get home from my trip. Well of course everyone knows what happened. By the time general aviation was able to get back into the air. We were only able to get his Private. He is about 1/2 way to his Comm/Inst rating now. This summer he should get his CFI and Maybe his CFII. then next fall the CFIIME.
How can you get to the airlines?
You need to get to your Comm/Inst and CFI. At this point you can become an instructor. Then they are paying you. You will spend about $15,000-$20,000 to that point. the hardest part of your Comm/Inst is paying out all the money to get to the 190Hrs ( for part 141 training) or 250 hrs ( if under part 61). Up untill now you can't be paid for your flying, only share cost.
Once you have the CFI you instruct and try to get the CFII and CFIIME (CFI-instructor, CFII-Instrument instructor, CFIIME multi instrument instructor) This allows you to get bigger and better experience. Once you have enough experience you get with a corporate job or commuters. Then fly with them untill you can get with the Majors, If any are around an a couple of years!!!!!
I know the money seems like a lot . But in aviation, you either pay with cash or with years of your life

Let me know if I can be of assistance.

Dave

No Gas · #11 12-10-2002, 01:26 PM

Cash or years of your life, Dave well said!

I always recommend people not start untill they have most of the $$ needed. Then fly EVERY day untill you solo and at leat 2-3 times a week untill you take the check ride. Do all of the written stuff and take the written BEFORE you get into the airplane. Everyone likes the flying but none of us enjoy the studying. I have seen several people who have been students with 100 hrs and no written taken.

If you want to fly for a career you will need a 4 yr degree, just the way it is.

Kind of funny seems like most pilots who make it to the majors loose the "love" of flying and find other hobbys, like cars, boats, fixing up old houses ect. This is to bad, I understand though I am not much interested in riding around on a Fire Engine on my days off.

If you really want to be an airline pilot go for it I know many who have had great lives, if you are into something else flying your own small airplane on your days off can be a great way to go.

Hummmm well I must go drive my Benz to the airport and check on my 140, life is good.

dmorrison · #12 12-10-2002, 07:30 PM

You don't have to have a college degree to be an Airline Pilot. A good friend of ours who does not have a degree is an American Captain on the MD-80.

1st going to college does a couple of things. It shows that you have the ability to take on a task and complete it. A 4 year degree is a long process and it shows that you don't give up.

2nd the degree is there to possibly enhance your aviation skills. My meteorology degree was pursued so I would be better pilot. (I also have a 2 year degree in aviation technology (flying)) And I have found it invaluable. But only after 4 years of forecasting in the Air Force. Those 4 years of forcasting were not planned and actually not wanted. I wanted to be flying. It was part of the reduction in force after Vietnam.

3rd The college degree is there so when you can't fly you have a skill. Remember every 6 months I have to pass the FAA class 1 physical. If I don't pass it I am grounded at that moment possibly for life. So what will I do now? That is what your degree is for.

4th My recomendation is to get a degree in the buisness/finance area. We do earn a good salary and have the time off to either start and run your own buisness or invest. My son is getting a degree in Aviation Managment ( a business degree ) with a minor in finance. The finance minor will be concentrated in personal investing.

One additional item you need to know. DUI's If you have had 2 DUI's in your lifetime. You cannot hold a FAA medical. Now you can't EVER be a pilot. On any aircraft, not just with the airlines.
When My wife and I go out, If I have anything to drink she drives home or we take a cab.

The 2nd additional item. You will, at your choice, carry a gun while flying. This law was just passed and will be implimented soon. I know that the media has been going crazy about this. The laws allowing us to carry guns existed up untill 1989. The US Mail use to require that we carried one for years. Additionally the majority of the Airline Pilots are former military. We are trained and use to carry them on various missions.

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Yes it will save you money and quicken your ratings if you save the money prior to starting your training for you Private license.
The Private is usually about $4000.00
The Commercial/Instrument is an additional $15,000
I include the Instrument with the Commercial. A commercial with out an instrument is worthless. Your very limited in what you can do. But you can get the Instrument as soon as you complete your Private license. I feel this is safe move on any pilots part. Weather can really get you in trouble and this way you have the skills to fly safe. Can you fly from coast to coast without it. Yesbut the weather will control you and your ability to fly. Weather will always have the upper hand on us but the Instrument ticket helps keep you alive.
The Multi engine rating $2000.00
The CFI $2000.00
The CFII $ $1200.00
The CFIIME $3000.00

now all of these numbers are ballpark. You don'have to spend all this money right now. To get paid for flying you have to have the Comm/Instrument But due to insurance requirements your not really marketable. So the best thing to do is get the CFI and start instructing. Sometimes a school you are working for will help you get the other ratings.
The last rating you can get is the ATP (airline transport pilot)
You have to have 1500hrs total, be 23 years old and take a check ride.
All of these rating have a written exam and an oral exam which is given with your flight check ride.

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We don't loose our love for flying. Are there days I don't want to go fly, sure. Usually when its a beautiful day. I would rather be home with my wife driving the SL with the top down. If its cloudy sure I'll fly. In some ways its easier for us. No VFR traffic and shooting instrument approaches is easy in the large jets. Now thunderstorms, I'd rather not. Fog, real fog 1/16-1/8th mile visibility, I'd rather not. Ice, Snow again I'd rather not. But we can handle all of these. We have radar, anti ice , CatIII approach minimums. But it makes a work day just a lot harder.
I still enjoy flying the aircraft, but sometimes the job can be a hassle. Were a very large organization (American) and things don't always go the way I want them to, which is life.
As you said you don't want to ride on the Fire Engine on your days off, you get enough while your at work.

Dave

Don HO · #13 12-10-2002, 07:47 PM

I have about 30 hours on a C-152 II

I went solo after 15 hours.

My dad has a Yak 52 and is a Capt. on 747-400

Gilly · #14 12-10-2002, 08:45 PM

I got my private back in 85, but I haven't been up since the early 90's. Don't know if I'll ever get back into it again.
I have about 200 hours or so, mostly in PA28's, but some C-152 and 172 time that I got cheap by joining CAP.
I flew into Meigs Field in Chicago once, that was fun, did a pretty good job I thought. Hardest was trying to listen to your call number on the radio, they were like auctioneers on that radio! Geez!
I was trying to get my IFR rating for awhile. My instructor and I flew a couple times to this airport like in the Northwest suburbs of Chicago, can't remember the name of the airport now. Same thing= try to write down your IFR clearance instructions with these controllers they have there--they were already giving the next guy his clearance before i could even say "HUH?". That plus I really hated "hood"work. Didn't toss my cookies or anything, unusual attitudes and all that I did correctly, but try being a low-time pilot on a nice summer (hot) day and do am IFR cross-country---no fun at all. I did get in to some actual conditions, including a trip with my instructor in actual IFR at night, I did like doing that. When it was "for real" I did pretty good.
Only real "close call" i had is when I was out sight-seeing one afternoon in a rented Warrior and the throttle cable came unhooked--THAT was interesting.
After I got my license I took up a part-time job at the airport (4 Lakes Aviation then, now Wisconsin Aviation at MSN) so I got to fly at a discount. Cold thankless job though in the winter, working the flightline, refuelling, hangaring, filling fuel trucks, tieing down the spam cans.

Gilly

intruder · #15 12-10-2002, 10:07 PM

No Gas,

I've about 3500 hours Total Time. Mostly miltary and only about 1000 as the pilot in Command. The rest was having the time of my life in the right seat of an A-6 blowing things up and getting the @#$% scared out of me!

If you don't know what you goals are, I would discourage you from buying a plane. They can be a real money pit unless you go in with a partner, at least initially.

BTW, dmorrison, I think the RK/PK procedures are still not authorized for carrier based aviators; and where would the fun in that be!

I do heartily ditto the obtaining of a degree first. You NEVER know what course life will take. I hate to be philisophical, but I can't count the number of 'sticks' I flew with who gave up the flying for family or had some accident that prevented them from flying. Stuff happens!

One thing flying an old bird like the A-6 taught me was to ALWAYS have a backup plan. Always have something to fall back on... like a (usefull) college degree.

Good luck,

Intruder