Another issue to consider, depending where you live, is whether or not there are capable repair/maintenance facilities. As indicated in the earlier posts, by and large the 12s are not typically more of a problem to own and run than the 8s, BUT if you do have an issue that is either electrical or electronic, related to the engine systems, there are fewer mechanics/techs that have experience working on the 12s. The issue that I just had with my SEL (hopefully resolved) brings to light how the interaction between the 2 engine management systems can make you crazy trying to solve it, especially if it is intermittent like mine was.

Would I buy another Benz V-12 ? In a heartbeat.

However, I do know and acknowledge the fact that I am accepting a certain amount of risk with that purchase, as well as the potential for a considerable amount of frustration.

Once you drive a properly running v-12 for an extended period of time, you get hooked, its tough to step away.

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Mithra

93 sl600
93 600sel

A mercedes is an inanimate object and therefore must respond to logic and reason.

I'll add a few cents to the commentary so far:

1. Expensive to buy
2. Expensive to maintain - 12 quarts of oil, I believe
3. Expensive to repair

That's the short of it......read on, if you choose to.....

I've had the pleasure of driving and riding in a very well maintained '94 S600 with low mileage (less than 60K). The car is beautiful, fast and exclusive (only 213 made that year for the U.S.). 389hp and 402 ft.-lbs. torque! This monster is the epitome of a luxury highway cruiser...in total comfort, style and safety.

The gentleman that owns this particular example is a close friend and happens to be an MB Master Tech. Even at Wal-Mart, Mobil 1 is $4+ bucks a quart for starters. Many parts are unique to the 600 and this W140 behemoth is VERY sophisticated (Read-TONS of gadgets). Electronic this, leather that.....the list is endless and parts for repair are expensive (even at below wholesale prices). Heck, there are dual vanity mirrors for the REAR seat passengers But, his labor cost is $0. Window regulators go bad (heavy, double-pane glass)....a/c is a very expensive fix. Closing assist in another one....yikes!

In terms of repair (on the engine), so far this example has proven to be very stout. However, the wiring harness needed replacement...wait there are TWO of these (at $2K a pop). So far, the following parts haven't needed replacement, but there are TWO engine management computers ($2K each), TWO fuel computers ($2K each), TWO ignition computers ($2K each), a high-torque starter.....FOUR catalytic converters....TWO air mass sensors....

You get the idea BIG $$$$ - if you are paying retail for parts AND service.

I think the reason for the high depreciation is because:

1. They cost over $130,000 new.....even a small percentage equals big dollars....a 10% hit is $13 grand (the price of a Corolla in '94).....you'd probably take a bigger hit just driving off the lot. His '94 is now over 9 years old. Most 9 year-old MB's maintain about 30% or less of their value....translation: An $80,000 hit, not counting taxes, if purchased new.

2. They are sophisticated and are expensive to maintain. Many parts are unique or have multiples (as shown in the example above) and there is no such thing as going "aftermarket" for most of these parts. Replacements must be obtained from a dealer at dealer prices.

3. As a result of all that is described above, most potential buyers are reluctant to purchase one of these that is out of warranty at 6, 8 or 10 years old.

Remember, we are talking about MB's flagship car.....in 1994, you could do no better than a 600 at the MB dealer. You still can't

(Maybach excepted)

Good points, El P.

It's interesting to note that the reason that there are two of everything on the V12's is that the V12's have been described as having two M104 engines joined at the hip.

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Paul S.

2001 E430, Bourdeaux Red, Oyster interior.
79,200 miles.

1973 280SE 4.5, 170,000 miles. 568 Signal Red, Black MB Tex. "The Red Baron".

That's pretty much my understanding as well....a true marvel of engineering. I watched my buddy change the oil on this car this past Saturday. The filter is in a difficult spot (it's very tight under the hood)....you have to remove two air sensor housings (air mass??)...and be careful with them too. If dropped or jarred, they can be damaged easily and cost $1K each....that would be MY luck...a DIY oil change that ended up costing me $2K plus the oil change cause I screwed something up.

The 600 is a car that you better know what the heck you're doing if you plan on any DIY jobs

The classic Jaguar problems [particularly pre-'86 and for the '88 - '94 cars] were, as G-Benz mentions, not with the engines but rather with the electronics and "subsidiary" systems, esp anything electrical -- the engines and drivetrains were quite good as was the suspension (tho expensive to keep in top condition as the famous Jaguar ride is based on rubber bushings which, while inexpensive in themselves, wear quickly given the weight of the car, are difficult to get to and renew, with correspondingly high labor costs).

The Series III engine used in the XJ cars through '87 (4.2L I-6) was derived from the old cast iron Jaguar racing engines of the '40s and very dependable (tho some of the later-added sensors and other electronics could be troublesome) -- one issue with Jaguar is that until Ford took over, R&D was neglected for many years and older technology continued to be used (falling behind its competitors) -- the cars sold on style, cachet and a lithe, fluid ride.

But as far as evaporator problems go, I don't think that Jaguar was ever in a league with the pre-'97 140s!

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'98 C43 AMG
'88 420SEL
'93 190E Limited Edition (including factory Sportline package)

Jaguar V-12's need care and feeding like every other "exotic" type of car. The tight engine bays make for a hot place that dries out hoses and such, so you need to stay on top of the maintenace of the car.

The "wallet busting" nature of the Jag came from it's incredibly high depreciation, as people were scared to take on a used Jag. This V-12 "stigma" was helped along by the poorly made 750iL, and has effected the prices of MB V-12's, but they're still expensive used cars. Unlike a BMW, the V-12 carries a premium in the used market.

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John Shellenberg
1998 C230 "Black Betty" 240K

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