Rap music - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

gemoore · #1 04-18-2004, 09:05 PM

I'm curious. Are my wife and I the only people in the world who hate rap "music"?

I've just e-mailed Coors and told them I'm switching brands because of their new rap "music" radio commercial. I've heard it once too often.

My wife and I like to listen to the "oldies," and we can't help but note the difference in lyrics.

Does music reflect societal values, or do societal values reflect the music? I don't know, but I suspect something is seriously amiss today, and I think the current "music" is a symptom.

Any thoughts out there?

P.S. Last Thursday, our little community, population 70,000, had a "first." An officer, married and with three little kids, was shot and killed in the line of duty. The suspect is a 21-year-old Hispanic gang member. He hasn't been caught, and my guess is that he's in Mexico by now. (If so, that will be the end of it; Mexico doesn't extradite people who are charged with crimes that could lead to life in prison or death.)

Could the shooter have been inspired by the lyrics of some rap "music"? I think it's a possibility, and I'd be interested in what you think.

wbain5280 · #2 04-18-2004, 09:16 PM

NO, it's just plain offensive.

Kuan · #3 04-18-2004, 09:18 PM

Now there's a contradiction in terms. Rap music. Actually I kinda used to like rap, like Dylan's Subterranean Homesick Blues

Would that qualify as the world's first rap "song?"

No offense meant to those who like rap. I don't see the "art" in it.

Seriously though, gangbangers have been killing people long before rap. Hell Johnny Cash was singing about Cocaine blues and shootin' his woman probably before I was born.

AustinsCE · #4 04-18-2004, 09:43 PM

I'll bet just about everyone on this site hates rap. Related to that, isnt it funny watching all the dumb illiterate morons on Bill O'Reilly trying to argue in favor of rap all the time? Cracks me up.
Perosnally, I think its just a bunch of idiots who couldnt perform any real task for an occupation, couldnt play sports and had no education or intent to pursue it, so rapping is a sure way to get on the radio. If it were up to me anyone associated with the creation of rap music would be dragged into the street and run over by Cadillacs on 24s.....

SHYNE · #5 04-18-2004, 09:44 PM

I don't think Rap music requires much skill.

It seems to be a bunch of folks stringing words together in a "verse" all the while trying to pass it off as "whitty"....

It doesn't take much to throw a few street names, a few brand names into a "song" and then talk about beating someone up or killing them or saying they are a chump or my Escalade has a bigger more gawdy rim and tire package and the like....

The worst part of it is many have earned a lot of money for this "music"....

-Mike McKinney

chazola · #6 04-18-2004, 09:48 PM

Like all genres, there's good and bad in rap/hip hop music. I myself am a fan of 'old skool' rap, where the emphasis was on skill of rhyming (and no-matter how much you hate rap, it takes a lot of skill to do it well) not seeing how many times you could say ***** or motherf***er per line. Modern rap/hip hop on the whole has become stale and dull.
Rap/hip hop culture has become the one of the most popular music types amongst teens/young people, no matter what colour they are, so that is used by advertisers to appeal to that audience.
Blaming rap music for violence is just like blaming marylin manson for the columbine shootings- it's an easy scapegoat and diverts attention away from the real reasons- bad parenting, goverment etc.
Sure, a lot of rap glamourises violent culture, and for some artists this is the life they know. Others just 'play' at it, and for kids it's exciting. Still, I don't think this causes crime, kids may think it's cool but their immediate environment is more likely to sow the seeds of bad behavior, not music. I think violent computer games are worse and no-one seems to really complain about those.
For me, theres nothing worse than being made to listen to country music, but it's still on some ads.

btw, switching from Coors is probably a good thing

mikemover · #7 04-18-2004, 10:02 PM

I think a lot of rap is garbage, but then again, MOST country music is garbage, and I think much of what passes for rock music is crap now as well....

However, there are always exceptions. There is some quality hip-hop that I enjoy, there are a handful of older country artists that are not completely annoying, and there's even a decent rock song on the radio from time to time.

People tend to write about what they know, whether it's songs, books, poems, whatever....

So the "art" is a reflection of culture, lifestyle, and environment....not the other way around.

Mike

Kuan · #8 04-18-2004, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mikemover
MOST country music is garbage

Not Johnny Cash though... right? Don't be saying anything bad about Johnny Cash.

chazola · #9 04-18-2004, 10:25 PM

Cash- that's one country artist I DO like...

... and 'Witchita Lineman' by Glen Campbell

no twangy guitar!

The Warden · #10 04-18-2004, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mikemover
I think a lot of rap is garbage, but then again, MOST country music is garbage, and I think much of what passes for rock music is crap now as well....

Replace "lot of" and "MOST" with "ALL" and you've got it right.

Disclaimer: When I say that about country, I'm referring to the new garbage that's been around since the '80's or so...older stuff (Jerry Reed, Johnny Cash, etc) is okay.

Rap is crap

I also agree with Mike on modern rock (isn't it called "alternative" or "heavy metal" {depending on how heavy it is} these days) Most of the music I listen to was written before I was born...

MTI · #11 04-18-2004, 11:18 PM

Every generation has its critics and parents yelling "Turn off that crap!" I guess some of us are just too old to "get it." Just imagine what the kids of rappers will be listening to that will drive their parents nuts . . . the return of Pat Boone?

gemoore · #12 04-19-2004, 12:35 AM

Interesting comments.

Did anybody happen to catch the following in the NYT "Arts" section today:

The Woozy, Syrupy Sound of Codeine Rap
By KELEFA SANNEH

Published: April 18, 2004

LIKE lots of great musical stories, this one wouldn't be the same without drugs. In this case, the drug is prescription-strength cough syrup, the kind that contains codeine, and it has long been the intoxicant of choice in Houston's hip-hop community. They call it syrup, or "lean," although someone forgot to tell the sponsors of a local weight-loss program called Get Lean Houston.

Sipping syrup makes you woozy (or so they say), and the city developed a woozy hip-hop subgenre to match its favorite narcotic: in the 1990's, a local mogul named DJ Screw pioneered the "screwed-up" remix, making songs more syrup-friendly by slowing them down. An overdose killed DJ Screw in 2000, but his unlikely hip-hop revolution lives on. Universal Records releases official "chopped and screwed" versions of all its Southern hip-hop CD's, decelerated by DJ Screw's heir apparent, Michael Watts. And in Houston, unlicensed screwed-up mixtapes are still wildly popular.

Now it looks as if this psychedelic scene has produced a mainstream hip-hop star: a charming (and, of course, lackadaisical) rapper named Lil' Flip, a 23-year-old veteran who got his start rhyming on DJ Screw's tapes. Flip doesn't rhyme much about syrup anymore, but his sluggish delivery reflects his mentor's approach — he seems to see the world in slow motion. And last week his new double-CD, "U Gotta Feel Me" (Sucka Free/Columbia), made its debut at No. 4 on the Billboard album chart, below Janet Jackson's latest, but above the new albums by Aerosmith and Eric Clapton.

Critics sometimes complain that hip-hop is stuck in a sex-and-crime-and-violence rut, which is a bit like complaining that R & B is stuck in a love rut. Lil' Flip's career is yet more proof that this complaint is beside the point: you can be a great rapper even if you don't have anything in particular to say. His rambling rhymes are often merely excuses to show off his intonation and his flow, and he loves to defuse a violent threat by adding a throwaway joke: "One time for all my gangstas, two bullets for them wankstas/ I made a lot of y'all careers, and y'all ain't tell me, `Thank ya.' " Like the first-generation rappers of the late 1970's, whose job was merely to keep talking while the D.J. played records, Lil' Flip often sounds as if he could go for hours — and one presumes he'll never be interrupted by a coughing fit.

In 2000, Lil' Flip released his first solo album, "The Leprechaun," a heavy-lidded opus disguised as a box of Lucky Charms, complete with the star in a shiny green suit and matching hat. The CD began with Lil' Flip being crowned "Freestyle King," an award of his own invention (his slurry acceptance speech begins, "I'm Lil' Flip, I deserve it, y'all know me . . ."), and it included the hit "I Can Do Dat," which spawned one of his many appealing (and slightly idiotic) catchphrases. And yes, the song sounded even better slowed down.

His Columbia Records debut, "Undaground Legend," was released in 2002, and it eventually sold more than a million copies, thanks in part to "The Way We Ball," a brilliant single that sounded like the theme song to a pharmaceutically enhanced children's show. A chorus of kids sang along to the impish beat while Lil' Flip delivered a series of glassy-eyed, free-associative boasts: "I'm still sipping lean, I'm still watching `Scream'/ I love wearing platinum, but my favorite color's green," he rhymed — maybe he wasn't making it up as he went along, but it certainly sounded as if he was.

It's been clear for years that Lil' Flip is capable of creating a classic hip-hop album, and it's clear now that "U Gotta Feel Me" isn't it. In fact, it's not really an album at all — it's a mixtape. That's why he's holding an old-fashioned ghetto blaster on the cover, that's why each disc is about 45 minutes long (the album would fit snugly on a 90-minute cassette) and that's why most of the best songs are tucked away in the middle, instead of stacked up near the beginning.

But it's a great mixtape, stuffed with gimmicks and surprises that pull you back in just when your attention starts to wane. There are weird, memorable guest verses from David Banner, Cam'ron, Grafh, Killer Mike and others. "Game Over (Flip)" has a Pac Man-inspired beat and a one-word party chant: "Flip! Flip! Flip! Flip!" On "Ain't No Party," Flip picks up the tempo, bragging about having a watch so bright "You can't tell the time/ But you can tell I grind." And the second disc includes a couple of screwed tracks, including a bewildering remix of "Dem Boyz" (which appears on the first disc) where even the strings and conga drums seem to have been dipped in syrup.

To listen to Lil' Flip is to remember what hip-hop really needs these days: not a savior or a return to its roots or (please, no!) an attack of high-mindedness. No, what hip-hop really needs is a Harry Smith: someone to travel all over the country (especially the Southern states), collecting the underground albums and unlicensed vinyl singles and gray-market mixtapes that might otherwise disappear forever. Listeners looking to catch up on Lil' Flip's career should seek out "Houston We Have a Problem" (www.djsmallz.com), a greatest-hits mixtape, and "Lil' Flip Presents Clover G's" (Holla), on which Flip rhymes over beats from songs by Monica, Chingy, Jay-Z and others.

There's more where that came from, of course, but even Flip himself probably doesn't own all the mixtapes he has appeared on. "U Gotta Feel Me" is impressive, then, but it's not definitive — it's just another appealing mixtape in a career full of them. This one also happens to be a Top 10 CD, and DJ Screw would no doubt be pleased to see that his slow and unsteady style lives on. But let's hope that Lil' Flip doesn't spend too much time gloating about the success of his latest mixtape — let's hope he's already working on the next one.

The Warden · #13 04-19-2004, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MTI
Every generation has its critics and parents yelling "Turn off that crap!" I guess some of us are just too old to "get it." Just imagine what the kids of rappers will be listening to that will drive their parents nuts . . . the return of Pat Boone?

For the record, I'm 23, and have had this attitude about rap, modern rock, etc since I was 12...

My comments still stand

jpb5151 · #14 04-19-2004, 09:18 AM

I'm not really into rap either. That stuff can't hold a candle to the classic music of Slayer, Fear Factory and perhaps the first couple albums from Testament. That's when music was GOOD.

mikemover · #15 04-19-2004, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MapleLeaf
Come on, that's priceless! You guys know nothing about rap music. It's an acquired taste.

I know nothing about rap?

I was IN a rap group for the first two years I lived in Atlanta. Urban Grind. We recorded one album, with some production and performance by DJ Hurricane (original DJ from the Beastie Boys), and had a pretty good regional following there for a while. We were a hip-hop/rock/funk group, with elements of groups like Outkast (also from Atlanta--we were doing their "thing" before they were, actually), Fishbone, Beastie Boys, Run DMC, Rage Against the Machine, Parliament Funkadelic, James Brown, etc.

I enjoyed it greatly, and I still think we were a great band.

And I STILL say that most rap today sucks.

90% of it, especially the stuff that makes it onto the radio and/or MTV is all "bling, bling" and no substance. The best stuff never gets heard by the masses.

Mike

PS Yes, Kuan....Johnny Cash rules. He's not country. He is his own genre!