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  #1  
Old 12-11-2005, 08:46 PM
Ra_ Ra_ is offline
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How many cars can you sell, per year?

I think that many States regulate how many cars an individual
is permitted to sell in any given year?

I tried to Google it... but couldn't find much info.

Does anyone happen to know the regulations regarding this, for Florida?


Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 12-11-2005, 09:05 PM
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Georgia is 5 different cars within a 12 month period.
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  #3  
Old 12-11-2005, 09:14 PM
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Wisconsin is the same. I know, because I unfortunately work at the DMV.

"Any person or business that sells more than five vehicles per year must have a dealer license issued by the Wisconsin Department of Transportation."
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Old 12-11-2005, 09:19 PM
Ra_ Ra_ is offline
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Thanks. I wonder if it's the same in Florida?

Has anyone ever sold a car without transferring it into your name first?
Registration fees are getting pretty steep down here.

When I lived in New York, I had to drive 20+ miles to the Department of Motor Vehicles
and wait in line for about 3 hours.
Now, it's about a mile away and the most people I've ever seen there are 4...
and they still have 2 or 3 people servicing you!
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  #5  
Old 12-11-2005, 09:19 PM
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Just found this for you Ra:

In Florida, motor vehicle dealers are licensed and regulated by the Division of Motor Vehicles under Section 320.27 Florida Statutes.

The Law

Florida law states that any person, firm partnership, or corporation that buys, sells, offers for sale, displays for sale or deals in three or more motor vehicles in any 12-month period is presumed to be a motor vehicle dealer and must have an appropriate license issued by the State.

License Types

There are four classes of licenses issued to motor vehicle dealers. They are:

Independent Dealer--for a person dealing in used motor vehicles only. This license permits the licensee to transact business at retail or wholesale.

Franchise Dealer--allows the licensee to sell new motor vehicles under an agreement with a manufacturer. This license also permits the licensee to sell used motor vehicles.

Wholesale Dealer--licensees may only buy from, sell to, and deal at wholesale with other licensed dealers.

Auctions--are licensed to sell, on behalf of licensed dealers, through the bid process. Auctions may not sell retail.
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Old 12-11-2005, 09:31 PM
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1badav what is involved (in your state anyway) in obtaining a permit for dealing in used cars - other than paying the fee?
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  #7  
Old 12-11-2005, 09:39 PM
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engatwork,

It depends to a large extent, as is true in most states, what type of enterprise you are running.
There are different requirements for wholesalers,dealerships,salespeople who work at dealerships etc.

Here is a link for WI you might find helpful:

http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/business/dealers/index.htm
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  #8  
Old 12-11-2005, 09:47 PM
Ra_ Ra_ is offline
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Thanks 1badav


Yikes!
They prohibit an individual from selling more than 2 in a year?
Not only that... but you can't even BUY more than 2 ??

That is severe.
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  #9  
Old 12-11-2005, 10:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ra_
Thanks. I wonder if it's the same in Florida?

Has anyone ever sold a car without transferring it into your name first?
Registration fees are getting pretty steep down here.

When I lived in New York, I had to drive 20+ miles to the Department of Motor Vehicles
and wait in line for about 3 hours.
Now, it's about a mile away and the most people I've ever seen there are 4...
and they still have 2 or 3 people servicing you!
Ra,

In response to your Q, yes people sell vehicles without putting the title in their name. It's called title jumping and it is illegal. The main reason people do it is to avoid paying the tax and title fees.

The vast majority of the fees you pay when you title(your ownership document) and register(get plates---called tags in some states) is the sales tax. The tax rate varies from state to state, some having fixed rates multiplied by what was paid for the vehicle by the buyer to the seller and other states having taxes based on vehicle value determined by exactly what method I don't know since WI does theirs on a straight percentage of the sales price. Might be kelly blue book, insurance industry figures---I just don't know.

Any way, the amount collected can be substantial in either scenario, and if someone's buying a vehicle to turn it around and make a quick buck on it, they sure don't want to pay the dept of revenue in their state any of their potential profit if they don't have to. Thus, the title jumping.
They simply don't fill in their name as the purchaser on the title of the vehicle they buy, leaving it blank, and when they find the person they are selling it to, simply give them the title they were given from the previous owner.

The DMV AND the Dept of Revenue here in WI both take a very dim view of this and aggressively pursue this type of activity.

BTW, I should mention that when you are the seller of a vehicle, don't let someone walk away with a title they haven't signed as the purchaser. You don't want to get caught up in their potential problems if they are doing this type of deal.
Once you are in the sights of the revenue dept, you can expect annual hassles and extra scutiny(audits) of your tax returns for years to come. Not to mention lost time spent in depositions, court proceedings etc.

Finally, you should also get a signed "Bill Of Sale" that lists the names and signatures of both parties, description of the vehicle(including VIN) and date of sale. It wouldn't even hurt to put the time of day.
If the buyer does not take that title to their DMV and title the vehicle in their name right away, if they or someone they let drive the car racks up parking tickets, gets into an accident, or worse yet, injures someone, your only line of defense in court is that Bill Of Sale.

1badav
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  #10  
Old 12-11-2005, 11:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ra_
I think that many States regulate how many cars an individual
is permitted to sell in any given year?

I tried to Google it... but couldn't find much info.

Does anyone happen to know the regulations regarding this, for Florida?


Thanks.
It's 3 in Florida...When I have time I'll post the law.
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  #11  
Old 12-12-2005, 12:23 AM
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If it's three per year then the State of Florida's DMV website is not stating accurate info(not that that should come as a surprise to anyone!)

And before anyone from Florida gets offended at that comment, I meant, because it's a State agency, which again, I work for one, not because it is Florida per se.

This was the link I saw when I responded to Ra.


http://www.hsmv.state.fl.us/dmv/dmvdeal.html
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  #12  
Old 12-12-2005, 11:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by w126
1badav,

In live in a small town just east of Madison...

Interesting this subject has come up. Throughout this past summer I complained about some neighbors who were constantly selling cars. I counted close to a dozen from last Xmas up until late summer. I got word that the homeowner picks up these vehicles at auction and sells them from his eBay store or at another auction and even the local paper. Typically they sit out on the street our in his driveway, quite an eye sore to say the least.

I called the dealer section of the DMV and they told me some investigators would check into it. Not sure if they did or not, though their car buying habits did slow down a bit.

Finally I worked with the town board and the police chief. They sent out a letter warning them about running a biz in a residential area. Again, never got word of if they were "title jumping", but I highly suspect it. Enough so that I just emailed our chief, requesting them (or the state) to please look into it. They've been nuisance neighbors from day one, but have gotten better since about everybody within a 2 blocks have complained about them.

Since you work for the state, maybe you can, achem, check into them for me.
w126,

It seems like every neighborhood has one of these. I have Sanford and son across the street and two doors down. For the last 10 years they've been bringing home so many beater cars that they had to re-asphalt their driveway and make it bigger. Now they've outgrown their driveway and are parking cars all over their front lawn. Add to that all the boats and general crap that they've got piled in their backyard and we in the neighborhood have about had it.

The widow who lives next door to them has tried being nice and talking to them, when that had no effect she had the building inspector come out and talk to them, and even had them cited. The problem dissipated for a few weeks and then resumed. It's very frustrating.

With regard to your specific situation, unfortunately unless there's some specific evidence of fraud, for all intents and purposes it's a local municipal matter. I think your approach with the chief and the town board will yield greater results. They're members of the community and therefore have a vested interest in cleaning this kind of crap up.

BTW, most municipalities have ordinances against unregistered vehicles being in plain view. Unless these people are popping for plates for each vehicle on their property,which can only be done if you own the vehicle (i.e. titled it and payed the taxes) you might want to look into having them cited. If there aren't any plates on the vehicles this being something you obviuosly can discern yourself,you might cost them some money.

However, people like this tend to just jockey the plates from car to car whether they have the right to put them on it or not because they know only someone from the DMV or law enforcement's could tell by running the plate whether it's assigned to the vehicle or not.

Unfortunately I'm not high enough up in the food chain to be able to go around sniffing in someone else's jurisdiction without repercussions. But if by chance you come by some hard evidence of fraud, by all means let me know and I'll see what I can do---either myself or by putting you in touch with someone else.

Good Luck with your headache, every time I look at mine I'll think good thoughts for you.
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  #13  
Old 12-12-2005, 11:49 PM
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I disagree with many of you.

Mind Your Own & dont worry about if they make a side buck here & there.

Let me tell you Im not a "sanford & son" type of yard but I believe if its your property do what you like. Maybe they think your lifestyle is wrong just like you think theirs is.
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  #14  
Old 12-12-2005, 11:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirby_pug
I disagree with many of you.

Mind Your Own & dont worry about if they make a side buck here & there.

Let me tell you Im not a "sanford & son" type of yard but I believe if its your property do what you like. Maybe they think your lifestyle is wrong just like you think theirs is.
I'm not dropping anyone's property values with my "lifestyle" as you characterize it
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  #15  
Old 12-13-2005, 12:08 AM
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Property values? Ha you should thank these pack rats junk car hustlers for keeping your property taxes lower! Ok sort of J/K.

hey the way I see it if you live in the burbs or city & you got a junk dealer down the road I hear ya! Although if your out in the country, sticks, boondocks etc & someones got a stack of cars, junk, burn piles, semi trucks, etc then you Need to leave it alone & either move back to the yuppie homeland of the city or put up & shut up.
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Old 12-13-2005, 12:08 AM
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