E420 Modifications - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

DieselPaul · #1 05-12-2010, 07:13 PM

I want to preface this thread with this will go nowhere in a hurry I am bs'ing at this point. I was on a forum where people got real upset if you asked open ended questions and ended up not spending money. So that is my disclaimer, I don't even own the car.

I absolutely love my 300D, a Mercedes sedan is like the greatest thing ever to drive daily. I like the conveinence of 4 doors and big trunk, the smooth ride, the smell of the leather, listen to me get all excited. The only problem with a a 300D is when you lay your right foot down, not a lot happens. And with my fuel out of adjustment, damn near nothing happens. So I have decided I want a V8 Mercedes Sedan. I looked for 500Es, and E55s. The only way I could afford either would be to rebuild a wrecked one, which I've done before but at this point in my life $10-15k is a lot of money. While running this by a friend he reminded me his wife has a 1997 E420, black on black, under 100k miles. She went green and bought a prius so the E420 is not getting loved. He is going to probably sell it in a year or so. I could pick that car up for less than half of an E55, much easier on the budget.

So here is my question, is a W210 E420 a modifiable car? I've found headers, cat-backs, and lowering springs. With some bolt ons can I increase performance to get me closer to an E55 (understanding I am starting with a 70hp and 1.2L disadvantage)? Does anyone make any other performance parts for the 4.2L?

I have a friend who runs a shop that builds custom turbo kits for cars and he bounced around twin turbo'ing the 4.2 on relatively low boost. Do turbo M119s exist? Would you have to switch to megasquirt or similar engine management?

I am just bouncing ideas around, nothing serious. Figured I'd talk to people who actually own and modify cars than just look at supersprints website. Who knows maybe I'll hit the lottery buy an E63 and be in LA with my rich friends in a year, maybe I'll buy a prius, maybe I'll do nothing. I am just talking to talk at this point.

I'd keep the 300D for its fuel economy, the V8 car would be a part time daily if that even makes sense.

JohnM. · #2 05-12-2010, 07:49 PM

If was between a W210 E420 and a W124 E420, I'd go for the W124 hands down! Unless you just love the newer styling. Both chassis' have their weak points (spring perch for the 210) and (wiring harness for the 124). Either will do a ~14.5 second 1/4 mile in stock trim. The 500E will do a ~13.5 and an E55 even faster. But every second faster you go, costs a lot!

All the standard mods apply, but as with most older Mercedes there's not a lot in terms of "bolt-on". Full exhaust is the big one for performance.

Any type of turbo setup for will be completely custom for either chassis. There's no easy solution with turbo's. Especially if you want reliability and driveability. Sure there's ways to do it cheap. But going fast, reliably, costs $$$$. But the results are quite nice

DieselPaul · #3 05-12-2010, 08:19 PM

I like the W210 because one currently exists in my life that would be the right price.

The turbo would be fully custom I know. I am mostly curious about engine management on that front.

nick.ged · #4 05-13-2010, 02:00 AM

megasquirt and two rear mounted turbos is the way

Turbo E320 · #5 05-13-2010, 02:27 AM

Mercedes engines are extremely robust with nitrous

. Throw a 75-100 wet shot of nitrous on it, a wideband o2 sensor and a Apexi AFC Neo(for precise fuel adjustments) and you'll be kicking NA E55 ass. I hooked up a ZEX single 125 wet shot to my little brothers friends 190E 2.6 and it has 116k miles. It also has no fuel adjustment, it relies solely on the accuracy of the fuel jet in the nitrous system. It's been through 6 15lb bottles so far(about a minute and 46 seconds of nitrous at WOT

) with out so much as a bad tick. Haven't dyno'd it yet but we had to replace the trans fluid because it was slipping into second. That fixed the slip it lights up the first and second gears.

400Eric · #6 05-13-2010, 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnM.

If was between a W210 E420 and a W124 E420, I'd go for the W124 hands down! Unless you just love the newer styling. Both chassis' have their weak points (spring perch for the 210) and (wiring harness for the 124). Either will do a ~14.5 second 1/4 mile in stock trim. The 500E will do a ~13.5 and an E55 even faster. But every second faster you go, costs a lot!

All the standard mods apply, but as with most older Mercedes there's not a lot in terms of "bolt-on". Full exhaust is the big one for performance.

Any type of turbo setup for will be completely custom for either chassis. There's no easy solution with turbo's. Especially if you want reliability and driveability. Sure there's ways to do it cheap. But going fast, reliably, costs $$$$. But the results are quite nice

I'll take a harness replacement over a spring perch replacement any day but I also sure would like to have that 5spd auto that the W210 has!

A 14.5 stock is a bit of a reach. More like a 14.9 to 15.3 stock. My 400E started at 15.3 and by the end of that first day ran a 14.95. It now runs 14.4s. (All my E/Ts are uncorrected and are at a 1000 foot altitude track.) In the magazines they all ran corrected 14.9s to 15.3s.

The W210 4.2s are just different enough that most of what worked on my car won't work on them.

If you do end up with a W124 4.2 car, my posts here and at 500Ecstasy will get you on your way.
Regards, Eric

DieselPaul · #7 05-13-2010, 09:47 AM

Nitrous would definitely an option, however I'd like a car that is fast all the time. If a bottle is only worth about 20 seconds of full throttle I could kill that in a decent afternoon of cruising with buddies, the car would be super fast with an extra 100hp but it seems like its best used as a way to drop my ETs at the track. I'd like more power all the time as well so off the nitrous it is a fast car. Do the 4.2s respond well to breathing better?

Any insight on engine management?

Chlippo · #8 05-13-2010, 11:24 PM

curiosity....details of that E420? price mileage...
an E55 isnt very expensive compared to E420 + modifications..and you still have an AMG at the end of the line

DieselPaul · #9 05-14-2010, 01:25 AM

No price yet, but it books for $6k, so less than that.

400Eric · #10 05-14-2010, 04:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieselPaul

Nitrous would definitely an option, however I'd like a car that is fast all the time. If a bottle is only worth about 20 seconds of full throttle I could kill that in a decent afternoon of cruising with buddies, the car would be super fast with an extra 100hp but it seems like its best used as a way to drop my ETs at the track. I'd like more power all the time as well so off the nitrous it is a fast car. Do the 4.2s respond well to breathing better?

Any insight on engine management?

Yes, they respond very well to breathing mods.

No insight on engine management from me cause W210s are Motronic. If you go with a LH 4.2 (W124), I can help a little. I think Jay Rash knows Motronic though.
Regards, Eric

DieselPaul · #11 05-14-2010, 02:45 PM

I guess if I can tune fuel with the a'pexi I may be able to get the fuel enrichment for the turbos. I'd want a turbo setup where I'd trade max power for spool time. I'd take 350-400hp on a pair tiny twins if I can have that power damn near instantly. I have a friend with a turbo miata and while it only is 230whp it may as well be supercharged because the turbo is the size of my fist and the damn thing makes boost at idle.

Chlippo · #12 05-14-2010, 05:58 PM

E55 can be bought at 10K...
If you plan to invest on a E420 to get it faster...do your math on how $ you are gonna pay and if it will reach an E55 in power and handling and looks

DieselPaul · #13 05-15-2010, 02:13 AM

Well as of today he doesn't want to sell any more. LOL. So yeah maybe I'll go E55. Or maybe I want to put bigger elements in my diesel and giant turbo and FMIC. Who knows, like I said, no promises.

DieselPaul · #14 07-03-2010, 12:51 PM

Slight update on this, I've got the car for the week. My god does this car drinks fuel, methinks it needs O2s or something. The car isn't earth shattering from a dig but to paraphrase James May in his fake rolls royce review, the car never feels urgent, it gracefully whists away quickly from stops, which I like. However it pulls awesome on the highway. But I can't decide if the expense of upkeep on a W210 and the cost of fuel isn't just worth going all out and getting an E55. Parts for the E420 seem to be cheaper than those for the E430/E55 motors, the price could be right and the car is in very nice shape. It would need buffed its got a lot of black car swirls in it and a few scratches.

samiam44 · #15 07-26-2010, 01:00 PM

You must consider more than just parts prices between the motors- but what is needed for maintence?

Ie what things are you going to be shelling out for one vs the other in the next 50k miles or so? The 430/550 might be cheaper in that respect??

I know M119's are nice motors but the pesky cam oil tubes, timing chain guides etc all require replacement and are quite expensive labor wise to replace.

M