500E Engine temp. feedback needed - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

benzmark · #1 05-31-2002, 12:37 PM

Has anyone tried a lower temp. rated thermostat or running this engine without a thermostat to see if it maintained a constant 80-90 temp. without the help of the aux. fan or other "tricks". it seems like different fan clutch or thermostat or combination would keep the engine from cycling up and down between 80 and 100 with the help of jim F.'s fan switch pigtail. any feedback appreciated. mark

-fad · #2 05-31-2002, 01:43 PM

I believe there are numerous detailed discussions on this exact topic available via 'search' by our 500e/e500 gurus (and a couple of engineers)

> in my experience, the piggy tail itself (w/ water wetter) allows 'sitting' and 'bumper to bumper' use/condition temps constant under 95 no problemo (even w/ 100+ degree high ambient temp conditons)

I also run correct MB OEM coolant and 15W-40 Penzoil Longlife Dino motor oil.

In hot ambient conditions:
Once stopped, I pop open the hood to allow that excessive heat to rise.

hope this helps
-fad

benzmark · #3 05-31-2002, 02:23 PM

Thanks fad- I reviewed many of the postings in archives and they all deal with the use of the electric auxiliary fans to keep engine temp. in suitable range. I too use MB coolant and water wetter and the electric pigtail I got from Jim F. does maintain temp. below 95. My question is can this be accomplished mechanically without the noisy electrical fan and the cycling up and down of the cooling fan kick in temp. It seems like a different thermostat and/or fan clutch from another model might do this. Has anyone tried this approach?

-fad · #4 05-31-2002, 03:12 PM

Hi benzmark-

I've observed our more enthusiastic 500e/e500 trackers exploring serious ways to keep the temps down: I think Neil and others have been exploring the idea of modding to elec fans (sans clutch), belly pans w/ more venting, adding hood venting, etc. and even on a different approach, I've also heard a couple of 500e/e500 owners whom have installed higher capacity Renntech alum rads and/or trans coolers>>>> w/ the result not lowering sitting temps dramatically (if any)

...seems like there's a ton of ideas that can aide in cooling for 'brief' sitting sessions and/or extreme duty track use applications, but the fact remains that we're on an uphill battle due to the nature of a big motor installed within a small enclosure

...perhaps the combination of a higher capacity custom or Renn rad, higher cfm fans, high volume/perf water pump, hood venting, belly pan venting, water wetter, more effective/ efficient air management under the hood, lower thermostat, etc. will address our concerns?

I've come to the conclusion that the most (real) effective way to keep our motors cool in any ambient condition- - is to keep air flowing through the rad and ensuring the cooling system is at operating at 100% efficiency.

I'm sure we'll hear more from the ownership re: thermostat/ fan/ mods to keep our vehicles cooler, but for my use- - the piggy tail and water wetter provides a good enough yet significant improvement vs. stock. If I have to sacrifice replacing the elec fans prior to 100k miles, no problemo....I'd rather do that than allow the motor to sit in higher temps and risk excessive heat related ills.

-fad

#5 05-31-2002, 06:00 PM

I was wondering if it wasn't possible to set up some intermediate speed for the aux fans, so they would work at half speed at temps in the 90-100 range and full speed once temp gets up to 110?

I also would like to know at which temps the 500e thermostat opens, and if there is a way to put another one in which would open at a lower temp.

Michael · #6 05-31-2002, 08:53 PM

My car's NEVER seen 110, except just barely, once, at the track. With the pigtail, never more than 102-103 or so. I run 40% MBZ fluid & WW (and have a 92 degree pigtail) The main reason I look to keep it sub-100 is because the computer dials back timing at/above that temp, which = less power

If it gets to 100 + easily, it's time for a new radiator I'm betting; or, or a fan is not working.

And 100 is not all that hot, guys, so relax and enjoy the ride!

ke6dcj · #7 05-31-2002, 09:22 PM

Stu Ritter, Technical Advisor to the MBCA "The STAR" and a partner in the BergWerks (http://www.bergwerks.com) did a modification to the viscous fan that fools the viscous control to turn on SOONER on his 400E.

I would contact BergWerks to do the same thing.

Barring that, the best bet is a NEW radiator and dual electric puller fans with a Derale thermostat for 2700+ CFM of air. I'm going to do this ASAP.

I did a variation with a single 16-inch fan (2300 CFM) on our AMG/C36 engined wagon, and last month a Willow, the temps never got above 85.

BTW- when I had the hood hinges adjusted for a 1/4-inch lift, temps. dropped dramatically, hence my desire for possible hood vents . . .

:-) neil
1988 360TE AMG
1993 500E

ItalianBenz · #8 05-31-2002, 10:01 PM

Ok this is all nuts. If you remove the t-stat the engine the will never go into close loop. so you will have a run rich condition all the time. Water flow needs to slowed down. so that coolant sensors,02s, and so forth can read that certain resistance values for the LH unit. The electric fans would be cool. Just have to figure out a mounting. As for the spped in the fan. You can put variable pre re resistors for the.

Last but not Least He he
I got a hot tip that would make our cars run alot colder from the start without any mods.

But I'll let you guys swaet for a while he he

placo1 · #9 05-31-2002, 10:56 PM

Guido,

WHATS UP WITH THAT!! Are you holding back on us

Hmmmm maybe a few beers will get this secret.

ItalianBenz · #10 05-31-2002, 11:27 PM

Hey af. Its funny all these brillant Idea's when some don't even know when there jeaprodizing engine managment. Yes Jim had this Idea as so did I,Yes it does help,yes the fan is noisy,I just let guys do what they want. I have 15 yrs Mb experience,I trianed in germany,I worked for special tuners, I have this secret It works it cost a little but you dont need to do electric fan and all this mobo jumbo. Yes water wetter works. But really do you see a decline in major engine temp. I think not. A new radiator is always good. Especially mercedes benz radiators. After 10 yrs
I rec to Replace. I'm going to replace mine in a few months.

Thats all I have for now

Guido

benzmark · #11 06-01-2002, 07:13 PM

Let us have the goods if you have them Guido. Is it a smaller water pump pulley or high volume pump? waiting to hear. Mark

David Hendy · #12 06-02-2002, 03:01 PM

Last year at all the track events my temps would nearly hit the redline, in 100F weather, even at speed. In trafffic, even with the pigtail my fans were nearly always on.

I put a new rad in my car two weeks ago, although the fan still comes on, it comes on for much less time than two months ago, when ambient temps were 20-30F lower.

I may do the oil cooler before Indy, but lets wait and see.

aldedmon · #13 06-03-2002, 12:58 PM

David,
Did you replace your old( I assume partially restricted) radiator with an OEM or other "BIG/High Flow"aftermarket type??

Speaking of lower temps, my 400e conversion ran much lower temps this last week. I am having the grill and headlight panels powder coated and am driving the car without them in place. It looks like a dirt track car from the front, but it sure runs (just a hair over 85)cool