Found a 500E - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Richard1 · #1 11-19-2003, 01:14 PM

1994, 24,500 miles, $24,500. One issue is that it's been in an accident and completely repainted. Paint job looks perfect and I can't tell where it's been hit and 2nd owner doesn't know either...it showed up in the carfax.

How well does the A/C work on the 500Es? This will be my daily driver and it gets very hot here in VA.

gsxr · #2 11-19-2003, 06:04 PM

The A/C is not great in any of the W124 series. If the car still has R-12, you are lucky - don't ever convert it. If it was already victimized and switched to R-134a, you can - at no small expense - reverse convert it back to R-12 for improved AC performance. You also need to make sure all the vacuum pods are operating properly, yank the passenger airbag and test all lines at the 7-prt manifold (shown in this photo) :

http://www.meimann.com/images/mercedes/W124_dash/manifold_defrost.jpg

Sounds like a great car, hope you enjoy it! Wish I could find a deal like that near me...

suginami · #3 11-19-2003, 06:18 PM

W124's came with R134a from the factory starting with the 500E's and 400E's in 1992. 300E's switched to R134a in 1993.

I'm assuming that Mercedes engineered the a/c differently for R134a, as my 1993 "E320" has the coldest a/c of any car I have ever owned, and it has never been recharged.

I'm sure that the a/c system, R134a or R12, will have the same reliability problems due to the vacum actuated valves.

Richard1 · #4 11-19-2003, 06:29 PM

Ugh...that is a major consideration, because here in VA, the summer temps get into the 90s and I intend to use this as a daily driver and on weekends with the family.

If the 500E A/C stinks, and it sounds like it does, I might be better off getting a different MB performance sedan.

Anyone have an opinion of the C43?

suginami · #5 11-19-2003, 06:37 PM

Since your car came with R134a from the factory, you should have no trouble with a/c performance.

It is cars that are converted from R12 to R134a that have problems cooling.

Richard1 · #6 11-19-2003, 06:54 PM

So you would recommend a 500E over a c43....I realize they are quite a bit different but I haven't driven a c43 before...updated creature comforts are tempting though.

gsxr · #7 11-19-2003, 06:59 PM

True - the cars that came from the factory with 134a had minor changes, but nothing huge. The AC is decent but not fantastic. Your opinion on this will vary greatly depending on where you live, and your personal idea of what constitutes "cold" or "hot". It gets to 110F here in Idaho, which really strains the 124 system, even with R-12. It's fine on the freeway but at low speeds, idling around town, it barely keeps you comfy. And it takes a while to cool the car down if you goofed up and parked in the sun for a few hours.

If you really want to keep cool in summer, you need serious window tint for starters. Then you need a GOOD windshield shade (the MB dealer ones are great and custom-fit for the 124 - I love mine) AND you need to use it EVERY time you park the car. That keeps your dash from cracking too. Worst case, if you want even more A/C performance, you can switch to R-406b (AutoFrost), which outperforms even R-12 but has the drawback of being a blend which you can't "top off" when it gets low.

But I'd never let AC performance scare me away from a 500E, or any 124 chassis. It's still one of the best built cars - ever - IMO. Just don't expect icicles to form on your nose five minutes after you start the car leaving work at 4pm on a hot day!

gsxr · #8 11-19-2003, 07:02 PM

500E vs. C43? Tough call. Personally, I think the 500E is a better built car. But the C43 has lots of nifty "AMG" stuff all over. The performance is similar, I think. I prefer the looks of the 500E, especially with fat wheels & tires like the EVO's or the custom wheels Shanta had made. There are a lot of C43's out there, but not many 500E's. All depends what you're looking for I guess.

Richard1 · #9 11-19-2003, 07:40 PM

Oh geez....well, I'll meditate on it. I'm the original owner of a 87 560sl and this will be the first car I've bought for myself since then. Can't decide. ugh.

suginami · #10 11-19-2003, 09:53 PM

I'm not sure I have ever heard of someone considering to not buy a 500E because of a/c performance.

I have read hundreds of posts made by gsxr and respect his knowledge and opinions. He really knows what he's talking about.

However, I disagree with his opinion on Mercedes that come with R134a from the factory. I'll say it again. The a/c performance in my 1993 W124 is spectacular. It has never been anything but extraordinarily good. I live in Southern California, and work in Ontario, California, which is in the San Bernardino County. It is hot in the summer. Above 100 almost everyday in the summer. The a/c has never been inadequate.

Picture me saying this like I'm Arnonld Schwarzenegger, "Listen to me know and believe me later". I don't think a/c performance will be a problem with the R134a in the 500E since it was engineered for it at the factory.

However, every car that I've been in that has been converted from R12 to R134a, Mercedes or otherwise, has been a disaster. The cooling capability isn't the same.

gsxr · #11 11-19-2003, 10:58 PM

I will say that I have not owned a 124 with factory 134a, nor been in one on hot day. So you should probably listen more to the folks with first-hand knowledge!

One other thing to remember is that high humidity can really affect AC operation. California is a dry climate, and so is Idaho. I'm not sure what VA is like. If someone could chime in who has a late model 124 with factory 134a, who lives in the southeast, I'd love to hear what they have to say.

Just to clarify what I meant earlier: the 124 AC systems (any of them) are plenty adequate at freeway speeds, in any amount of heat, when working properly (full charge, unrestricted airflow at condenser, recirc flap vac pods good, etc). It's only the city stop & go, and the initial cool-off of a hot car, where it could use a little help. Some day when I get an E500 I'll find out myself what the factory 134a systems are like! I hope suginami is right, if so, I'll be a happy camper.

Richard1 · #12 11-19-2003, 11:33 PM

Thank you both.....I'll probably buy that 500E....the c43 is a lovely car but the 500E just looks like it's built to last.

Hammer Wagon · #13 11-19-2003, 11:48 PM

I have the factroy R134a in my 95 124 cabrio and the 134a retrofitted in the 88 Hammer wagon.

Both are fine even on a very hot/ humid day. They won't frost your nose, but even with the top down I can aim the vents just right and stay cool.

The only flaw I see is that both systems are somewhat noisier at fan speed than many more modern cars.

..and the "sloshing" water sound like the AC is about to dump a gallon of water on your feet but it never does.

tom woolner · #14 11-20-2003, 02:25 AM

My 500E A/C is adequate; I drove from Memphis to CA a year and a half ago, and stayed cool the whole way.
The 500E is a totally different car--totally hand-built, quality never to be had again for the bargain price you're going to pay. C43s are a dime a dozen, and the C interior is for small people.

Tom
92 500E
126,000 miles

placo1 · #15 11-20-2003, 02:40 AM

Richard1,

Couple of comments. First definitely have the car checked over by a good mechanic to insure no mechanical problems exist. Also have the frame checked, you don't want a car with major frame problems.

Regarding the A/C performance I discovered something recently that made a huge difference on my car. My radiator recently cracked at the flange and I had to replace it. When I removed the old radiator I found leaves, pine needles bugs and dirt had accumulated between the radiator and the A/C radiator. This stopped airflow in the lower regions of both components causing mediocre A/C. I cleaned the area thouroughly and have noted cooler engine operating temperatures and ice cold A/C which I need to turn down in 105F temps. I'd imagine many 500's suffer the same condition and a little cleaning can make a big difference.

If your not certain which way to go regarding a C43 and a 500E I would test drive both and look closely at features/benefits to determine which meets your expectations better.

Good luck, it's always exciting choosing a new car.