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  #1  
Old 03-27-2010, 01:03 AM
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Angry Venting....and I don't mean from the dash!

Sorry guys but I am sooo frustrated! I am still looking at this little yellow 82 380SL an older couple has out here in the sticks where I live. I have been talking to the wife and she is so cooperative as far as letting me check the car out etc. After the first test drive it WADDLED down the road and was missing so badly it would not go over 20 mph with out steering control issues! I told her I would get back with her when I could get a car dolly and get it to a lift to see what was going on.
Today I stop by to visit the car and check to see if I can see the timing chain and hubby is home this time...he says" Oh this thing is a real runner! I take it once a week to the county line and she just cruises down the road!" I asked him if he noticed that it shook violently after EVENTUALLY going into gear? He said he has had no problem with this car and he just drove it last Friday. He is a truck driver and he did not drive it last Friday, we did! I asked him about the timing chain and he was clueless about why it needed changing, referring to the 'new' motor that was put in and probably did not have 5000 miles on it.. I pointed out to him that this 'new' motor had yellow numbers on it from a salvage yard, it was not new!
I could tell that not only did he not know what he was talking about but he was A LIAR!!!!!!! WHY DO PEOPLE TELL YOU JUNK THAT IS OBVIOUSLY NOT TRUE? I guess because I'm a female, I am stupid! I knew more about his car than he did. ...can't wait for wife to get home and he goes back on the road... ARRGH!


Last edited by PANZER; 03-27-2010 at 01:05 AM. Reason: misspelling
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  #2  
Old 03-27-2010, 03:32 AM
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Look, I sympathize with you, but perhaps you should start looking at other MBs for sale - just in case this one falls through, so to speak?
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  #3  
Old 03-27-2010, 09:24 AM
88Black560SL
 
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What you are experiencing is unfortunately very common. Lots of people mis-represent what they have. But not all people are like that. It's just time to walk away.

Any time a car has a new or used motor, The first thing that should be on your mind is why the motor was replaced. If the car has 300,000 miles on it OK under 200,000 with the exception of a timing chain indecent is neglect. And that means the whole car was neglected.

Car sounds like a basket case.
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Old 03-27-2010, 10:29 AM
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Knowlege vs. Wisdom

Walking away from this car is probably the WISEST thing to do as they have been trying to sell this car for some time now. The Dad who owned it was 80 when he bought it! The daughter tells me that the original motor was completely rebuilt in 99' with reciepts to prove it, and it looked like a timing chain issue, the second time they dropped a motor in it, the daughter was under the impression that the shop (the only one in the area) 'saw her dad coming' and knew he would just stroke a check to fix what ever..so she feels that there were times they took advantage of him. The wife is VERY forthcoming about the issues this car has and does not try to argue with my point of view, hubby on the other hand is in total denial, I think because it is a MB he thinks that it is worth its weight in GOLD! I may trying to justify getting this car, I feel like I could really DO something with this little cast off. Well, there ya go, I am starting to sound like an emotional female! We shall see, gotta sell this grandfather clock first...
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Old 03-27-2010, 11:24 AM
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I know the feeliing. I bought my car off Ebay from some guy in Texas. I asked all the system specific questions, Steering, suspension, leaks, radiator, A/C,motor,trans,brakes,exhaust, electrical,body,interior, ect... I was assured all was in tip top condition, driver ready, excellent running car with 97k miles on it.. The guy was some kind of teen counsler/interventionist. Seemed like a stand-up kinda guy. Ok, I won the auction and had the car shipped from Texas.

Two weeks later, the car arrived(traveled through Katrina hurricane). Physically the car was nice. No rust Texas car/clean interior. When I went to drive it home from the shippers depot, and the car ran like crap. Missing engine, steering all over the road, A/C did't work, brakes worn,broken shock, exhaust leak, oill leak, A/C broke, and so on.

I wrote the guy an email explaining the condition of the car wasn't what he assured me it was. His explanation was he wasn't a mechanic so his knowledge was very limited on mechanical issue's. My response was what are you an fu..ing idiot? You can't drive a car and know it runs like crap and handles like a drunken sailor. Funny how once the money changed hands, all of a sudden he's acting like a stupid idiot.

After about a year and lots of parts and money, the car drives like a champ. Thankfully most everything that needed repair were the usual 107 gremlins, nothing major but everything typical of a car that wasn't maintained.

Lesson learned, don't trust anything the seller say's as true. Have the car inspected by a Pro or in the least an honest semi-competant DIY'er. Luckily, the body and paint were rust free, the mileage appearsto be correct judging by physical condition. Probably the most important item on my checklist was body and interior. Mechanics are the easiest things to repair, body work is a whole nother story, at least for me.
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Last edited by 450slcguy; 03-27-2010 at 11:31 AM.
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  #6  
Old 03-27-2010, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roncallo View Post
What you are experiencing is unfortunately very common. Lots of people mis-represent what they have. But not all people are like that. It's just time to walk away.

Car sounds like a basket case.
x2 Unl;ess you have a lot of money and the car has sentimental value, you may want to rethink buying it.

There's only one car I would offer a lot of money for and it's the first Traction I ever owned. Sentimental value. But the guy who owns it now won't sell it because once he buys something it's never sold.
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1950 170SD
1951 Citroen 11BN
1953 Citroen 11BNF limo
1953 220a project
1959 180D
1960 190D
1960 Borgward Isabella TS 2dr
1983 240D daily driver
1983 380SL
1990 350SDL daily driver alt
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  #7  
Old 03-27-2010, 01:29 PM
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I watch out for subjective assessments, e.g., top shape, serviced regularly, runs okay, super, great, fantastic condition, real runner, new (to what, the world or this car?), etc . . . There is no standard to these types of terms and they can mean whatever the seller wants them to and many will exploit your misunderstanding of, and confusion about them.

I find it sort of entertaining to question the seller with, "what do you mean by that?" repeatedly each time they use them. Make the seller explain their words until they use ones that are clear and without ambiguity. Terms like poor, fair, good, excellent have objective criteria associated with them in the context of used cars. Just go to KBB.com and see. In fact, it might not be a bad ideas to print out the definition of those terms and bring them with you. That way you can finish up your conversation with, "So what you're really saying when you mean the car is in "top shape" and is a "real runner" is that it is in "fair" condition, right?" It put you in a better negotiating position.
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  #8  
Old 03-27-2010, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PANZER View Post
Walking away from this car is probably the WISEST thing to do as they have been trying to sell this car for some time now. The Dad who owned it was 80 when he bought it! The daughter tells me that the original motor was completely rebuilt in 99' with reciepts to prove it, and it looked like a timing chain issue, the second time they dropped a motor in it, the daughter was under the impression that the shop (the only one in the area) 'saw her dad coming' and knew he would just stroke a check to fix what ever..so she feels that there were times they took advantage of him. The wife is VERY forthcoming about the issues this car has and does not try to argue with my point of view, hubby on the other hand is in total denial, I think because it is a MB he thinks that it is worth its weight in GOLD! I may trying to justify getting this car, I feel like I could really DO something with this little cast off. Well, there ya go, I am starting to sound like an emotional female! We shall see, gotta sell this grandfather clock first...
It's too bad that a antique car that is attractive is being footballed by one of the owners, so to speak. That car may well be worth a lot - or it may not be. The only way to learn it's condition would be to pay an expert to look it over and give you their analysis. A couple three hundred dollars could save you a fortune down the road in repairs. If the owners will permit it - get it to such a mechanic and get it on a lift and analyzed. Just like a home inspection and appraisal before you buy a home. By the way - what are they asking for the car?

This is just me, but if I am paying top dollar for a used car - I will never be the buyer unless I can see it in person. This may be a hassle for me, but then I know what I am getting. I have a fancy for antique motorcycles - and on E-Bay when I see one I really like I send the seller an e-mail expolaining that I would like to buy the bike, but will only buy in person, in cash if the sale doesn't go through with the highest bidder, I would like to be considered and to drop me a line. I know - I miss a lot of really peachy bikes - but they are usually 1,000 miles or more away from where I live and that's my personal policy on not getting burned.
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Old 03-27-2010, 01:42 PM
TAP TAP is offline
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I've offered this advise before on the forum; get an expert to give you a wrtitten evaluation of the car. When you have that in hand go try to make a deal. My local Benz dealer has a tech with thirty years experience. It cost me $93.00 a pop for him to advise me but when he said "buy this car" I did. Results: happy me.

Lots of people have unrealistic ideas concerning the vaule of their cars. You can try and educate them but most likely you'll just piss them off.

Make a fair offer on the car and then let it go. Good luck.
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  #10  
Old 03-27-2010, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by TAP View Post
I've offered this advise before on the forum; get an expert to give you a wrtitten evaluation of the car. When you have that in hand go try to make a deal. My local Benz dealer has a tech with thirty years experience. It cost me $93.00 a pop for him to advise me but when he said "buy this car" I did. Results: happy me.

Lots of people have unrealistic ideas concerning the vaule of their cars. You can try and educate them but most likely you'll just piss them off.

Make a fair offer on the car and then let it go. Good luck.
You are a very smart buyer!
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Old 03-27-2010, 08:37 PM
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If the owners will permit it - get it to such a mechanic and get it on a lift and analyzed. Just like a home inspection and appraisal before you buy a home. By the way - what are they asking for the car?

The original price was 5000. and after a year or better it came down to 2500. They called me when they decided to drop the price. I told them I could not go that much.
A few months later I stopped by and the car was STILL there and she said she would take 2000. for it. After I looked it over I plan to offer(after I sell this @%%$#^&*%%! grandfather clock,) 1000. no more than 1200.

I am planning on having to put some $$ in it, probably more than I realize, I have no plans to resell, I will get a kick (or get kicked) out of fixing this thing, not to mention eventually driving it around on the weekends, showing it off to all the cows and local farm animals! I know they will be impressed!
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  #12  
Old 03-27-2010, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PANZER View Post
If the owners will permit it - get it to such a mechanic and get it on a lift and analyzed. Just like a home inspection and appraisal before you buy a home. By the way - what are they asking for the car?

The original price was 5000. and after a year or better it came down to 2500. They called me when they decided to drop the price. I told them I could not go that much.
A few months later I stopped by and the car was STILL there and she said she would take 2000. for it. After I looked it over I plan to offer(after I sell this @%%$#^&*%%! grandfather clock,) 1000. no more than 1200.

I am planning on having to put some $$ in it, probably more than I realize, I have no plans to resell, I will get a kick (or get kicked) out of fixing this thing, not to mention eventually driving it around on the weekends, showing it off to all the cows and local farm animals! I know they will be impressed!
I don't know where you live, but are there no other better Benzes you can find?
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Invest in America: Buy a Congressman!

1950 170SD
1951 Citroen 11BN
1953 Citroen 11BNF limo
1953 220a project
1959 180D
1960 190D
1960 Borgward Isabella TS 2dr
1983 240D daily driver
1983 380SL
1990 350SDL daily driver alt
3 x Citroen DS21M, down from 5
3 x Citroen 2CV, down from 6
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  #13  
Old 03-27-2010, 09:47 PM
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Most used car sellers (usually with little or no mechanical ability) assume that if it drives down the road, everything is mechanically "functional". If it stops, the brakes are "good". And if the engine always starts, yep, it's got a good engine. See how this description could apply to almost every part of a car? And it's precisely why most used cars you look at are absolute crap. But as we know, all mechanical parts have a set wear range that they will still technically "function" under.

Also SL's are extremely expensive to fix/repair. Even if you are a DIY'er, the high cost and low availability of parts is not in your favor. Based on what you said about the car, I'd be running from that car, fast.

There are TONS of SL's out there. Even if you have to wait 2 months to find the perfect one, you will save thousands of dollars in the end. Usually waiting it out means you can find one for half of book value that is probably nicer overall. I always look for the diamond in the rough, so to say. A car with nearly perfect mechanics, usually lower miles. The seller is usually getting rid of it so cheap for minor minor flaws, like faded paint and a broken washer bottle. Stuff that can be easily fixed, but they de-value it a lot due to whatever reasons. Those are the deals you want. Not the usually de-valued used car that needs a new engine/transmission/interior....body work. Stay away from those. Good luck on the hunt. I've learned, be PATIENT.
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Last edited by JohnM.; 03-27-2010 at 09:54 PM.
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  #14  
Old 03-28-2010, 05:52 AM
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If the thing is waddling and feeling unsafe at 20 mph, you might want to look at where the lower control arms connect to the front engine frame. This could be one of the years where the mounting ears break off the frame.
There is a recall on this, MB will replace the front engine frame (yes, even this old of a car!), the new engine frame has strengthening gussets at these mounts. I did one once where it was driven in, like what you've done with this car. (Man was I shaking my head)
If the ears have only cracked, they will pay to have a body shop install the gussets. If one has broken they will replace the whole engine frame (also called the engine cradle).
If you don't own it, let the owners know. Oh and stop driving it if this has what has happened.
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Old 03-28-2010, 11:35 AM
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Here is some more information about the sub frame, cradle, recall.
The official Mercedes position is that it only applies to the US Model 350 and 450 SL and SLC.
Some have had luck with Mercedes honoring it on other models.
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r-c107-sl-slc-class/1450267-sub-frame-recall-information.html

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