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  #16  
Old 10-26-2000, 04:24 AM
dfndr
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Jim H and all,

One of the diagrams on Jim's link seems to allay a concern I've had as I've watched my temperature gauge creep to 110C during summer traffic in Florida. It looks as though the oil is ok through about 140C, which gives some cushion if the temperature of the hottest parts of the engine are at or below 140C when the gauge says 110C.
http://www.noria.com/Learn/Graphics/GM2.gif

FWIW, my manual (1992 600 SEL) says to change the oil and filter every 3,000 miles.


[This message has been edited by dfndr (edited 10-26-2000).]
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  #17  
Old 10-26-2000, 08:41 AM
Geezer
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Holland, MI
Posts: 1,316
Hello to dfndr and all.

NOTE: the temperature gauge measures COOLANT temperature. It does not indicate OIL temperature. Oil will, and as you saw in the graph, SHOULD run hotter than coolant. The 100C-140C oil temperature is what boils off any water from condensation in the oil.

Interesting thread.

BCingU, Jim

------------------
'96 E300D 60k mi (wife's daily ride)
'95 Audi 90 120k mi
'92 GMC Suburban 139k mi
'85 300SD 234k mi (my daily ride)
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  #18  
Old 10-26-2000, 10:32 AM
dfndr
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Jim, or anyone else,

Do you know what the oil temperature is on a typical Benz six or eight cylinder?

Thanks,

Brian
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  #19  
Old 10-26-2000, 10:34 AM
dfndr
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Jim, or anyone else,

Do you know what the oil temperature range is for a typical Benz six or eight cylinder when the water temp is 110C?

Thanks,

Brian
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  #20  
Old 10-26-2000, 11:22 AM
engatwork's Avatar
busy
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Soperton, Ga. USA
Posts: 11,776
finally had to throw my .02 cents in.
I had a Mazda MPV with 4 cylinder for years and always changed the oil at 3k miles (Castrol 20-50W). At 125k the wife ran it after the radiator came apart and I had to rebuild the engine. The internals were absolutely spotless and you could still see the cross hatch on the cyl. walls, along with the scars from running hot. Now I change oil between 3 to 5k (still using Castrol 20-50W) and will continue to do so until something indicates that I should do different. The secret to running these things for many miles is like Larry says - change it hot and change it often.
engatwork
'95 E320
'97 Honda CRV
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  #21  
Old 10-26-2000, 11:24 AM
engatwork's Avatar
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Sorry, meant to say that the scars were on the piston skirts and not the cyl. walls. Cylinder walls looked good.
engatwork
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  #22  
Old 10-26-2000, 01:38 PM
LarryBible
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M.B.Doc,

Thanks for allowing us to read between the lines.

juan01,

I believe that we can extend our oil change intervals just a little with the newer engines. You make a good point, the oils haven't changed alot lately. But the engines are running a little cleaner. Not to worry though, you won't find my precious new car, or even my old ragged out ones, going anywhere near as far as MB is telling me. Oil and filters are CHEAP, even Mobil One and dealer purchased filters, compared to the cost of a new car, or even a new engine are CHEAP.

Good luck,
Change oil hot and change oil often,

------------------
Larry Bible
'01 C Class, Six Speed
'84 Euro 240D, manual, 533K miles
'88 300E 5 Speed
'81 300D Daughter's Car
Over 800,000 miles in
Mercedes automobiles
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  #23  
Old 10-26-2000, 05:12 PM
Ashman's Avatar
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Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Sherman Oaks, CA
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I like your idea larry of letting it sit draining overnight to get out some of the sludge build up. I havent yet hit my 3000 mile mark for my first oil change since I got my car, but When I do is there a specific oil you would recommend. I'm not asking about the brand, mobil 1 seems to be oil of choice, so what I am looking for is the weight.

I live in Los Angeles, which is generally sunny and warm all year round, but it can get cold (at least for my warm blooded self) at night.

In my previous cars, when I did my own oil changes, I would usually use 20w-50. do you recommend using 20w-50 or should I go with something a little lighter? maybe 10w-40 or something else?

Would really help to know what the recomended oil type to use is. I don't plan on using full synthetic, but I am planning on using 1 quart of synthetic at first, going to 2 quarts the next time, 3 after that etc, until I have gone to full synthetic. Do you recommend this, or should I just toss in full synthetic from the start?

My head has a tiny tiny leak in it, and I dont want to have it start leaking more because I used all synthetic without letting it condition the gasket first.

I'm an amateur DIY'er, and I try to tackle the basics as much as possible.

yes i do know i can run down to a jiffy lube or somwhere to get an oil change done for like $20 but I don't trust that they will use the brand of oil I want or the factory filter element.

I have to stop by the dealer anyway to pick up a new piece of carpet for my center console which had the factory phone, but I took that out as I dont use analog phones or airtouch service. so I want to replace the carpet with a new piece which hasnt been massacred for the phone installation. I'll pick up the necessary wrench and filter while I am there.

Is there anything special I should do when changing the oil? I plan on letting it sit overnight and most of the day the next day with the drain plug out, should I remove the oil filter as well to aid in the draining or should I just wait until I am ready to put the plug back in and then take it out.

also how much oil should I put in the car afterI do the oil change. how many quarts should I put in before I start to check the level to make sure its within operating range.

also after I have changed the oil, should I run the car for a little while then check the level again to make sure it is within operating parameters?

I have no maintenenace history on my car past 60k miles, and it has 78k now. I just got the car a few weeks ago, and am eager to change the oil.

I am also planning on getting the tranny fluid and filter changed soon, is there a specific trannny fluid that you recommend?

Thanks for any advise.

Alon

BTW Have I ever written a post on this board that wasn't excessively long? LOL

------------------
'92 300CE
Metallic Black (Blue Flaked) on Creme
Clear Corners
Black Grille Insert
78k Miles

Future Upgrades:
Sportline Suspension
17" AMG Monoblocks or EVO II's
94-95 Tail Lights
Euro Headlights
Chip
AMG Exhaust

Click here to Go To My 300CE Page
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  #24  
Old 10-26-2000, 06:41 PM
engatwork's Avatar
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Ashman,
use the 20-50 and make sure you use a high quality oil - I recommend Castrol. If you change it often enough you do not need to worry about the synthetic. I know that when I changed it at 3k then there WAS NO SLUDGE to drain out overnight. Change it hot and change it often and you will be fine. I would not go the synthetic route.
engatwork
'95 E320
'97 Honda CRV
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  #25  
Old 10-26-2000, 07:55 PM
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thanks for the response. i usually use castrol in my cars as I dont trust other brands, except when on the road and you need the oil.. then i trust just about any brand as I'd rather have somethingin there than nothing..

20-50 is what I will use then and I wont go to synthetic. Since I have no maintenance history on this car for the last lets say 20k miles, I would definately like to drain it overnight to try to get even the slightest bit of sludge out of it if there is any.

i usually don't drive much on the weekends or during the week unless my appointment schedule fills up. If My schedule is empty, I basically drive the 7 miles to work and back, roughly a 15 minute drive for me each way if I go the speed limit, though since i got the benz, my speed limit has gone from the speed limit to around 20 mph over it. hehe

There has to be something said for a well engineered german car. You feel like you are doing 30 when you are doing 70. in my jeep if i was doing 70 I felt like i was doing 100. hehe

mercedes to me is truly one of the best automobiles built, and I'm not talking about the reliability, but about the driveability.

I was looking at 92-95 BMW 325IS's versus the mercedes 300CE. After driving the 300CE, and then driving some BMW's, i came to the conclusion that the mercedes is a much more substantial car.

The doors on the BMW felt weak and light, not solid at all. the car itself drives nice, but it just doen't have the solid feeling a benz will give you. sure the BMW is quicker off the line and handles better, but I like knowing that when my car was new, the previous owner paid 60k for it, while the BMW was a max of 35k when new. perhaps its also about the price i got my car for, roughly 6k below blue book value for the milage / condition of the car.

My interior is almost spotless, apart from the piping on the center armrest, which was cracked on every 300ce I looked at, and some minor cracks in the finish on the wood, which i could care less about right now as i am more into driving it. the body has no dents, but a few small marks in it, and the car was repainted with a custom paintjob. All this contributed to my buying the car for less. I could have gotten a 90 or 91 for 18-20k, but with more milage on them. Mine has the newer steering wheel on it which I like better than the pre 92 steering wheels, and it has 78k miles on it and drives like a dream. all in all, I can say that the price i paid, was low for the car. basically I paid $14,500 but with tax and licensing it comes in at about $16,500. Still a hell of a price for the car, and I have always loved the mercedes coupes.

i debated getting a 560SEC over the 300Ce, but decided I didn't want a flagship, I wanted a mid sized car, and the 300Ce is theonly one that fit the bill.

In anycase, I plan on doing frequent oil changes rougly every 3000 miles or less, depending on when I have the time, though I dont work on weekends unless I have to, so i usually have timeon sat and sunday to do it.

i don't plan on doing all the maintenenace on my car, but I do plan on doing the basics, brakes, oil, plugs etc when needed.

Changing the tranny fluid is also something I dont want to mess with, I hate dealing with gaskets and sealants. I prefer leaving that up to the pro's. plus I'm more than likely to botch of the gasket installation.

i did rebuild the Stromberg carb on my MBG, but that was simple as all I had to do was replace the oil diapragm, a $14 part. My mechanic at the time for the MGB walked me through it over the phone in about 20 minutes.

in anycase, another book has been written, so I'm gonna shut up for a few hours while I go take care of some appointments I have.

thanks for the info.

Knowledge is power!

Alon

p.S. my spelling isn't as bad as it seems, its just that when I type I don't use a standard method, my fingers go all over the place, and sometimes I hit the space bar early or late hehehe. I also don't always proofread.

------------------
'92 300CE
Metallic Black (Blue Flaked) on Creme
Clear Corners
Black Grille Insert
78k Miles

Future Upgrades:
Sportline Suspension
17" AMG Monoblocks or EVO II's
94-95 Tail Lights
Euro Headlights
Chip
AMG Exhaust

Click here to Go To My 300CE Page

[This message has been edited by Ashman (edited 10-26-2000).]
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  #26  
Old 10-26-2000, 08:14 PM
engatwork's Avatar
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uh oh - this is very important information concerning the oil change -
"basically drive the 7 miles to work and back"- this is the reason that you need to change the oil at the 3k interval. You have to understand that this is one of the worst things you can do in regards to the oil. You see, you do not get the temp up enough to boil off the condensate. By all means, change it at 3k and the high quality, non-synthetic is fine. OT - if you only drive 7 miles to work why don't you ride the bicycle?
My commute is 40 miles one way, if it was 7 I would definitely be on the bike.
engatwork
'95 E320
'97 Honda CRV
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  #27  
Old 10-27-2000, 12:31 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 117

420SEL wrote: "...Does the dealer do your oil changes for free on new cars? That would be the only reason I could think of why they wouldn't change it. ..."

I don't own a MY2000 car, so I don't know for sure, but I think I remember hearing that MY2000 cars' prices INCLUDE all service up to some mileage (50K?) or time, so maybe that's why they're not willing to change your oil (at their expense). Offer to pay for the change, and see what happens.
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  #28  
Old 10-27-2000, 02:04 AM
Ashman's Avatar
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Well like I said if my schedule is clear my drive is 7 miles to work. otherwise I am going all over the place, around the whole city.

You also forget this is LA... Didn't ya see the movie LA Story? hehe Its all true I tell ya

Actually I have to have my car with me as if I have nothing scheduled, I need to be able to leave when someone calls in for repairs.

I'm an independent computer consultant/technician/Internet Consultant/Web Designer.

My job requires me to be out and about servicing my clients with on site service, or at meetings for projects.

So When I say my drive to work is only 7 miles, thats if I drive straight there.

I live in the canyons, so I have other routes that I call the scenic route, which can take me an hour to get to work if I want. But I do run all over the place during the day. Some of my suppliers require long trips, and some of my clients require long trips.

Thats about it.

Alon

I'm really just looking for the best oil weight, type, and way to change the oil is. I've done oil changes on my other cars, so the know how isn't the problem, its the sspecial little tricks that people have that I'm looking for.

Things like Larry bible says, which is change it hot, change it often, is something that I think is a great thing to know, and also about the overnight draining to aid in getting out the sludge.

Anyway you look at it, changing it more frequently is what I plan on doing. I want to keep this car for as long as possible, and since I have no idea how well the previous owner took care of it, I want to make sure the car will be treated properly from now on.

Alon

------------------
'92 300CE
Metallic Black (Blue Flaked) on Creme
Clear Corners
Black Grille Insert
78k Miles

Future Upgrades:
Sportline Suspension
17" AMG Monoblocks or EVO II's
94-95 Tail Lights
Euro Headlights
Chip
AMG Exhaust

Click here to Go To My 300CE Page
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  #29  
Old 10-27-2000, 08:58 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Western NC
Posts: 30
I took the car to our local dealer (not where we bought it) and they happily changed the oil. I talked with the mechanic who did the work (great guy, BTW) and he said if it were his, he'd definitely make 4-5K changes a good insurance on longevity. I think we'll have regular FSS service done there from now on.
Before the change, the FSS was reading 5500. Right after the change, we put 300 miles on the car, and the FSS NEVER went up- in fact, it now reads 5300. Food for thought, your results may vary...
Mark
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  #30  
Old 10-27-2000, 04:02 PM
LarryBible
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Mark,

I'm making more discoveries all the time. I changed my oil at home Monday night. I drained it for an hour with the filter out, and replaced filter and poured in eight quarts of 10W30 Mobil One. The first time I've ever used it.

I spoke with my old friend who is a tech where I bought it. I did not know that ALL service is paid for by them except tires and brake pads. Oil changes, however, are at the FSS interval or with dino oil. I did not know that. I guess I'm dumb, but I did not know that preventive maintenance is free during warranty period. Also, if I bring my Mobil One, that's what they will use when the service is on them.

They use a topsider to change the oil. So some of my oil changes during the warranty period will not be thorough drain while hot type changes as I do.

The other good news was that he said that when the mileage gets near the end of the warranty, that he and I will put it on his rack and go over the car with a fine tooth comb.

Steve Brotherton recommended a few days ago that you get to know your tech, and that knowing him is more important than knowing the dealer. I think he's right on the money on this one, as he always is.

BTW. My FSS distance to service mileage seemed to increase just a little after the oil change. Evidently, the resistivity instrument sees clearer oil.

Best of luck,
Change oil hot and change oil often,

------------------
Larry Bible
'01 C Class, Six Speed
'84 Euro 240D, manual, 533K miles
'88 300E 5 Speed
'81 300D Daughter's Car
Over 800,000 miles in
Mercedes automobiles
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