ARG! K1 Spring Kit No Help!

[300EVIL]

I'm beginning to really hate automatic transmissions! This is the third one in a row in my Benz family. I just got home from my shop where I replaced the K1 piston springs on my 500E. (PITA, The exhaust is in the way of the pan.) I was "sure" this was the solve for my 2-3 shift flaring....... Obviously not! My last two tranny's (300E and E320) had delay and flaring problems and I rebuilt them both and that fixed them. I just hate to think I have another one to rebuild. The 500E trans shifts very solid in all gears except for 2-3 and just reciently started trouble. Is rebuilding the only option I have left or is there something else I can check? I'm not sure weather it's a band or a clutch pack that engages to perform the shift. I lost my ATSG book.... Anyone have any other suggestions besides rebuild? If I do have to rebuild, does anyone know where I can get Kevlar bands and clutch disks? I want this one bulletproof. (no pun intended....)

Any comments and suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
Adam

[david s poole]

the shift to 3 requires dropping the front band and picking up the front clutch pack and as such i would expect you to find the clutches worn in that drum.you can replace those and the reverse clutches with minimally invasive surgery.

[bhatt]

I have the same problem with my 300SL. Have already replaced the K1, replaced fluid & filter, etc. and it did nothing at all. Here's my plan:

1. Make sure the modulator holds vacuum, and the little plastic cap isn't cracked (search the forum.. these are two common problems).

2. Run a can of Seafoam Trans Tune through. I've heard good things about this. http://www.seafoamsales.com/transTuneTech.htm

3. Drive the car hard for a bit

4. Drain the fluid and replace filter.

5. Fill with Mobil 1 ATF, including 1 can of Trans-X (also heard good stuff about this)

6. Test car. Hopefully fixed

7. Take car to shop to have transmission rebuilt.

What does 'minimally invasive' mean by the way.. Is it something that can be done with the pan off, or does it require transmission removal??

[brewtoo]

Originally Posted by david s poole

the shift to 3 requires dropping the front band and picking up the front clutch pack and as such i would expect you to find the clutches worn in that drum.you can replace those and the reverse clutches with minimally invasive surgery.

Yes, I too would like to know a bit more about the meaning of "minimally-invasive."

Thanks

[300EVIL]

What David is reffering to still requires removing the transmission. From there, the pump housing can be removed to rebuild only the problematic drum in an hour or so. Rebuilding the drum on the other side of the planetary assembly requires taking the tail shaft, aux pump and govenor apart to gain access. A Lot more parts to deal with and time consuming. This is basically half a rebuild. I may do this since the rest of the trans still shifts hard.

[deanyel]

Originally Posted by 300EVIL

What David is reffering to still requires removing the transmission. From there, the pump housing can be removed to rebuild only the problematic drum in an hour or so. Rebuilding the drum on the other side of the planetary assembly requires taking the tail shaft, aux pump and govenor apart to gain access. A Lot more parts to deal with and time consuming. This is basically half a rebuild. I may do this since the rest of the trans still shifts hard.

If it's an hour it's a lot less than half - I think the book as a complete rebuild at about 13 hours of labor, R and R at about 6-7 hours.

[C32AMG]

Originally Posted by 300EVIL

I'm beginning to really hate automatic transmissions! This is the third one in a row in my Benz family. I just got home from my shop where I replaced the K1 piston springs on my 500E. (PITA, The exhaust is in the way of the pan.) I was "sure" this was the solve for my 2-3 shift flaring....... Obviously not! My last two tranny's (300E and E320) had delay and flaring problems and I rebuilt them both and that fixed them. I just hate to think I have another one to rebuild. The 500E trans shifts very solid in all gears except for 2-3 and just reciently started trouble. Is rebuilding the only option I have left or is there something else I can check? I'm not sure weather it's a band or a clutch pack that engages to perform the shift. I lost my ATSG book.... Anyone have any other suggestions besides rebuild? If I do have to rebuild, does anyone know where I can get Kevlar bands and clutch disks? I want this one bulletproof. (no pun intended....)

Any comments and suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
Adam

Kevlar bands never worked well in these transmissions, Kevlar will destroy the Drums, and you will also have shifting complaints. I answered your question in a PDF; I am trying to learn this new program, so I can finish my web site.

[300EVIL]

Wow, Thanks for the info Steve. I have an extra B1 cover at the shop. I will give this a try today and get back to you with the results.
Thanks Again!
Adam

[stevebfl]

It may be just me, but I sure consider half a rebuild false economics on a ten year old trans.

I also would consider it to be more like a 65% rebuild and would charge accordingly if someone could convince me to do such an inappropriate operation. That 65% number reflects the fact that the labor to R&R the trans is 33% of the whole rebuild job.

The most common reason for shift timing issues is a greater quantity of fluid required due to thinner clutches (causing greater pressure plate movement)and the loss of fill rate due to leaking worn clutch and servo seals. They were all built at the same time and have had the same life!

Since a rebuild could be the answer I'd sure see how much improvement a higher modulator pressure could creat.

[300EVIL]

Hey Stevebfl,
How much would you suggest I adjust the modulating pressure?

[stevebfl]

I'd start with one turn. Based upon the fix it or rebuild it concept I'd do more if the problem continued or until the first or reverse shift is unreasonably hard.

I would probably adjust the control pressure cable either before the mod adjustment or after the first turn.

[300EVIL]

So adjust the bowden cable to shift earlier right?

[stevebfl]

Yes, earlier. The idea is to have the shift made while your foot is still in it, not after it backs off. The change in modulator pressure is huge with a few inches of manifold vacuum difference.

[300EVIL]

I looked there doesn't seem to be a cable adjustment screw on the 500E. All I see is the accelerator cable adjustment. Is it on the trans end of the cable?