-35C took us out
 

Well, the mecury dipped to -35C (-31F) last night, and it peaked at a balmy -22 today, and that was enough to lull my baby into a frozen coma. Not cool. My roomate (former now) chose to unplug my block heater and forgot to plug it back in. I drained the battery in the 3 attempts to start her after that. I've since gone through the process of leaving her plugged in for about 2 days and trying to get a boost from various vehicles. Despite the boost, she won't even turn over now.

Could the oil in the case be so thick that it's just imposible to crank over? If so, why hasn't my block heater improved this condition. Or is -35 just to much for these machines to bear. I've got regular 5 - 30 in the case right now. And yes, of course, I now understand the importance of synthetic.

Do these block heaters heat the oil or the coolant?

A good friend and ancient MB mechanic / master greyhound mechanic claims that you just have to store diesel MB's in a heated garage here in Edmonton. I'd hate to think that's the reality. Any suggestions on doing it otherwise?

Thanks from the FROZEN north,

Joey Hundert
BioBenz
1984 300D on BioD

PS - the biodiesel is quite popsicle like at this temp. I'm not even considering running it.

You need to completely charge the battery, just a boost won't do it. That starter is going to draw upwards of 1000 A, no way you're gonna get that through a set of jumper cables!

Run the block heater overnight, and if you have a drop light, put that under the oil pan.

Check to make sure the fuel hasn't gelled, too...

Peter

What is a drop light? And where should I check for gelled fuel? Tank or injectors?

-Joey

Welcome to the balmy Canadian winter,
Your block heater heats the engine coolant, not the engine oil. Your 5W30 engine oil is still liquid (not solid) at -35C.
Get your battery re-charged to full power. A little battery charger from Canadian Tire is only about $30.00 and could be handy.

What are the specs of your Bio-diesel (pour point, cloud point, flash point???).

Forget the drop light at -35C. it won't help you.

my meth/esters were clear down to about -10. Clouding and gelling started at about -15. They've been solid since -18.

I've successfully ignited the fuel in a multi-fuel camping stove. So, it probably has a flashpoint near to that of kerosene.

-joey

The block heater, if it's working correctly will typically warm the the engine by something like 15C above ambient temperatures. So if its, -35C outside, and with the block heater plugged-in for at least 4Hrs, your engine will be at -20C. (ie: 35C - 15C)

The question is, does your car start at -20C without a block heater? probably not. So charge your battery, and try to start it when the ambient temperature warms-up a bit.


Phil

BioDiesel:
Don't look any further. At -35C, your fuel looks like a pop-cycle and it won't flow though an 1/8in pipe.
No amount of battery charging/boosting will help.

If you have biodiesel in the tank instead of winterized diesel, the only way you are going to get it to start is to get it up to temps above the pour point of the fuel.

A drop light is a metal reflector lamp on the end of a cord, and it WILL help, even at 35 below, if you can contain the heat (fiberglass insulation will help).

An alternative is to build a charcoal briquet (not wood!) fire on a piece of sheet metal and slide it under the oil pan. With a little luck (an no breeze) this will get the engine warm enough to fire. Leave the hood open, and have a fire extinguisher handy....

A torpedo heater aimed at the radiator works well too. a o tl I've had to start reluctant diesels in cold weather?

To prevent this problem in the future, keep the car plugged in (check, don't depent on others for this!) and make SURE you have the proper oil (synthetic) and fuel (winterized diesel) in the car.

You may not get it going until it warms up. Maybe in March....

Peter

No amount of drop light, charcoal BBQ or heater will get this car started....not before the fuel can flow through the fuel filter and fuel line.

Many years ago in the far north (Thule, Greenland) if one of our jeeps got
cold soaked we were told to take it inside before even trying to start
is as the oil would be too cold to pump around. Turned a 5 gallon bucket
of oil on its side with the top off and the oil just sagged a bit. Jerry

We just used the block heater on our E300D and had no starting problems at all, even at -40C. It is VERY important that you keep that block heater plugged in, as you have found out.

Got a roadside service? Try getting it towed to a heated garage, thaw it out, get it running, and then keep a bat handy to beat your rommie in the head if that block heater cord is touched again.

You'd better get it sorted out this week. The weather is supposed to break a bit on Wednesday, but by Saturday the REAL cold weather is supposed to be blowing in. "Highs" in the -30's.

When I lived in the NWT, we could see -55 to -60C. Block heaters were mandatory for everything (lots of diesels spent the winter running), but just the beginning. Most of us also used a coolant circulating heater, battery blanket and even an oil pan element. My Civic would fire at -60C, run decently on it's square tires (not kidding) but made little heat in the cabin.

There's no BioDiesel in the car right now, thankfully. It's all winterized diesel.

Think I'm going to invest in an adhesive crankcase heater too.

-Joey

If you have a properly functioning block heater, that has been plugged in for at least 4-6 Hrs, you will NOT need a crankcase heater.

The block heater heats the coolant, which in-turn heats the block. The heated block than heats the oil, and the rest of the internal engine components.

Its much more important to use the right winter oil than a cranckase heater. I use Mobil 1 SuperSyn 0W40. This specific oil, and grade, is recommended and approved by Mercedes for our Diesel cars.

See: http://www.whnet.com/4x4/oil.html

Phil

Ok, let's talk about the battery. At sub-zero temps, the battery will not put out full power, you know that. What most people don't realize is that a battery will not charge very well at low temps either. Bring the battery inside and warm it to room temp. Then charge it fully. A plug in battery blanket is a great idea in really cold areas. I like the idea of pan, block and battery heaters.

double check your block heater to make sure its working.whens its plugged in you should be able to hear the coolant boiling if you listen carefully with the hood raised of course.or check the plug with an ohm meter.you should see approx 35 ohms.if not the plug could be shot,cut it off and replace with industrial grade

[QUOTE=psfred]

An alternative is to build a charcoal briquet (not wood!) fire on a piece of sheet metal and slide it under the oil pan.


How long before the oil is medium rare ?

ether and heating elements...
 

Well,
After 3 days of being completely cold soaked, I decided to bring in the big guns. I called an old timer friend, MB mechanic for 35 years, currently one of Greyhound's chief mechanics. We brought my battery inside for a while and gave it a 12v10a charge. 2 hours later, we put it back in the car. In the mean time, I had positioned an portable electric element stove underneath the crank case. The smell was foul, however, it did warm the oil up a fair bit. Mother nature cooperated too, bringing the temp up to a balmy -5C. I can't tell you how warm -5 feels after -35, I was outside in just a long sleeved shirt.
Well, we installed the battery and hooked heavy duty cables up to my friends 190 diesel. As I cranked her over, Cyril shot a blast of ether into the filter housing. We repeated that process about 10 times, then we decided to warm up in his running car. We let my battery charge for another 15 minutes or so. Then Cyril got in my car and cranked it over. As the cranking slowed down, he shouted for me to throw in a shot of ether. I did and the engine sped up and finally roared to life. He squeezed the throttle for a full 5 minutes.

Moral of the story: the block heater requires BOTH ends to be plugged in (go figure), and -35 requires additional considerations (synthetic, battery heater, crank case heater).

-Joey

Man, that was a ton of effort to get this thing running at -5C. I am suspect that you have other troubles other than your block heater being unplugged. Well, you'll be able to see this weekend, as it's supposed to be in the -30's again.

I love it :)
Be very careful with feeding the engine with ether.
Ether has the very habit of digging some prestty nasty holes in pistons.

It also reeks havoc on glow plugs. It can also cause the block to crack, pistons to crack, connecting rods to break because (in cases of too much ether used) it becomes a non-moving obstruction at the top of the cylinder. I found this out the hard way on an Olds diesel that I had years ago. :mad:

As the previous threads said. DON'T USE ETHER IN A DIESEL ENGINE. Not even a bit, not even as a last resort. Its worse than playing Russian roulette. The odds of causing massive engine damage are stacked against you.

You may, or may not, have escaped its destructive effects this time. The short and/or long term effects of having used it may yet be determined.

Phil

Yes, I agree. I was able to start my car yesterday after soaking it at -10C for 7 hours. It was a little sluggish, and needed about 30 seconds to start firing (with a 617.952, do not touch the accellerator!). I am using a biodiesel 40% blend, dino 15W40 oil, and good glow plugs. I usually use a block heater, and even at -20C (coldest we've really seen this winter so far) it starts immediately when it's been plugged in for 2 hours or so.