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  #16  
Old 11-29-2005, 11:13 PM
Brooklyn,NY
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brooklyn,NY
Posts: 252
I bought my 92 500sel with broken engine. It has rebuilt transmission (po paid $3000), new radiator,O2 sensor,collant temp sensor ( for those 3 po paid $1100), new A/C compressor (po paid $1200), brake pads/rotors. Car is 8-out-10 shape with 150k miles on it. PO was so tired of spending money to keep the car on the road and when the engine broke he just gave up. He sold car to me for $1500. For the whole S-class so little. Its a shame that these awsome cars are that cheap now. But I can understand a person who keep putting big money into the car to keep it on the road doesn't want to deal with it anymore. For prices po paid to fix car he could have buy used japanese economy car and drive it hassle free. Probably that is primary reason for resale prices to fall.

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1999 ML430 Silver 135k ml
Smoked LED taillights, Alpine in-dash DVD player, 12" sub, Pioneer components, 2 amps, 4200k HIDs, ML55 headlights, 20" rims, mirror LED blinkers

SOLD. 1996 E320 145k ml. Burgundy

SOLD but miss it everyday 1992 500sel Black
Chime buzzer mod,Alpine CD/MP3 player with stock amp,Euro headlights,S600 grill,20" rims, BEST CAR EVER!

SOLD. 1990 300E White
187k ml,smoked tails,Euro headlights,17rims,Intake,12" sub in first aid kit,alarm/autostart,buzzer mod

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  #17  
Old 11-30-2005, 01:45 AM
Hit Man X's Avatar
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Thumbs up

I've been working on a '95 S500 for a friend up at a local shop for another car he has there I'm going to pick up. Anyway, that W140 is pretty complex beast... even for basic PM.

I did the wiring harness on it, misc vac lines, motor mounts, trans mount, service misc stuff, etc. It's almost as irritating as an LS400 to work on. Some of the front suspension looks easier to rebuild than a W126 but not totally. All the doors still pull themselves shut too. The car has around 130K mi on it currently. I'm amazed at all the on board computers it has...

If I ever opted to purchase one, I'd spend the extra cash up front for a better vehicle. The infamous Evap Core, working vac system, etc. I don't mind fixing problems as they arise but there's only so much I can keep fixing before the car needs to be sold...
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I'm not a doctor, but I'll have a look.

'85 300SD 245k
'87 300SDL 251k
'90 300SEL 326k

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  #18  
Old 11-30-2005, 08:14 AM
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Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 709
Quote:
Originally Posted by Col.Klink
Mercedes as well as all vehicles today as well as most anything other than a pet Rock are designed to fall apart after a few years and the Replacement parts ( IF AVAILABLE) are priced so you will most likely go buy a complete new unit and get cash back to boot although peeps do not realize it is their own Money they get back . Cars are Manufactored not Built as they used to be .If you can service these vehicles yourself then you can drive a luxury auto for a lot less than the Smuck who dished out the initial Shocking Sticker Price and lost 80 per cent of it in a few years .Buy two or three for patrs and Smile and wave at the Poor Folks driving the New Ones they can't afford...
Designed Obsolescence..... built like Diapers and Garbage Bags to de-compose in the landfills of tomorrow.

I don't think they all fall apartand/or have the nasty recurring issues like the evap core etc...which on my particular car that I formerly owned, was fixed twice...both times at MB dealers.
Don't think that if you are looking at one of these that if you see the evap core has been done you are out of the woods..it can and does break again..trust me

anyway..looking at the higher end Lexus and infiniti vehicles that have 150K or so miles on them now...sure they may be expensive to fix..but the don't have near the shop time..in fact that LS400 from the late 90's astounds me with its realibility...I have been told by some that have owned them for several years that they never got their money back from the extended warranty they bought...which I think is very interesting

For me..I paid about $2000 for the 24 month warranty when bought mine in the late 90's and it paid almost $20,000 in claims


Warren
1992 300SD(sold)
2000 BMW 740I
Columbus Ohio
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  #19  
Old 11-30-2005, 08:29 AM
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While I do agree that the resale value of the 90's MB's are falling, so is the resale value of every other car.

If you look at the competitor of the w140 the 90s BMW 7-series their value is thousands below the MB's. I don't know what the 7-series sold for new, and I'm guessing it was less than the MB. Even so, I would be that the depreciation on the two cars is pretty similar. You're looking for someone who is willing to pay 10 - 15K for a ~10 year old car. Obviously you can't expect new car reliability from a 10 yr old model (often with 100k miles or more) BUT you can buy a new or nearly new car for 10 - 15k.

Just my .02...I like the 140's esp. the coupes.
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  #20  
Old 11-30-2005, 08:30 AM
3 MB's and counting!
 
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But if you care for the car reallly well and do preventative maintennance wont it go for a long time?
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  #21  
Old 11-30-2005, 08:30 AM
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Too bad there isn't a way to bypass or disable the expensive gadgetry and just keep the basic car operational. If it can be reliably reverse engineered to the technological equivalent of a W126, there would be a market.
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  #22  
Old 11-30-2005, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skiier3_9
While I do agree that the resale value of the 90's MB's are falling, so is the resale value of every other car.

If you look at the competitor of the w140 the 90s BMW 7-series their value is thousands below the MB's. I don't know what the 7-series sold for new, and I'm guessing it was less than the MB. .
I think if you look at a 2002 S500( about $88,000 sticker) and 2002 BMW 745( about $78,000 sticker) you will find that the BMW was priced about where the S430 was..and is now valued at a bit more than the S500 is ..in regard to the 2002 cars.....so it seems that this falling resale value is going to be an issue with the 220 cars also.
I have already seen S430's(2002 models) in the 75-80K mileage range going in the mid 20's

by the way I do like the 140 coupe also...but the 220 coupe( in my opinion) is an even better ride


Warren
1992 300SD(sold)
2000 BMW 740I
Columbus Ohio
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  #23  
Old 11-30-2005, 10:38 AM
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7-series BMW are much the same

V-12s are especially cheap
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  #24  
Old 11-30-2005, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lkchris
7-series BMW are much the same

V-12s are especially cheap

I agree the 12 cylinder models...both BMW and Benz have crazy low resale
in fact there is point in life where I think its not worth anymore than the V8 cars are

another car that is going to be a real dog is that new Volkswagen Phaeton...there are 2004 's out there that were 72K new...selling for mid 40's with 5000 miles on them



Warren
1992 300SD(sold)
2000 BMW 740I
Columbus Ohio
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  #25  
Old 11-30-2005, 03:04 PM
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there are many parts to the equation of falling prices. the v-12's (750il's in particular) are dropping at much faster rate than 8 or 6 cyl versions because of the higher cost to fix them. while the cars value drops, the repair (at dealer level ALWAYS remains same as it ever was or rises.
then if you compare the 7 series to the 3 series, the 3's are holding thier value very well. A 1992 740il goes for the same as a 325i (given both have around 100-120k miles and are in similar condition).
the upshot for buyers of used high end cars is you can buy them cheap and keep them running if you fix it yourself. the down shot is that if you happen to get one that needs super costly components, fixing them doesn't protect you from the next expensive component going down a few days later. and when these breakdowns hit their stride (read..part after part needing replacement) thats when you break out and curse MB or BMW for making a lousy product.
in my opinion, buying new guarantees your car will depreciate immediately and you will lose 50% of what you paid in 3 years. for me, it's worth the risk to buy 3 years old at 50% and take my chances with repairs.
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  #26  
Old 11-30-2005, 04:03 PM
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Location: Phoenix
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raymr
Too bad there isn't a way to bypass or disable the expensive gadgetry and just keep the basic car operational. If it can be reliably reverse engineered to the technological equivalent of a W126, there would be a market.
Bingo - they have just not figured this out yet. If they made these complex, gadgety systems dis-ableable the car could age gracefully in use. They could be passed from one type of owner to the next, as older Mercedes used to be. It couldn't be that hard to do and if you consider resale values, lease factors, long term parts sales, brand image, etc, it is very much in their interest to do it - but I'm quite convinced they haven't yet figured this out and I'm not entirely sure that they will.
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  #27  
Old 11-30-2005, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tan man
in my opinion, buying new guarantees your car will depreciate immediately and you will lose 50% of what you paid in 3 years. for me, it's worth the risk to buy 3 years old at 50% and take my chances with repairs.
and it seems that if don't get rid of it after you have owned it for about 4-5 years..then you too will lose 50% of what you paid( or more)

yes..some cars seem to have great resale...the 560 SEC couples...the old 124 convertibles..the CLK series...the BMW Mini...some of the BMW 5 series cars...and definitely the 3 series ( in any form), the Lexus ES300 ,Honda Accord,Any Porsche

Warren
1992 300SD(sold)
2000 BMW 740I
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  #28  
Old 11-30-2005, 07:15 PM
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I saw two '97 S420's one on the East cost with 65k miles, the other on the West cost with 45k miles and bumper to bumper warranty till 2008. Both are one-owner cars regularly maintained at the dealer they were purchased from. I offered $15k for the east cost car and $17k for the west cost car. Could've had them for $16k and $18k respectively, but I am not in a rush to buy a car as I won't need one for another 6 months or so. I also saw an ad for a '95 S600 with 65k miles. It still has warranty to end of 2006 and 100k miles. Asking price is about $23k. I think the two S420's I saw are good value given their excellent condition, regular maintenance record and included options. Not sure what to think of the S600 with warranty, but it's really tempting.
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  #29  
Old 11-30-2005, 08:20 PM
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Once you get through the perceptions that seem to follow the W140s around, most of this thread is good news for the average guy. They are not possessed by the devil, they aren't unreliable (in my experience), but they aren't a simple car either.
Lets talk facts.
My W140 Coupe, in 1996, cost the original owner a bit over $105,000. That was a pretty significant chunk of change ten years ago. To me, its still a pretty good chunk of change.
Frankly there isn't much of a used market for luxury cars. Check any newspaper, its not unique to Mercedes.
I bought my Coupe when it was a little less than seven years old for just over $20,000 with 75K miles.
I bought it from a wholesaler, so the original owner got less than that. On my calculator, that's over $85,000 to enjoy this car for the first 6 or so years. The way I look at it, the heavy depreciation is over.
I drove it home, some 350 miles, without incident, on its first trip.
I'll estimate that its cost me somewhere around 750 dollars (not counting a bent wheel and new tires) in repairs over the last couple years of driving this car.
I now have 118,000 miles on it. Everyhing works as it should.
Just returned from a 410 mile round trip run with it... averaged 23 mpg.
I own 7 cars. Over the time I've owned it, the W140 Coupe has been the most reliable of the bunch, and its been the cheapest to keep.
Most folks that have ridden in it think its a new car.
Of all the cars I've owned, this is certainly the most enjoyable. Everytime I drive it, it repays me with a smile that lasts for a long time.
Because of this, I'm going to drive this thing forever. I've bought a number of spares and the electronic net scanner I need to work on it. (not included in the 750 bucks mentioned.
I think the bottom line is that they are a real buy if one understands what they are buying and has the ability to do their own troubleshooting and repairs.
As for me, I hope the prices continue to fall. I'm not selling mine, and when they get to a grand a piece, I'll buy a dozen for spares.
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  #30  
Old 11-30-2005, 09:55 PM
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[QUOTE=KenP]Once you get through the perceptions that seem to follow the W140s around, most of this thread is good news for the average guy. They are not possessed by the devil, they aren't unreliable (in my experience), but they aren't a simple car either.
Lets talk facts.
My W140 Coupe, in 1996, cost the original owner a bit over $105,000. That was a pretty significant chunk of change ten years ago. To me, its still a pretty good chunk of change.
Frankly there isn't much of a used market for luxury cars. Check any newspaper, its not unique to Mercedes
[QUOTE]

you are very lucky...and not a typical case. I don't think..as that AC issue ,that just about all of them seemed to have, with the evap core is very real. I have yet to talk to anyone that one over 3 years that has not has that occurance. And in some cases(mine included) more than once
As for resale amng luxury cars....look at any porsche vehicle..or evel the 2001 and newer LS430
As for the 105,000 sticker that you mentioned...I am absolutely sure that the car sold for WAY below that figure...almost like those GM cars that have that sticker but actually sell for 10-13K below that price
I don't think any 140 (perhaps the first few delivered maybe) sold for anywhere near their sticker..my thoughts are that realistically the retail sales were somewhere between 10-15% off the sticker price,,,,still a substantial amount of money for sure...but 10-15K less than the sticker


Warren
1992 300SD(sold)
2000 BMW 740I
Columbus Ohio

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