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  #16  
Old 04-27-2001, 01:50 AM
s60
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I think all MB owners got this letter but, it is intened for people with the Flexible Service Cars or any cars with synthetic oil old or new. There was no recommendations for synthetic oil before.
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  #17  
Old 04-27-2001, 04:16 AM
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When I read the letter, I had two thoughts. The first was that it was objective of them to list several choices as approved brands. Among them, Castrol Syntec, my oil of choice.
My second was a curiosity of the "why" of it. It occurred to me that perhaps this FSS pre-programed schedule was starting to show a higher repair incident level on items which could be related to wear factors caused by "dirty" oil.
I have ignored and will continue to ignore any recommendation that advises me to go 10K mi between oil changes.
That is why I don't need a full synthetic oil in my engines.
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Ed "Don't Benz's just feel better..."

Current wives...
2000 ML430 Skyview "The Mel"
2000 CLK430 Cab "The Cab"
85 300D Turbo "The Diesel"

Past wives...
92 300E
85 190E

"One should as a rule respect public opinion in so far as is necessary to
avoid starvation and to keep out of prison, but anything that goes beyond
this is voluntary submission to an unnecessary tyranny, and is likely to
interfere with happiness in all kinds of ways."
Bertrand Russell
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  #18  
Old 04-27-2001, 08:38 AM
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ML Dude: One thing to keep in mind in regards to frequency of oil changes in these engines is like most MB engines, it hold alot of oil. The ML engines in the US all hold 8 1/2 quarts of oil, that is alot of oil to keep contaminates in suspension. My advice in general concerning oil changes is 1000 miles per quart of engine oil capacity, and that's for non-synthetic oil. 10000 miles isn't so bad for a 8 1/2 quart capacity engine, especially running synthetic oil, and then add in the oil level/quality sensor and the FSS starts to make some sense.......Gilly
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  #19  
Old 04-27-2001, 09:36 AM
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I just talked to our local M-B service manager and he said they are using 0w40 Mobil 1 since that is what is recommended for our climate here in Tennessee. My car has 9100 miles on it and the oil has been changed twice already with Mobil 1 10w30. The FSS service is due in about 3,000 during which I will change over to the 0w40.
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  #20  
Old 04-27-2001, 10:38 AM
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Interesting. I can't find 0W-40 on Mobil's website, their tech line didn't know anything until I read them the letter, then they said it is only available in bulk to dealers. My dealer doesn't know anything about it and is using 10W-30. MBUSA's tech line knew absolutely nothing about to letter! Kuan, where do you get your info that 0W-40 will be available in stores soon? I can afford to wait a while if it will, but so far I can't fine any evidence of that. Perhaps I should just stick to mineral oil and continue changing at 5K as I have been. Also, I used synthetic in my 300TE (M103) and changed it every 3,750 miles. It seemed to make no difference whatsoever and I experienced all the usual M103 problems such as worn valve guides at the usual mileage.
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  #21  
Old 04-27-2001, 11:14 AM
apb apb is offline
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I thought it was generally better not to have more than a 20-30 point spread between the low and high viscosity numbers (something about additives).
I live in Texas so I have been using 10w30 synthetic oil with change every 5000 miles (my car is a 1997 which would require change every 7500).
Ow40 is a forty point spread which I thought was not the best (unless you live in freezing climates that would best benefit from the 0 value when cold)
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  #22  
Old 04-27-2001, 11:19 AM
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I, too thought the large spread between the numbers on oil was not desirable. Maybe that is only for petroleum-based oils. The way it was explained to me is that the 0w lets the oil flow immediately especially when the engine is cold. Then, it thickens up under heat to the 40. I guess I will go with it. I notice that many manufacturers are recommending 5w30 and 0w30, etc. Hopefully this thread will get some more comments and discussion going. Us Benz guys will argue and discuss oil until we die I guess.
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2000 E430 Sport (European Delivery)
Brilliant Silver/Ash Leather
Brabus Leather/Wood Sport Steering Wheel
PowerChip
Euro Front Bumper Strips, Debadged
E55 "Carbon Fiber" Door Pillar Trim
E55 Tail lights
E55 AMG/Bilstein Shocks
Eibach Springs, #1 Pads
H & R Sway Bars
Speed Yellow Calipers
18" x 8" SSR Integral Wheels
245/40ZR 18 Bridgestone Potenza RE960AS Tires

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  #23  
Old 04-27-2001, 01:52 PM
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The info I got about 0W-40 was from the club@mbz.org mailing list. I suppose I should have saved it, but I recall having read that 0W-40 is about to make its appearance at Walmart. Incidently, I called Mobil today and the guy on the other end of the line said that it's ok to use 15W-50, and that 0W-40 would NEVER make it to the United States. I don't know who to believe. After years and years of bad experiences with 800 helplines I tend to agree with the guys on the list!

Kuan
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  #24  
Old 04-27-2001, 02:21 PM
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Oil viscosity spreads..

I wonder if we're starting to sound like obsessive/compulsive people when it comes to our cars...

The way I have always understood the viscosity issue, at least with regard to "dino" oil, is that the greater the spread the more modifiers they formulated into the oil. Apparently, the oil can only be produced at the lower viscosity and have oil thickening modifiers added to achieve the flow characteristics of the higher rating.

Why was this undesirable? The thinking is that these modifiers have higher specific heat content characteristics than "unmodified" oil and thereby cause the engine to run slightly hotter. As we all know, more heat, more breakdown of lubricating molecules and hence more wear.

I do however believe most of these arguments go away with a good synthetic, but I still avoid running x-50wt if it's not needed. In my climate, it's not needed.
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Ed "Don't Benz's just feel better..."

Current wives...
2000 ML430 Skyview "The Mel"
2000 CLK430 Cab "The Cab"
85 300D Turbo "The Diesel"

Past wives...
92 300E
85 190E

"One should as a rule respect public opinion in so far as is necessary to
avoid starvation and to keep out of prison, but anything that goes beyond
this is voluntary submission to an unnecessary tyranny, and is likely to
interfere with happiness in all kinds of ways."
Bertrand Russell
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  #25  
Old 04-27-2001, 02:32 PM
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Hey there Gilly,

Your observations are always appreciated! I hear what you're saying, it's just that since I was 16 I've been changing that oil based on mileage or time.
I cut my teeth on a 59 Vdub who liked transfusions and valve adjustments every 2000mi. I learned then that oil is the life blood of the engine and in the 7-8 odd cars I've owned, never had any engine trouble. The rest of the car ages around my drivetrain.
I may not be O/C, but I am paranoid enough to think that MBZ has just finally come around to the profit-motive mind set of planned obsolescence in their products. I suspect that 8-10K mi oil changes will lead to engine problems around 150K mi. This would be 1-2 years past any warranty liabilities for the company and just in time for thinking about a new car...
Fine for most, but as you may be able to tell, I keep my cars for 7-8 yrs and sometimes longer. But that's just me Take care...
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Ed "Don't Benz's just feel better..."

Current wives...
2000 ML430 Skyview "The Mel"
2000 CLK430 Cab "The Cab"
85 300D Turbo "The Diesel"

Past wives...
92 300E
85 190E

"One should as a rule respect public opinion in so far as is necessary to
avoid starvation and to keep out of prison, but anything that goes beyond
this is voluntary submission to an unnecessary tyranny, and is likely to
interfere with happiness in all kinds of ways."
Bertrand Russell
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  #26  
Old 04-27-2001, 10:23 PM
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ML Dude:

I hear ya, I've been around awhile, too. I don't think MB is trying for a money making event by owners not properly taking care of their cars, not in there own best interest. I trust MB, so sue me!!! I guess if you can't "buy into" driving a car with an engine that holds 4 or 5 quarts of oil 4 or 5000 miles between oil changes, you probably wouldn't consider driving an engine that holds 2 GALLONS of oil, plus a pint, 10000 miles or so between oil changes, even on Mobil 1 synthetic AND a oil level/quality sensor keeping track of it and calculating out the optimum interval. Oil is alot better now than back in the 60's and 70's, and the engines are alot cleaner too. Cleaner at the tailpipe, cleaner in the crank case I always say (well, I don't always say that, but maybe from now on I will).....Gilly
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  #27  
Old 04-28-2001, 12:25 PM
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Maybe I'm getting paranoid in my old age, but when I was notified that the FSS cars now required synthetic oil the first thing I thought was MB found a problem with the new V6 & V8 engines (such as soft cam lobes) that may not lead to premature failure if synthetic oil is used. I know the FSS is used on other engines also but the vast majority must be on the new V engines, and calling for a switch to synthetic oil on all 1998 and later cars means they wouldn't have to disclose the problem on just one engine type.
I read an extensive technical paper(SAE#981443)touting the value of the FSS(known as ASSYST outside of USA), as evaluated by MB in over 2.5 million miles in Police, Taxi, and "Nornal" use, and extensive dynamometer testing with non synthetic oil. For them to now call for only synthetic oil is not consistant with the findings outlined in the SAE paper, and leads me to suspect a posible manufacturing problem.
Just something to think about.
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  #28  
Old 04-28-2001, 12:53 PM
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I've found two sites (maybe they are mentioned someplace else in this forum) that helped my understanding of synthetic oil for gas and diesel engines. http://www.vtr.org/maintain/lubricants-redline.html#recommendations A vintage Triumph site and Redlines own site http://redlineoil.com/products.htm look under engine oils. If anyone knows of similar sites for Mobil and other synthetic producers let us know!
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  #29  
Old 04-28-2001, 09:22 PM
djohanson
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For the informayion of Canadin MB owners I was in a Canadian Tire store last weekend and they had 0w-40 Mobil 1 in 4L jugs
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  #30  
Old 04-28-2001, 09:43 PM
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Tom H:

I believe ASSYST isn't a non-US version of FSS. Originally in the US (and elsewhere) ASSYST was the first version of a flexible (condition dependent) service system. I believe the only major difference is ASSYST did not have the oil quality sensor, only the oil level sensor. It also had the input into the instrument cluster and therefore FSS from the engine control module. Actually the oil level and quality sensor info on a current FSS system all come from the engine control module......Gilly
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