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94 e320 shift question
have noticed that the engine speed has been increasing before shifting from from 2 to 3 and when it shifts it shifts harder. Been looking looking at the posts and it seems it may be the vacuum regulator but wasn't sure since most of the posts cover the 3 to 4 shift. By adjusting the vaccuum regulator does that affect all shift points or just the 3 to 4? I don't live close to a dealer and was wondering if I can use another type or brand of trans. fluid other than the mercedes synthetic? Appreciate the help
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the vac reg/modulator valve doesn't affect shift points so much as it does Firmness of said shifts. Adjusting the linkage has more to do w/ shift points. Check your throttle cable/alignment of your linkage.
You don't Need MB synthetic in a .3.. conventional is fine. For cars that I drive Harder I use B&M trick shift synthetic. Makes for a very Positive shift! Jonathan |
You need to adjust the bowden cable, it controls shift timing, while vacuum controls shift quality. It's an easy adjustment on the m104 engine. With the hood open, stand at the drivers' side fender. The throttle cable is easy to find, it's below the plastic intake manifold and runs vertical, up and down. From there, look a bit toward the rear of the car - the bowden cable angles up and toward the firewall. It has a threaded plastic adjuster, and the cable itself is covered with a protective plastic sleeve. Turn the threaded adjuster by hand to slacken the cable. The specification is for no tension with the throttle in the idle position, though it's a bit difficult to tell the tension level. I suggest just slackening it 1/2 a turn, then go for a drive. Repeat until the shift points are acceptable.
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I finally got home after my long business trip and adjusted the bowden cable to bring the shift rpms down. when the car is cold (not up to operating temp) I noticed once it seemed like the transmission was not engaged. could rev the motor but no car movement. Trans fluid was correct level and clean. Never had the problem occur all weekend until my wife drive the car today, same problem. Plan to change fluid and filter tonight. Will check modulator for vacuum leaks etc but is there anything else to look for? I do not have any "check engine light etc" so assuming no codes. Car has 140K miles. Seems like the "disconnect" issue is in the lower gears.
Appreciate any help or suggestions. |
I changed the fluid and filter, fluid was not clear but not a burnt smell either, looked like it was time to change it. Drained the torque converter as well. Shifted normally but then tonight after I started the car and drove down a small hill and not trying to accelerate it was like the trans was out of gear for a brief moment. I stopped and tried to get it to do it again and it didn't. I did many starts and stops going on level, up hill and down and it shifted normally with no slippage, kickdown shift worked as it should Test drove for 20 minutes and it shifted perfectly. No vacuum leak to the modulator. Maybe running with new fluid for awhile will clear this problem up? Thought it might by the B2 piston but not sure. Should I run a cleaner in the trans for awhile? If so what is one that is recomended
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The bowden cable should be adjusted just to the point of no slack. If you're far off, not sure if it could give strange symptoms like that. If there's no vacuum to the modulator, you get extremely hard shifting (banging into gear), which seems to be the opposite of what you describe.
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I have run several things in my transmission (95 e320) such as lucas stopslip, and even some pumpkin juice (diff stop slip) and it has improved it (I need a new tranny, I'm just getting the last life out of this one before I install the rebuilt one). It is livable now, so if you want you CAN put the stuff in. In my experience on the forum, most techs here advise against additives.
If it were my car, I would drive it. I would steer my wife away from it if possible so that I could keep tabs on what the tranny was doing all the time until I was sure it was solid. If it does give symptoms, you will be the one experiencing them and can relay to the smarty pantses (not me, everything I know I learned here) here exactly what happened. On a side note...how are the shifter bushings? A really bad shifter bushing will actually keep it from going into gear until monkeyed with. |
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Increasing the vacuum may cover up the weakening clutch disc problem for a while Flushing (which you have done) will slow down the degradation of the clutch disc. Easing off fuel during shifts will also slow down the degradation. The only real fix will be new clutch discs. |
Drove the e320 this morning and no problems at all, Shifted nice and smooth. My previous "flair" occurred while there was little or no load on the trans (going down hill with no acceleration at approx 30 mph). Guess I will keep driving for awhile and see what happens. I have had the car about 6 weeks and drove fine when I test drove it. Have had other Mercedes in the past (all diesel) and never had a tranny problem.
shift bushings seem nice and tight. |
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Which spring kit are you referring to? the K1 spring?
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Hey 240, I found this among the tranny posts in another thread. |
Thanks Thayer, I'll do a search for that post so I can see the pictures. Car has been running good with no shifting issues except my wife said it did it this morning but she was going uphill and accelerating so it probably just downshifted.
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Thayer:
Looked for transmission spring kits at Peachparts (fastlane) and didn't find any. Is this a dealer item only? Based on the link you sent me I'm not sure which kit I need. Don' know if I need the K1, K2 B2 etc. I'm new to auto transmission stuff so please be patient as I learn the lingo . |
More tranny issues/questions
I have a K1 kit on order (and K2 as well) and will install next week. While driving to work this morning the car basically came out of gear between 3 and 4. I put the shifter into 3 and there was no slippage etc then put it back into drive. Came to a stop and the same thing happened again. Once the car was warmed up it shifted much better with a slight flare on the 3 to 4 shift. 1 to 2 shift occurs at 3300 rpm with other shifts at 2000 rpm. Hoefully the K1 and K2 kit will solve it........ If I put the trans under heavy load I don't have the shift problem. Are there other things I shuld look at besides the K1, K2 kit?
I'm in central Iowa with no close trans. shops that deal with Mercedes.... |
Yeah, sounds like the tranny needs some DIY love. Please don't let the tranny scare you. Just keep it clean when you dig into it...use the right tools so you don't mess up the little bits and pieces. Its just a car part :)
With that level of slippage, you need to make sure your tranny fluid is clean (I know you just flushed it...drop some out and look at it in a glass jar...let it settle and check the bottom. It may be still dirty believe it or not. Next step in my mind is going to find another car with a healthy trans. A rebuild can be expensive...and if you do one..it will take you ages...after about 3 or 4 you get the hang of it. But then you just open a tranny rebuild shop...so it doesn't make a lot of sense:) I had a long conversation with Roy about it and he was extremely helpful. You may want to just call him...he has forgotten more about this stuff then I will ever know. :) Good luck. |
Thayer:
I called Roy (great guy by the way) and he told me that it is a high probability that the B2 piston is failing and needs replaced, he said they sell many of these and it is a common part to fail. Right now it comes out of gear between 3 and 4 but in time he said I would loose all forward gear capability. I'm going to get the B2 piston (and extra seals) and give it a shot. |
Update
I replaced the B2 piston and I still have the flare issue when shifting from 3 to 4. I disconnected the vacuum modulator and capped the line and I did not get the flare. I was able to adjust the modulator (turned clockwise all the way in) and it helps somewhat. I really don't know what else to try except check the B2 band adjustment. Mercedes dealer closest to me (1 hr away) wants $3K to replace the trans. thye are offering a 2 yr unlimited mileage warranty. No trans shops close to me have any experience with Mercedes trans. Also thought about checking the governor to make sure its functioning properly.
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I did see this link, $1500 + 2 yr warranty. No experience with them but it sounds like a much better alternative than the dealer:
http://mercedesdismantlers.com/Mercedes%20Transmission%20Price%20List.htm |
I like that dismantler site.
If it were my car (this is what I am doing) I would screw the modulator until I liked the other shifts, and lay off the fuel during that shift. Do that if the flare doesn't make it impossible to shift. You know the rebuild will be there and will cost the same regardless of when you do it. Might as well suck the rest of the life out of this one before you go through purchasing another one. |
Before you start throwing a lot of money at this problem, check for an exhaust leak. A loss of exhaust back pressure will also cause the delayed shifting behavior you describe.
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Bowden Cable Confusion
:confused: I am confused by the bowden cable remarks.
Is the bowden cable the throttle cable? And if so, how is adjusting it relevant since, with the e320's electronic throttle, the cable is not even engaged unless flooring the accelerator on hard acceleration or when the electronic throttle is lost in limp mode? |
bowden cable tells the tranny when to shift. On his 94, there is a specific setting the Bowden cable should be. Look at it with a flash light, there is an arrow and a dash that you need to match up. that was factory though, and that was a long time ago.
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Thayer:
I don't know where the arrow and dash is located that you are talking about concerning the Bowden cable. I have been adjusting the nut that is next to the bracket. Have any pictures or tell me where it is located? |
Governor inspection....Can I do this with tranny in car?
I still have my flare issue and reading the Mitchell Transmission diagnostic pdf it says that a 3-4 flare can be caused by a damaged governor. Does anybody know if the governor can be removed with the transmission still in the car? Was wondering if I could access it if I removed the transmission rear support and let it drop down a few inches.
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