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Old 03-21-1999, 05:41 AM
Posts: n/a
What are the widest 17" rims for the '94 E420 without rubbing the fenders? i am think AMG Aeros 17x7.5 with 225/45 front, 245/40 rear and H&R springs lowered as much as allowed.

also, are there ways to improve performance like:
1)a switch off for ASR
3)better Axle ratio
4)and the costs?

i love this site! thanks a lot!!

MBs forever!!
Old 03-22-1999, 05:26 PM
Lee Scheeler
Posts: n/a
The 4.2 V8's in the W124 cars(E420 and 400E) have fender clearances that will only allow for 225 section width rubber. You can fit up to 18" rims but I wouldn't recommend it. 225/50/16 or 225/45/17 will both help the handling greatly. As always the lower profile you go the more prone your setup is to bent rims from road irregularities. If your after handling performance, then the cash would be better spent on stickier tires. Bridgestone S-02's, Michelin MXXX3 Pilots, Pirelli P-Zero's are all good choices. Prefering a tad more tread-life I ran Firestone SZ50's. They outhandle the Goodyear F1's and get about the same treadlife with the same "AA" wet traction. 225/50/16 on 16x7.5" rims is what I ran on my 93 400E and it did very well. The rubber came to the very edge of the fender but didn't stick out and the handling went from dubious to 4-dr sports car. Eibach makes a lowering kit for about $350. If you get the kit you will also need sport shocks. Bilstein makes those for about the same money. The tires never rub with stock suspension, if you lowering alot you may get rubbing or other headaches. If your car has ASR, disabling it will help performance. I have been told there is a way to neuter the ASR on a W124 but I'll have to check specifics... Diff change is doable.(the stock 2.24 hurts performance) The 2.82 from the 500E will fit but it would run in the $2500 ballpark for the conversion.(not counting other small headaches like speedo re-calibration) European E420's had the 2.65 from the 6-cyl cars. Chips are easy and probably the best way to add power without getting into 4 or 5 figure tuner bills. You could do all these things to your E420 or put the cash toward a 500E/E500. That is what I am doing. I'm picking up a 92 500E and selling my 93 400E. Since the 400E didn't have ASR and the 500E does I will research a true ASR defeat solution and get back to you. Any other questions feel free to ask.

Hope this helps...Lee

Old 03-22-1999, 08:45 PM
Posts: n/a
Thanks Lee for the detailed reply. I am also considering the E500/500E. What price range are you getting for the 1992s? I guess after you do all the upgrades to the 1994 E420, it will be close the the price of a 500E. I see '94 E420s with 70K for about $21-22K. I see '92 500Es with 60-100K miles anywhere from $29K to $39k in the classified 2000 in netscape. I guess for the 500E the only thing needed is Rims, tires and perhaps an upgraded muffler for a good V8 rumble. Everything else is done for you including a subtle Aero kit.

For 500E, If you use 17" rims, what is the ideal tire size? 18" rims? What upgrades would you do for your '92 500E when you get it?

thanks....this site is the best!
Old 03-23-1999, 11:30 AM
Posts: n/a
do you know what the specs are for Euro 1994 E420?

what is the best aero skirt kit for this car that is subtle and not too expensive? is there a good shop to go to for that?

today, i saw a hooked up E420 either 95 or 94. front skirt, side skirts and rear skirt. it looked great! wasnt too much just enough and with AMG rims not sure of the tire size. it seemed only lowered in the sure...but the car looked NEW. i mean better than the new C36.....if i can get an E420 to look like that and perform decent (never as good as an E500) i would be satisfied....

thanks again....
Old 03-23-1999, 07:51 PM
Lee Scheeler
Posts: n/a
Bodywork is one of the most expensive mods you can do. If you have seen a genuine 500E up close you would notice that the fenders are flared but so is the lower body cladding. It is also the sort of thing that once you begin, you can't really stop till you convert the whole vehicle without it looking truly tacky. ex: the front air dam is flared to match the fenders, the front fenders flare and are met by the panels w' lower body cladding of the doors, which go back to the rear flared fenders, that go to the flared lower bodywork of the rear bumper...etc. Each piece has to be professionally fitted, primed, and painted. That could run into the tens of thousands. Plus if you get done with this ordeal and for some reason it doesn't look "right" to you...your in deep ****. If you put the cash toward a 500E you would get the aero and performance tweaks with the added bonus of it being highly collectable. For best cosmetic "bang for the buck" try flashy rims(your own taste will dictate there) with a subtle drop. Look at the stance of my 400E in the "400E" review. That pic is of the car with stock suspension and the aftermarket tires/wheels. Depends on how much of a personalized look you are after. If you go for wheels, tires, and suspension but don't like it you are only out a fraction of the cash you would be by doing the bodywork re-vamp. Just a thought...Lee
Old 03-23-1999, 10:02 PM
Posts: n/a
thanks for the advice...
since the E500/500E has it all and more just that you pay for upfront instead of going through the headache of doing upgrades to an E420. Well, i will surely test drive an E500 soon. i really want to see what it is like. your 400E looks pretty good. my preference would to lower the car a bit thats all.

what price range of the 1992 500E are you looking for? how bout 1994? what price range would be fair and good? is 80,000 miles considered a lot? (from the miles i see MBs go i assume 80,000 is nothing)

Old 03-24-1999, 02:42 PM
Lee Scheeler
Posts: n/a
First off they are VERY rare. There are about 1/10 as many 400E's as there were 6-cyl cars....there are less then 1/10 as many 500E's as there were 400E's. Since the E55 just came out there may be more on the market just now than anytime in recent history. Prices of 500E/E500's can vary quite a bit. Try to make sure whatever you get has been taken care of(has good books) and hasn't been hit. $35-$45K for 92-93's isn't uncommon. $50K+ isn't uncommon for 94's. You can find ones with lower prices but you either need to be able to buy at dealer auction or have to be willing to look at a car that has something wrong with it that would make it worth thousands less. Finding one like that may cost a bit more than some questionable examples but you will easily get what you pay for. E500's will be the more expensive as they are newer. I am getting a 92 because the 92's had something of a performance loophole. The engine management is different on them. Benzmac can give you specifics but let's just say a 92 on full throttle will toast a 93 or 94. Partly for emissions reasons the "loophole" was closed very very early in the 93 model year cars. This loophole also made them more tuneable... Odometer mileage really isn't a big deal on these cars. The older the car, the more important perfect maintenance records become. The W124 cars as a whole just seem to last forever if properly cared for. (something rivals BMW or Lexus can't always claim) The 500E still has the old-tech 4-speed tranny but it has perfect gearing and so much torque it really doesn't matter. The only real trick is finding one.

Old 03-24-1999, 08:52 PM
Posts: n/a
first of all, i love this site!
second, i am glad to find an MB expert who has pretty much the same taste in the MBs models that i have. i have this thing for MB V8s so 420s and 500s are the only ones i would like to get. hopefully, with the E55 out it would drop the prices of the 500Es more. you are very on point about bad used cars vs. good ones. just got to be very careful about them.

well, after researching the market, BMWs are off the list. they dont retain value and seem to be so trendy "come and go" or "in and out" cars that values sucks and they seem to dwindle down to a Honda accord like status after a few years. you are ABSOLUTELY right about seeing VERY FEW BMWs even go past the 100,000 mark. i dont think they are built to last like the tank MBs.

Lee, how about a Euro delivered 500E? i hear they have more HP, more torque, are about 1" lower stance and other options that USA 500Es dont have. and the price is probably less. i heard the Euro 500E has about 20 more HP and 17 ft/lbs more torque. i am not sure, but the gearing might even be more aggressive. you will probably know more than me. Also, dealer auction is an option. do you think dealer auctions are good as well?

i am researching both options now and i will let you know what i find out. after evaluating things, it seems the 500E is the way to go. performance wise, it needs nothing except bigger rims, tires. Aestetics-wise, i would get AMG exhaust tips (can you recommend a good sounding muffler that doesnt cost $1000 like AMG or Remus?) and paint the bumpers the same color as the car. the black bumpers breaks up the continuity of the excellent mercedes paint job on the car.

where are you located?

Old 03-24-1999, 09:44 PM
Lee Scheeler
Posts: n/a
Any car you take european delievery of will be US spec. Any car you buy from europe as a euro-spec version will have to be imported.(and detuned to meet US emissions) That would make it cost prohibitive and a real pain in the butt. Pick up a US model and enjoy it...besides the 92's have more power than the rest of the US cars.(very close to euro's) The 500E is approx an inch lower than the 400's to begin with. The Porsche designed suspension is one thing I wouldn't mess with.(my opinion, tastes differ) Since the rear suspension is self-leveling, changing the ride height would be a big deal. Aftermarket wheels are different than ANY other benz out there. The rolling radius is different than other W124's and the offset is unique only to the 500E itself. Only AMG, Carlsson, BBS and a few others even make wheels with the correct offset/design so cost will be high. Before you change the muffler or tips listen to the car stock. It is way more aggressive sounding than a 400E in my opinion. Remus makes a muffler that might fit but it will be about $700 or so. I think Borla does also but I don't have a price. I'd advise you not to do anything that isn't readily reverseable simply because it is a collector car. Granted a VERY FUN collector car but its rarity and fun factor will make it perhaps the most collect able MB of the 80's and early 90's. Last I heard MB was going to send 4000 E55's stateside over the next few years, only 1500 500E/E500 cars came over here. Tires/wheels, chips, airboxes, springs, mufflers are no big deal to swap back and forth but try to stay away from anything that can't be put back to stock. I will obviously research performance upgrades for the model for myself. BTW gearing of the euro cars would likely be the same or taller than the US car. Mercedes has agreed to limit all their cars to 155 or less. The 500E is electronically limited to 155mph. Probably gear limited somewhere around 165 or so.(guessing) A real dealer auction you need a dealer's liscence to get into or bid at. They are strict on that one so the average consumer is SOL. Public auctions you will probably never see a 500E at in your lifetime. Of course I will publish any good mods Benzmac and I discover.

Old 05-03-1999, 12:02 PM
Mark Herzig
Posts: n/a
Just a note on the availability of the 500E. As Lee knows, I closed on a '92 500E this weekend. THe guy I bought if from just purchased an E55. THis is probably where a lot of the 500's will be coming from.
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