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  #1  
Old 12-14-2015, 12:59 PM
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Need Quick Help Please M-103 Head Gasket Experts!

Hey, I did the head gasket on my 91 300E 2.6 years ago, still running great. But I learned a lot doing that job. Now I have to do my daughter's 190E 2.6.
One of the things I learned was that Victor Reinz has different versions of the head gasket out there. Presumably improvements in material and design. Problem is, I 'm seeing the different versions on different websites, just like I did years ago. I would've thought only one version (the latest) would be the prevailing stock by now, but apparently not. Some may be old stock on shelves still waiting to be sold, some may be just old stock photos still being used when newer versions are on the shelves.

What I need to know is, assuming one version IS an improvement over the other, which version is the newest, improved gasket (also assuming the improvement addresses the notorious gasket failure point).

Here are the [at least] visual differences:
Version "A" has a light grey material with "Victor Reinz" repeatedly across it diagonally. The metal rings around the cylinder holes are continuously CONNECTED to each other. The "red seal" only goes around the perimeter of the gasket.

Version "B" is a much darker material. still has the company name repeated bur harder to see. The metal rings are separated from one another. The red seal not only goes around the perimeter but also comes inside at the back to separate the problem spots where the gasket notoriously fails.

This doesn't necessarily mean that "B" is the better gasket.

To see examples Look at the enlarged view of the Victor Reinz head set on Pelican Parts Site for, say, a 1989 190E 2.6. It is version "A"

Then compare it to the same application on Parts Geek, version "B"

Does anyone know which is the most recent version of this Victor Reinz gasket?? No picture on the VR website catalog BTW, and no one on the parts websites are willing to have their warehouses check what's on their sshelves.

Please help if you can, I need to order these parts asap. Thanks!

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  #2  
Old 12-14-2015, 01:05 PM
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Oh, and I would also like to know what kind of experience anyone's had taking the hub, balance and lower timing cover off an M-103. I need to replace the timing chain guide rail.
Any tips or advice? Is it hard to do without replacing the oil pan gasket? How difficult is it to remove and replace the hub?
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  #3  
Old 12-15-2015, 11:42 PM
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Still hoping for a reply from anyone who might have knowledge or an opinion on the head gasket versions.
And hopefully someone with experience pulling the hub on an m103 might chime in on what I might be up against doing mine.
I have the pulley off but I can't get the balance to budge. I don't want to pry on it for fear of tearing the rubber bond. any tricks to getting it free. I guess I'm going to try and use a puller to pull the hub with the balance attached and separate them on the bench.
I made a holding bar for the hub to remove the center bolt but I thought I would be able to bolt it flat against the hub, can't do that with the balance still there. I'm afraid the torque will just twist the extended bolts. Or worse, damage the threads in the hub.
If it seems doomed to fail as I try, I'll probably abort and use the starter method.

Also, if anybody who has done this a time or two can chime in and let me know the chances of not damaging the oil pan gasket when I remove the bottom cover, I'd sure appreciate it! Any tricks for this job?
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Old 12-16-2015, 12:37 AM
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Pry the damper with two bars ~180 degrees apart, wobbling from side to side.

Plan to tear the pan gasket. Cut it flush with the block and cut a new gasket to match. Glue the seam with a good sealer.

Hold the crank at the flywheel. The breakaway torque on the crank bolt is redonkulous. You'll likely twist apart any attempt to hold at the hub due to a lack of leverage.
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  #5  
Old 12-16-2015, 03:31 AM
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Thanks duxthe1.
That's what I planned to do if I damaged or pulled off the pan gasket. I ordered a an oil pan gasket just for that eventuality.
Isn't there a good possibility of damaging the flywheel or the teeth on it by blocking it? I hear of people using a piece of wood or a prybar in there. Seems risky to me. What I made (actually made it for another hub on a volvo) is a flat Aluminum bar, 2" wide x 1/4" thick x 14" long. It has two holes drilled that luckily match up to two of the hub bolt holes on the benz (with one hole between) and a semi circular cut-out to access the bolt with an impact socket and 3 ft. breaker. The holder is propped horizontally on a jack stand. I plan on using a long pipe on the breaker for max leverage. If I don't like how its going I may try the starter method. As a last resort I have a decent impact gun and a big compressor, but I dont like using an impact gun on a crankshaft.

I have a crank puller. One of my concerns is that I read that you have to heat up the hub in order to get it to fit back on. Also, when refitting it, does it bottom out when it's in all the way or do I have to measure it's depth to some precise degree?? Is it okay to tap it in with a mallet or is that not a good idea?

Thanks again
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  #6  
Old 12-16-2015, 11:37 AM
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You'll twist the aluminum long before you break the bolt loose. Seriously hold the flywheel. The hub will be a slip fit once the bolt is out.
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  #7  
Old 12-16-2015, 05:45 PM
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Well, I got it done. Although I still have to get hold of a torque wrench that goes up to 220 Ft lbs (about 300Nm) to tighten the bolt.

duxthe1, I really appreciate your input, and you were right the hub slips back on pretty easily. The aluminum bar held up well, didn't even flex.
I'll describe everything below for the benefit of anyone else that may want to try it

To break the bolt I made a simple holder from a 2" wide x 1/4" thick x 14 to 15" long aluminum bar. Two 3/8" holes drilled at one end that are spaced apart the distance between two of the crank pulley bolt holes (2 1/2" on center, which will leave a hole between them) and about 1/2" from the edge of the bar and a 1/2" or so from the end of it. between the holes I cut a half circle arc to allow the 27mm socket to freely turn. Doesn't have to be neat, just as long as the socket can fit in there. I secured it to the hub/balance with two 1.5" M8 bolts with 3/8" spacers (Steel bushings from the hardware store) since I left the balance on the hub. After it was bolted to the hub/balance i used a Jack stand to support it horizontally. With a three foot pipe over a 1/2" breaker bar the bolt came off easily.
The hub came out very easily with a puller. Best of all it could be put back on by hand and some gentle nudging. The Haynes manual said it would be necessary to heat it up to about 120° to be able to fit it back on, but that certainly wasn't the case here.
Before I attempted to pull on the lower timing cover I tapped it all around with a mallet until it sounded hollow everywhere. It slipped right out cleanly with no damage to the oil pan gasket at all. Lucky I guess.
With the cover off the guide rail and two cable ties around the chain/cam sprocket to keep the chain in place and a finger firmly on the chain on the underside of the crank gear (to keep the chain in place there as well) I manipulated the tension rail out on the left side to have room to angle the chain away from the workings, wiggled the sprocket off the cam and with some difficulty managed to get the guide rail backing out of the case (always keeping my finger on the chain under the crank gear. Manipulated the new one in and set the sprocket back on the cam making sure the chain is taut on the guide rail (intake) side.The bottom of the rail should be secured first. one of the rail pin holes will be oval which helps the installation.

Just to add, I've heard from several sources that using the starter method to break the bolt is effective and very easy. I guess you should make sure you just break the hold and don't let it turn very much!
For me, I already had the holder made from taking the hub off another car years ago and the holes on it just happened to line up perfectly. And I just wanted to do it the way I' was already somewhat familiar with.

Hope this info helps someone else.
Thanks

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