Findings on the 300E I went to see - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

yosshimura · #1 06-04-2002, 09:18 AM

Well, I went yesterday evening to see a potential purchase; 1991 300E 3.0. black/tan interior

INTERIOR-Good condition, 75K miles, no tears on leather, driver side door panel has a seperation about 4 inches long and about 1/8" gap.
-Center console- the wood has two portions missing about 2-3" in diameter each, right behind the shifter; not sure how that could happen.
-Steering wheel - Is it leather? b/c it was all pretty worn

. I have seen a Chevy Montecarlo with the leather wrap steering wheel w/106K miles and not near this much wear. Typical? Electric steering wheel control seems to work fine
-A/C, electric seats, windows - all seem to work ok. Radio - The antena made a noise when going up. Didn't see if it was getting stuck as I was driving the car at the time. Sunroof seems to work fine.

EXTERIOR- car slept indoors, which is indicative of the general condition of the paint - still good paint. Has 1-2 chips on driver side door and 1-2 on the passenger side - no big deal. BUT, driver side rear, just above the tail lights, there is a some body work needed. It has a dent about the size / depth of a Motorola StarTac cell phone (not deep in other words). So, have to take into account cost to fix/paint that section (they'll probably want to paint the whole quarter panel

).
-On the passenger side rear wheel well (right were the door closes more or less) it has a dent about 6" long (under the plastic trim piece). They have the trim piece new to replace, so, I might be able to put it back on without fixing this dent for now...something I can live with. BTW, the rear driver side lights were replaced.
-Trunk was just as clean as the interior.

MAINTAINANCE- Well, they have the maintainance book filled in up to 1995-1996 by local MB dealers. Then the owner said, since the car was out of warranty, she had one of the mechanics from the dealer start working on the car for her, so no records nor receipts

. She said I could talk to the guy, but that would be USELESS in my decision making stage, as she is his customer, and he isn't going to say something like, "oh, I told her to sell it b/c it sucks". I will talk to him if I buy, just see what he has to say, but not to make a buying decision.

She said they just spent about$2K- $3K in the a/c and something in the motor, but had no clue. Guess it would be the evaporator and maybe the headgasket...just guessing, as she had no clue

.

MISC - She has a store next to my freind's store, and my freind clearly remembers when she bought the car in 1991, so that confirms the one owner deal. She is selling it b/c she bought a used S430.

My freind brought up a VALID point in reference to the head gasket deal. He reminded me when was the last time I or he had a head gasket failure at or below 100K miles. He is right, why is the M103 so crappy that the head gasket would fail so soon

?

There is no way to verify if the a/c work was the evaporator is there? I mean if you have to take the dash out to exchange it, how would you be able to visually tell if it was changed?

They want $8K for the car. Does anybody have the black book price on the car? Kelly and Edmunds gave me two different prices that were off by $2K

So, I am thinking offer $7K, get it for $7K or $7.5K, and have to spend maybe $400-$500 and that rear body work (the one the size of the cell phone). BUT, I have seen advertised locally 91 300E for about $8K-$9K(not sure on mileage, haven't called), so the price might not be such a great deal.

Then, the crazier idea I had was........ instead of making an offer and then taking it to the dealer for the pre-purchase inspection, make the deal more attractive to the and just check the compression on the car myself, and off them $7K with the money in hand, so it might be easier for them to say yes and gamble any major problems (ie: head gasket / evaporator) which could equal the $1K I would save.

Oh one more thing.... I didn't notice any hesitation off the line, so I assume it was a later 91 and has first gear start.

Thoughts?

thanks

JCE · #2 06-04-2002, 11:17 AM

A dent the size/shape that you described was completely taken care of by a REALLY good paintless dent removal tech for $50 - it might be worth getting an estimate on that before hand, as it is the most visible bargaining point. (The wood on the counsel can be a $100+ item as well.)

My biggest concerns are that the $3k on the engine for unknown work, and a possible head gasket having been replaced by 75k miles. My tech feels that the head gasket should last at least to 100k miles on the m103 - don't assume that the $3k of unknown work wasn't spent on rebuilding the engine after it overheated and was damaged from a worn water pump!

My last big concern is that there are no records on the car from the period when maintenance really needed doing - from end of warranty to present. That is when the parts are starting to fail and need even more scrupulous attention than when new.

The interior and exterior of the car both show signs of premature wear - steering wheel, unfixed dents, and other things that would drive a meticulous owner crazy if left unfixed. So why would the engine and mechanicals have been maintained any better than the cosmetics? Remember, neglected maintenance on MBs is a killer on parts! I would pass on this one, personally, or else offer the lowest wholesale book value and put the differences into a repair fund.

yosshimura · #3 06-04-2002, 02:19 PM

JCE, thanks for taking the time to respond.....

You have a couple valid points.
1. If they didn't take care of the dents / interior wood issue, could they have given the engine the same attention? I will be thinking about that one. I do know, money isn't an issue with them, they are "well" off.

2. No receipts post warranty expiration date

. The first thing that attracted me to the car was when I it was mentioned to my freind (who gave me the lead) that they had all the maintainance records. Then I ask for them, and they just had them through 95-96

.
Other than those cosmetic flaws I mentioned the car shows well kept, so I am going to have to think about it .

Any more comments from any of the 50+ people who viewed the post would be welcome

Zeus · #4 06-04-2002, 02:30 PM

Well, here's my $0.02...

I'd echo JCE's comments. It seems like it's been a little neglected. My M103 has 260K+ Kms on it and original head gasket (only leaking oil slightly now).

She spent $2-3K on her engine and doesn't know what for? Her hair must be platinum blonde.

Seriously, unless she's rich and stupid, she probably knows or perhaps she's playing dumb. Either way, I'd be suspicious.

If you have a very reliable and honest MB tech in your corner, I'd get him to check it out thoroughly for you and then lowball her asking price if you are serious about the car.

Champa · #5 06-04-2002, 07:06 PM

Well the other guys here have good points. The mechanis might be just as negleted as the outside dents, or they might not want to spend on fixing it. How old are those dents?

Also my father sometimes does work for friends or clients and he always gives them a detailed invoice, because nobody, even friends, will believe where all the $$$ go into. Perhaps you could call the mechanic and ask him to show you the invoices where he bought the parts, if he tell you they are in the trash. Then if he bought them at the dealer the dealer has a copy of this invoices.

The antenas do make some noise, as long as the motor works you are OK. The antena mast is the one that usually gets stuck half way, and a new one is like $30.

Do the AC vents work properly when you change the settings in the climate control swithboard? those servos are another 1.5K worth of work is not done at the same time as the evaporator. If they changed the evaporator (as the say)the mechanic should have suggested they changed them too.

Look for scratches or any indication that the instrument cluster has been removed or disasembled. Watcha for wear (steering wheel, seats, springs) that is not consistent with the mileage, like you point out in the steering wheel.

Paying $200 for a mechanics inspection can be a good thing too. By having the seller present, you can show them in their face what needs to be fixed, and you can use this as a barganing point. Also get a carfax report.

$7K is not that bad for a 300E, if nothing serious needs fixing the price is ok. I usually commpare the prices in NADA, Edmunds and KBB to the ones on the paper and come up with a fair idea of current local prices.

good luck

yosshimura · #6 06-05-2002, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Champa
Well the other guys here have good points. The mechanis might be just as negleted as the outside dents, or they might not want to spend on fixing it. How old are those dents?
Also my father sometimes does work for friends or clients and he always gives them a detailed invoice, because nobody, even friends, will believe where all the $$$ go into. Perhaps you could call the mechanic and ask him to show you the invoices where he bought the parts, if he tell you they are in the trash. Then if he bought them at the dealer the dealer has a copy of this invoices.

By having the seller present, you can show them in their face what needs to be fixed, and you can use this as a barganing point. Also get a carfax report.

$7K is not that bad for a 300E, if nothing serious needs fixing the price is ok. I usually commpare the prices in NADA, Edmunds and KBB to the ones on the paper and come up with a fair idea of current local prices.

good luck

The dents have no surface rust on them, the paint is still there, not down to the metal, so it could be fresh.

Not sure if I posted b4, but I talked to Bill Ussery Mercedes Benz in Coral Gables and they said its $220 for the inspection. The guy was real helpful, even after I told him a 1991

.

I am going to go see the car with a freind who is also mechanically inclined to get an unbiased opinion in general. I checked the prices and trade in is about $5800. So, I figure if I pay $7K + inspection ($220) + repair both dents/paint ($500), I can pick up the car for under $8K, unless something comes up in the inspection.

I have some questions about these pre purchase inspections, which I am going to search the archives and if no answer will post the questions on that subject.

thanks

crash9 · #7 11-21-2007, 10:09 PM

Price seems way to high unless I missed something. Like maybe 3K to high

nissanzx1 · #8 11-21-2007, 10:31 PM

They are asking almost twice what that car is worth!! It is 16 years old!! If you work hard for your money, I'd pass... 300E's are a dime a dozen and don't be afraid of miles. Service records, condition, and asking price are the ONLY factors I care about when looking @ cars...

I paid $200 for my '91 300E, but then dumped a couple thousand into it making it perfect.

Good luck to you,

-GH

slk230red · #9 11-21-2007, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crash9

Price seems way to high unless I missed something. Like maybe 3K to high

Did you notice that you are replying to a June, 2002 thread? Now you've got me doing it!

crash9 · #10 11-21-2007, 11:45 PM

No

I was searching and didn't bother to look

So, why'd my idle go up to 1500 when I fixed the fuel pump relay?

vtxflyer · #11 11-22-2007, 12:18 PM

Well, now i'm curious, did you ever buy the car???

TheEngineer · #12 11-22-2007, 01:05 PM

I wouldn't buy that car! If you want to buy a used Benz, find one that is immaculate. Plenty of Benz owners are real finnicky about their cars and keep them immaculate. I bought one like that, a '95 E320 wagon. It is like new. The one thing that doesn't work is the driver's headrest. It was in such nice shape that I had to have it. Now I have to make a decision: Sell my Subi that has real low miles, or sell the Toyota truck or sell this wagon. I really hate to sell any of them. I's just not fair!

slk230red · #13 11-22-2007, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crash9

No

I was searching and didn't bother to look

So, why'd my idle go up to 1500 when I fixed the fuel pump relay?

I don't know why your idle went up when you fixed the fuel pump relay, but I wish I had your '63 VW Bug Sunroof...great year!

raysea390 · #14 11-22-2007, 02:03 PM

I wish I had crash9's '84 VT Ascot - had one and should never have sold it. Also had an '82 FT500 and a '79 XT500 - both singles. Wish I still had them all!