Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help




Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Tech Help

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-13-2018, 01:20 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
1987 300E eliminate transmission secondary pump?

Hello

My 1987 300E has a big transmission leak. The leak only happens when it is running. My mechanic says that there are 2-3 seals involved with the secondary pump and the are prone to leaking.

He suggested removing , eliminating the pump. There is some plate and bolt that is needed and a seal or two.

I understand that the pump is for towing. however with all the different cars out there most tows are a flatbed truck.

Any reasons to not let my mechanic eliminate the pump?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-13-2018, 02:44 AM
sixto's Avatar
smoke gets in your eyes
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 20,428
Two reasons:

1) It might not be the source of the leak.

2) If he doesn’t know how to source a pump delete kit, he has no business doing the work.

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon
02 C320 wagon
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-13-2018, 09:04 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixto View Post
Two reasons:

1) It might not be the source of the leak.

2) If he doesnít know how to source a pump delete kit, he has no business doing the work.

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon
02 C320 wagon
Thanks for the reply.

There are many leaks some are small and may not be addressed. The secondary pump has a big leak.

He already has the kit he has done many of them.

I am looking for reasons in the future where I will regret having removed the pump.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-13-2018, 09:30 AM
sixto's Avatar
smoke gets in your eyes
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 20,428
“I regret removing the secondary pump.” Said no one. Ever

Seriously, too many years on this forum and I haven’t read such a regret. On the contrary, a couple of transmission failures have been blamed on the secondary pump plunger coming loose at speed.

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon
02 C320 wagon
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-13-2018, 09:47 AM
tyl604's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 2,931
I am impressed that your mechanic was aware of this fix. Don't let him get away.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-13-2018, 10:01 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 2,580
m:

There are two dynamic seals: 1) The torque convertor neck, which drives the primary pump, and 2) The output shaft. All other external seals are static. None of them are touched by the secondary pump.
Curing the leaks, and eliminating the secondary pump are mutually exclusive.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-15-2018, 02:40 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixto View Post
ďI regret removing the secondary pump.Ē Said no one. Ever

Seriously, too many years on this forum and I havenít read such a regret. On the contrary, a couple of transmission failures have been blamed on the secondary pump plunger coming loose at speed.

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon
02 C320 wagon
Just curious have alot of people eliminated the secondary pump over the years?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-15-2018, 02:44 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyl604 View Post
I am impressed that your mechanic was aware of this fix. Don't let him get away.
The shop is Peter Schmid Transmissions, MZF in Burlingame California on the SF Peninsula.

I believe they might be one of the best if not one of the best Mercedes Transmission shops in the world. They have been around since the 70s or 80s and all the dealers in the SF bay area use them. I heard years ago, people in Hawaii would crate up their transmissions and send the to this shop in SF bay area California for repair!!

I am lock to live a mile from this shop!!!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-15-2018, 02:50 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Reiner View Post
m:

There are two dynamic seals: 1) The torque convertor neck, which drives the primary pump, and 2) The output shaft. All other external seals are static. None of them are touched by the secondary pump.
Curing the leaks, and eliminating the secondary pump are mutually exclusive.
Hmmm Not sure??

From what I understand there are 2-3 seals associated with the secondary pump and they are prone to leaking. This is not in agreement with your statements.

I have a large leak on the passengers side but only when the car is running, I believe this is the secondary pump. I guess you would call this a dynamic leak as it only happens when the car is running. I recall a few months ago sitting watching the car get its California smog emissions test the car was on the dyno for about 10 minutes and there was a good size puddle of atf, I sat and watching it accumulate.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-15-2018, 02:59 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
eliminate or just change the seals?

Hello

I am getting close to address the secondary pump leaks.


Giving it some more thought, I am not going to keep the car forever and was thinking if I just had the seals replaced they would last 15 years which is much longer than I expect to keep the car.

Thoughts? Should I have the secondary pump seals replaced or eliminate the secondary pump?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-15-2018, 03:27 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
related thread on mercedes fourm

Hello

I just found a related thread on this topic on the mercedes fourms, lots of nice diagrams

Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Sedan Forums > W126 S,SE,SEC,SEL,SD,SDL Class > Replacing Transmission Secondary pump seal


and here is an excellent reference

http://www.trocki.pl/szymon/automat/tranny_722_repair.pdf
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-15-2018, 11:40 AM
sixto's Avatar
smoke gets in your eyes
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 20,428
Clean the transmission and find where it’s leaking. The usual suspects on the passenger side are the secondary pump and B2 piston cover. There’s also the dipstick tube and Bowden cable but they don’t see the pressure to leak at the rate you describe. Maybe the cooler return line?

Peter Schmid isn’t the shop it was 20 years ago. I believe it’s changed owners. It used to be the preeminent shop but it has its share of unhappy customers these days. Sun Valley in Pacoima (SoCal) gets far more praise on this forum.

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon
02 C320 wagon
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-15-2018, 11:53 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixto View Post
Clean the transmission and find where itís leaking. The usual suspects on the passenger side are the secondary pump and B2 piston cover. Thereís also the dipstick tube and Bowden cable but they donít see the pressure to leak at the rate you describe. Maybe the cooler return line?

Peter Schmid isnít the shop it was 20 years ago. I believe itís changed owners. It used to be the preeminent shop but it has its share of unhappy customers these days. Sun Valley in Pacoima (SoCal) gets far more praise on this forum.

Sixto
98 E320s sedan and wagon
02 C320 wagon
If indeed the secondary pump is leaking should I have them just replace the 2 or 3 seals or have them eliminate the pump?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page