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  #1  
Old 08-16-2002, 11:36 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 119
2.3-16 rebuild opportunity

First of all, anybody interested in rebuilding my 2.3-16?
Or know of anybody who would be good?
Rough cost estimates?
It runs well, but blows some black smoke only when floored(no noticable lack of power).
So, I'm assuming it would just need to be freshened up (new gaskets, valve job, perhaps new oversized pistons, little porting while in there).
It has 180000 on it.
Thanks.

Meek
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  #2  
Old 08-17-2002, 01:46 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Motor City, MI
Posts: 2,791
It could simply be running too rich. If you post the year of your vehicle, maybe somebody here can help diagnose the problem.

If you indeed still want to rebuild the engine, post your location and maybe somebody can find a local shop for you to have the work done.
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95 E320 Cabriolet, 140K
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  #3  
Old 08-17-2002, 02:24 PM
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Posts: 119
It's an 86
I am in Indiana by the Michigan Border.
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  #4  
Old 08-17-2002, 08:45 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Motor City, MI
Posts: 2,791
How old is the O2 sensor in your car? A weak O2 sensor may cause your car to run rich. I'd hate for you to go through an engine rebuild if the engine is otherwise okay.
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95 E320 Cabriolet, 140K
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  #5  
Old 08-18-2002, 01:35 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 150
meek,

you might try "German Motors" in Troy, Michigan. it's a service center, not a dealership like the name might cause you to believe. it's just north of Detroit. it might be a bit of a drive but this guy is a magician with MB, BMW, Porsche. i use him for all my auto work i can't do myself. i drive 90 minutes myself to get my 16v there because i've never found a shop that does work as well as this one. email me at jasondew@hotmail.com and i'll give you the number.
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86' 190e 2.3L 16v
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  #6  
Old 08-18-2002, 05:40 PM
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Posts: 119
Thanks for the input. I 'll check the o2 sensor first. Thanks.
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  #7  
Old 08-20-2002, 12:41 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Old Lyme, Connecticut
Posts: 3,596
meek,

This can be an expensive adventure. My son's car, which was mine from day one until I turned it over to him with 200,000 plus miles on it, blew black stuff out the back under full throttle too. Oxygen sensor twice, and now injectors.

I would have a compression and leak down test done to check the general health of the valves and cylinders. If the test come out ok, and I would bet they will, why fix what is not broken? These cars are well built, but the overhaul costs are pretty steep. We had a burned exhaust valve and had the head rebuilt after 205,000 miles. The cylinder walls were like new. No ridge at the top of the piston travel, and you can still see the honing on the cylinder walls. No loss of compression in all but the cylinder with the bad valve, and now that one is near new too.

Frequent valve adjustments, synthetic oil changed every 3000 to 5000 miles, air cleaners and that was about it for regular maintenance. I was not frequent enough for the valve adjustments though and ended up letting it go for 30,000 miles or so on the last one, which allowed the valves to get too tight on cylinder number one. Consequently that cylinder's forward most exhaust valve burned. Other than that, this car has been near bullet proof. Never stranded me, ever. Had to push start it a few times, but never did not get me where I was going and has lots of life left in it. Good luck. Jim
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Own:
1986 Euro 190E 2.3-16 (291,000 miles),
1998 E300D TurboDiesel, 231,000 miles -purchased with 45,000,
1988 300E 5-speed 252,000 miles,
1983 240D 4-speed, purchased w/136,000, now with 222,000 miles.
2009 ML320CDI Bluetec, 89,000 miles

Owned:
1971 220D (250,000 miles plus, sold to father-in-law),
1975 240D (245,000 miles - died of body rot),
1991 350SD (176,560 miles, weakest Benz I have owned),
1999 C230 Sport (45,400 miles),
1982 240D (321,000 miles, put to sleep)
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  #8  
Old 08-20-2002, 11:35 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 119
How much are the valve adjustment service? Jim, my car doesn't roll well. I heard somewhere that I need to lube the front hubs, is this correct?
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  #9  
Old 08-20-2002, 04:30 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Old Lyme, Connecticut
Posts: 3,596
Meek,

The valves on this car require the removal of the camshafts and replacement of some precision ground shims to adjust the lash or gap. It takes a while and yo need new parts (gasket for the valve cover, and the shims), so look to over $200 unless you do it yourself. Not that big a deal as the stuff was made to come apart and go back together nicely. I learned to do it myself, and now so does my son who drives the car. It is an overnight thing as I measure the gaps, take out the hardware, measure the shims and calculate what I need. Then you have to buy them, and I am lucky as the dealer has a "set" of these that they have relatively little use for, so they usually have what you need. I do that the next day and reassemble. If they order the part the car sits for a few days. You will have this happen at the dealer or at an independent, unless they stock the shims in sets.

If the car does not roll well, you should have your brakes checked first. You may find they are grabbing a little, which is a sign you need to have the calipers rebuilt. Grabbing brakes heats the hub up a lot, which is not good for the grease. So, you might need to grease the wheel bearings, but if they are so bad as to affect the rolling of the car, they likely need to be replaced too. Bearings usually make a noise, like a growling, especially when you turn, before they get grabby.

Good luck, Jim
__________________
Own:
1986 Euro 190E 2.3-16 (291,000 miles),
1998 E300D TurboDiesel, 231,000 miles -purchased with 45,000,
1988 300E 5-speed 252,000 miles,
1983 240D 4-speed, purchased w/136,000, now with 222,000 miles.
2009 ML320CDI Bluetec, 89,000 miles

Owned:
1971 220D (250,000 miles plus, sold to father-in-law),
1975 240D (245,000 miles - died of body rot),
1991 350SD (176,560 miles, weakest Benz I have owned),
1999 C230 Sport (45,400 miles),
1982 240D (321,000 miles, put to sleep)
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  #10  
Old 08-20-2002, 05:38 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 119
No noises from rolling, but just doesn't roll well. Are caliper rebuilds easy?
Who make the best cat back sysytem for a decent dollar? all I see if eberspraecher and ansa? no borla? which of the 2 eber or ansa is better? thx.
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  #11  
Old 08-20-2002, 09:29 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Old Lyme, Connecticut
Posts: 3,596
meek,

Rebuilding the calipers is limited to replacing the rubber seals and some light cleaning of any loose crud. Anything more and you need new calipers. The rubber seal in question is the one between the piston and the bore in the caliper. If there is any pitting or scoring, or other signs of corrosion, the caliper is done. Trying to fix it will make the car unsafe and the brakes stick worse than they seem to be doing today. Some of this can be prevented by flushing the brake fluid out every other Spring as outlined in the manual.

As for an exhaust system, I replaced mine with a unit from Timevalve (www.timevalve.com) which is solid stainless steel, and came with a lifetime warranty. All I can say is the system is about 12 years old and has about 140,000 miles on it. It started getting a bit loud and Timevalve did a repaired it without any documentation from me. They looked at it, agreed it was theirs and welded a seam on the resonator. Good company, good product and good guarantee.

Good luck, Jim
__________________
Own:
1986 Euro 190E 2.3-16 (291,000 miles),
1998 E300D TurboDiesel, 231,000 miles -purchased with 45,000,
1988 300E 5-speed 252,000 miles,
1983 240D 4-speed, purchased w/136,000, now with 222,000 miles.
2009 ML320CDI Bluetec, 89,000 miles

Owned:
1971 220D (250,000 miles plus, sold to father-in-law),
1975 240D (245,000 miles - died of body rot),
1991 350SD (176,560 miles, weakest Benz I have owned),
1999 C230 Sport (45,400 miles),
1982 240D (321,000 miles, put to sleep)
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  #12  
Old 08-20-2002, 09:47 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 119
do you know whose muffler they use?
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  #13  
Old 08-20-2002, 09:59 PM
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Old Lyme, Connecticut
Posts: 3,596
meek,

I believe Timevalve fabs their own stuff from files they have for the stock units as they are included in the guarantee, and they are made of stainless. Mine looked and fit like the originals. Jim
__________________
Own:
1986 Euro 190E 2.3-16 (291,000 miles),
1998 E300D TurboDiesel, 231,000 miles -purchased with 45,000,
1988 300E 5-speed 252,000 miles,
1983 240D 4-speed, purchased w/136,000, now with 222,000 miles.
2009 ML320CDI Bluetec, 89,000 miles

Owned:
1971 220D (250,000 miles plus, sold to father-in-law),
1975 240D (245,000 miles - died of body rot),
1991 350SD (176,560 miles, weakest Benz I have owned),
1999 C230 Sport (45,400 miles),
1982 240D (321,000 miles, put to sleep)
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  #14  
Old 08-20-2002, 11:04 PM
I told you so!
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Motor City, MI
Posts: 2,791
Jim, thanks for the tip. And congratulations on you 1000th post.

I just wanted to add that, because of the work I've done in the automotive industry, I'm intimately acquainted with exhaust system materials. Timevalve uses the best material available on the market (short of titanium). For premium exhausts, most manufacturers use 409 stainless steel. Though 409 is better than aluminized steel....it's not nearly as good as the 304 stainless steel Timevalve uses.
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95 E320 Cabriolet, 140K
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  #15  
Old 08-22-2002, 11:37 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 119
Thanks Jim.
Kestas, where in Michigan are you?
Jim, weren't you doing a supercharger project with the 2.3-16?
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