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Cruise control surge
'88 190E 2.6, five speed manual tranmission, 72K miles
The cruise control surge is intermittent and seems to correlate directly to an intermittent speedometer needle flutter. I recall from looking at the cable some years ago that it appears to be sealed with O-rings at each end, so the normal cleaning and relubrication that will usually solve speedo flutter on my older GM cars doesn't appear to be an option. Both my speedo head and speedo cable were replaced under warranty, but they was about 10 years ago, so I figure the needle flutter, which is the likely cause of the cruise control surge is probably just an age phenomenon. Has anyone else experienced this problem? Does anyone know if the cable can be lubricated, or is the fix to install a new cable. Duke |
#2
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I think that the surge is due to your cruise control suffering the pains of old age, and not the speedo cable at all.
The speedometer is probably just recording the erratic speed that the cruise amplifier is causing. My cruise control did thisa once about a year ago, and when I inquired about this at GDI, Peter told me that the amp was in the process of dying. I haven't had it fixed yet, because most of the time it behaves. Still, lubricating the cable, if done properly, can't hurt and may solve the problem more cheaply.
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Semibodacious Transmogrifications a Specialty 1990 300D 2.5 Turbo sedan 171K (Rudolf) 1985 300D Turbo TD Wagon 219K (Remuda) "Time flies like and arrow, yet fruit flies like a banana" ---Marx (Groucho) |
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My cable is sealed like yours and any amount of lubrication, at best, would be a temporary fix if any even got in there. If I were you, I'd replace the cable. It is the least expensive component of the cruise system, other than the speed sensor, and can certainly cause the symptoms you describe, esp. if you are noticing a correlation. If it doesn't work, you could send your amp to Peter at GDL and have it bench tested.
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1982 Mercedes-Benz 300CD 1982 Mercedes-Benz 240D - stick |
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buy european bulbs and put them in the tail lights and brake lights first. Must have nickel bottom, not gold color.
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Current Stable: 1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey. Former Mercedes in the Stable: 1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now) 1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold 1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold 1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold 1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold 1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020) 1992 500E 156k mi sold etc. |
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Austin
I have read about your suggestion of the proper light bulbs before, but why? Hows the improper light bulb influence the cruise control? Haasman
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'03 E320 Wagon-Sold '95 E320 Wagon-Went to Ex '93 190E 2.6-Wrecked '91 300E-Went to Ex '65 911 Coupe (#302580) |
#6
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The resistances of the US bulbs are different than the resistance of the european bulbs. Give it a shot.
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Current Stable: 1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey. Former Mercedes in the Stable: 1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now) 1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold 1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold 1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold 1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold 1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020) 1992 500E 156k mi sold etc. |
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duke2.6
i'd check your tailight bulbs, nickel base only. MOST likely it's the cruise amp. www.calibermotors.com 1.800.252.6877 wholesale m.b. parts, it's where mine came from peter
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*92 400e 124.034, SOLD *92 300e 124.030, SOLD |
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I'm mystified by this bulb discussion. As far as I know the tail/stop light bulb spec is SAE 1157. So what's with "European bulbs"? All the bulbs in my car are original - never changed any.
The cruise control surge is worse in the freeway cruising speed range of 70-80. The speedo needle flutters intermittently with the cruise off or engaged, and when engaged the cruise control only surges when the needle starts fluttering. In the 60-65 MPH range there is no needle flutter and no cruise control surge. This is why I'm convinced that the needle flutter is the cause, not the effect. The cruise control keys off a speed sensor in the speedo head. I'm going to add a new speedo cable to my list of parts to get/things to do, but I'd like to get to the bottom of this bulb business. Duke |
#9
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The impression is that the cruise control amplifier circuit reads the resistance from the brake light and due to MB's "design" a difference in the resistance can cause damage to the amplifier circuit. Since the OEM bulbs are so cheap, why risk it. The most common problem with 80-90's MB cruise controls is the fragile circuit boards and their tendency to break solder joints (age, vibration). Over time, the weakening joints slowly deteriorate the electrical connection on the board, showing up as eratic cruise operation, until eventual failure.
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Stoplight bulbs and ctruise control
The Cruise control shuts off when you tap on the brakes, and the way it knows this is when the brake light comes on.
Presumeably, if the resistence of the specific brake light bulb is not what the Cruise control expects, then it won't work. I don't think this could logically cause the sort of problem you are having. I am not an electrician, so please don't take this as gospel. Now that you say that the speeedo nedle bounces even with the Cruise Control off, it seems more possible that the speedometer cable or one of its connectors is at fault. A new speedo cable is sure to cost less than an overhaul of the CC. Good luck getting this to work.
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Semibodacious Transmogrifications a Specialty 1990 300D 2.5 Turbo sedan 171K (Rudolf) 1985 300D Turbo TD Wagon 219K (Remuda) "Time flies like and arrow, yet fruit flies like a banana" ---Marx (Groucho) |
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Dont use 1157 1156 or any other american bulbs, they dont work right.
www.sylvania.com http://www.sylvania.com/auto/carapp/ which is really osram who makes bumbs for mercedes High & low beam headlamp Part number = 9004 Upgrade Part Number = 9004ST "Silverstar High Performance Halogen Upgrade - Whitest, Brightest, 100% Street Legal" Upgrade Part Number = 9004CB Cool Blue Halogen Upgrade - White Hot; Super Cool; 100% Street Legal Upgrade Part Number = 9004XV XtraVision Halogen Upgrade - Up to 20% Brighter than standard Upgrade Part Number = 9004LL Long Life Halogen Upgrade - Lasts two and a half times longer Parking light Part number = 7528 Front turn signal Part number = 7528 Rear turn signal Part number = 7506 Tail light Part number = 5008 Stop light Part number = 7506 Fog/Driving light Part number = H3-55W License plate Part number = 6418 Back up light Part number = 7506 Front sidemarker Part number = 7528 Rear sidemarker Part number = 5008 Glove box Part number = 6418 Map light Part number = 64111 Part number = 6418 Dome light Part number = 6411 Trunk/Cargo area Part number = 6411 Instrument-general Part number = 2721 Hi-beam indicator Part number = 2721 Seat belt indicator Part number = 2721 Brake warning Part number = 2721 Automatic transmission indicator Part number = 2721 Directional signal indicator Part number = 2721
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Current Stable: 1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey. Former Mercedes in the Stable: 1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now) 1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold 1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold 1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold 1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold 1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020) 1992 500E 156k mi sold etc. |
#12
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7506 is the number you want from sylvania, you can get them at checker or autozone. I dont like wagner bulbs, I only buy syvania or hella bulbs.
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Current Stable: 1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey. Former Mercedes in the Stable: 1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now) 1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold 1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold 1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold 1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold 1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020) 1992 500E 156k mi sold etc. |
#13
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if you guys want to read more on this 'nickel based' bulb theory, do a search.
i found it mentioned A LOT when i was re-searching my cruise problems. maybe there is something to this, maybe not. if my car prefers nickel based bulbs, so be it. it's just as easy to grab those, as it is the 'brass' looking ones. peter
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*92 400e 124.034, SOLD *92 300e 124.030, SOLD |
#14
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Or you could go to the mercedes dealer, and tell them you want bulbs, and they come in these really cute card board boxes or a plastic pillow for 6 dollars each...
Autozone 3.99 I believe for two.
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Current Stable: 1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey. Former Mercedes in the Stable: 1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now) 1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold 1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold 1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold 1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold 1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020) 1992 500E 156k mi sold etc. |
#15
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Duke2.6:
The tailight bulb theory is often compared to urban myths, but there are people who claim them to have been the problem. Whatever you do, if you decide to change the bulbs out don't go drinking with any attractive women and pass out in a hotel room...you'll be sure to wake up missing a kidney, but with a nice suture line. Search for it here and see for yourself. Like Richard, I doubt your symptoms are consistent with any of their experiences. One of the reasons these cruise systems are such a PITA is because they are very accurate. The speedocable has a magnet on it, and the speed sensor picks up the frequency of that magnets rotation past itself. The cruise system is actually trying to maintain that frequency of rotation, thus, if it is intermittent as you describe, the cruise control will stay busy trying to adjust it and surge as a result. Be careful to not burn up your actuator, it's working overtime due to the fluctuating signal. My money's on the cable...
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1982 Mercedes-Benz 300CD 1982 Mercedes-Benz 240D - stick |
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