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  #1  
Old 05-20-2004, 02:25 PM
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Location: Mojave Desert, CA
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Can I go back to R12 from Freeze12??

Right after I bought my 89 300E, I took it to have my A/C recharged. They did a leak detection and found none but suggested I use Freeze12.

What did I know?? This was before I found this forum.

Now I'm reading horror stories in this forum about my car exploding from Freeze12 (20% propane, etc) and am scared to death!!

Can I have my A/C flushed thoroughly and go back to R12 or have I ruined it?

I live in the desert and don't want to convert to R134 because it is in the 100's out here in the summer.
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  #2  
Old 05-20-2004, 03:34 PM
LarryBible
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Flush all connections, rinse compressor with mineral oil, replace the r/d, evacuate and recharge.

Good luck,
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  #3  
Old 05-20-2004, 06:24 PM
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R/D?

Thank you for your reply...but what does 'replace the r/d' mean?

Just want to be sure it's done correctly.

AdMaven
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  #4  
Old 05-20-2004, 06:33 PM
engatwork's Avatar
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Receiver dryer. It is the part with the freon "site glass" in the top of it.
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  #5  
Old 05-20-2004, 06:37 PM
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Is that a part I can order by just searching it?
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  #6  
Old 05-20-2004, 08:59 PM
LarryBible
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Yes it may be called filter/drier or reciever/dryer. It has a dessicant inside that retains some of the moisture that might not get evacuated. It also has a screen. It is also usually the place where the high side sensors are attached.

Good luck,
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  #7  
Old 05-21-2004, 12:11 PM
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Ok, I found where to get the receiver/dryer.

Before I pounce on my mechanic, can anyone provide links (other than to the archives/posts here) about cars exploding, etc?

I have searched the net for information to show him and haven't found anything.

Thanks!
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  #8  
Old 05-21-2004, 12:12 PM
G-Benz's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally posted by AdMaven
Before I pounce on my mechanic, can anyone provide links (other than to the archives/posts here) about cars exploding, etc?

I have searched the net for information to show him and haven't found anything.

Thanks!
Check the Al Queda site! :p
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  #9  
Old 05-21-2004, 12:19 PM
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Too Funny!

Seriously, I had to give him info on Dex-Cool when he switched my Dakota to it during a service! There was a ton of into documented on the problems and he flushed out my radiator N/C after he read what I brought him.

:p
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  #10  
Old 05-21-2004, 12:50 PM
LarryBible
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I don't know of any cases where an explosion occurred, but I do know that flammable refrigerants are against the law in 18 states.

Good luck,
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  #11  
Old 05-21-2004, 01:20 PM
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The EPA's site has this information:

"Although some blends contain flammable components, all blends that are Acceptable Subject to Use Conditions are nonflammable as blended." (*footnote for Butane)

Freeze 12 was listed as acceptable (with conditions such as fittings, labeling, etc).

Unacceptable:
OZ-12
R-176
HC-12a
DURACOOL-12a
R-405a

The following 18 states ban the use of flammable refrigerants such as HC-12aŽ and DURACOOL 12aŽ in motor vehicle air conditioning, regardless of the original refrigerant: Arkansas, Arizona, Connecticut, Florida, Idaho, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Louisiana, Maryland, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Texas, Utah, Virginia, Wisconsin, Washington, and the District of Columbia.

Not trying to argue here...just trying to understand and document so I can take this to my mechanic.
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  #12  
Old 05-21-2004, 01:33 PM
I told you so!
 
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Personally, I think hydrocarbon refrigerants (HC-12a, Duracool) are a good choice for refrigerant.... very popular in Australia. The only thing that would keep me from using it is if:

1. You live in a state where it's banned.
2. You don't do your own automotive repair. (HC refrigerants will contaminate recovery systems).
3. You're worried about insurance ramifications in the unlikely event you're the first person that has something disasterous happen to them.

There have been no documented cases of fire disasters with this refrigerant in the car. I would leave your car the way it is and enjoy the cold air.
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  #13  
Old 05-21-2004, 02:17 PM
LarryBible
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Keep in mind that the snake oil refrigerants that are NOT flammable are BLENDS. When you have a leak, the components leak at different rates. To get the system charged correctly again, you have to empty (recover) the remaining refrigerant, evacuate and recharge from scratch.

Another serious downside to the use of this junk is that it is often put in a system without labeling or installing the correct fittings in spite of the fact that this is illegal. This results in the poor folks that are trying to make a living in the auto a/c business mistakenly recovering it into a tank of 134 or 12 resulting in the entire vessel being contaminated. A big problem for these hard working souls.

It really amazes me to see how often someone will spend $500 or $1,000 or more on compressors, condensors, evaporators and who knows what all and then scrimp to save $50 or less to use a junk refrigerant.

I personally find no reason to use any of this junk. I will only use 134 or 12.

Have a great day,
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  #14  
Old 05-21-2004, 02:17 PM
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All the different gases use different fittings. You would need to change fittings too. My mechanic will test the gas, if its not 12 or 134, he will tellyou to take a hike. Most reputable shops will not deal with "bandit" gases.
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  #15  
Old 05-21-2004, 05:17 PM
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Since you're concerned about the explosion of the sealed A/C system, you may want to remove the gasoline from your fuel system. I hear that it is VERY flammable!! Seriously though, if you have to provide tech help to your tech, maybe you need a new tech!!
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