found Black on black '78' 6.9

[Brent Laatsch]

This car has been sitting in the same parking lot for a couple of years. It is only about three to four inches off the ground. Very light front left quarter panel damage plus euro head light trashed also. No rust, excuse me-only on the damaged panel. Doesn't look like it would run unless some engine tuning were done. 137K on odo. Give me some insight?

[alabbasi]

Possible suspension issues, more then likley. You need to figure out if it will run. I would have it checked out by an expert. These cars are expensive to repair. I know because I am smack bang in the middle of restoring one. Black on black.... fantastic. I got green on green.
If you want expert advice go to http://www.m-100.cc that is a site dedicated to the 6.3 and 6.9. I wish I could give you more advice. I got a mechanically sound car with a shot body.

[gerryvz]

It's a $1,000 car at best. You are probably talking several thousand dollars just to get the car running and the suspension in good enough shape to stay up whilst driving.

Save your money, and spend $10K and get a well cared-for 6.9 that has all of the issues taken care of. In the long run, your pocketbook will thank you. It's a great time to buy 6.9s as the prices of them have never been so depressed as now.

I sold my perfect 6.9 (80,000 original California miles) for $11,000 and was damned glad to get that much for it...

Cheers,
Gerry

[300SDog]

DIY repair??

Special considerations for waking up the engine include flushing the cylinders with marvel mystery oil then a regular oil change, clean the injector tips and electric fuel pump of gasoline/varnish deposits and possibly flush out the fuel tank too. That's about all it might need to get the engine operative.

If you omit some of these measures, then you risk burning up the $650 fuel pump, scoring the bores and cracking the rings.

What's the deal with 4" clearance - 4 flat tires? Nope, I think the '78 116 has the rare final version of the famous air suspension.

Cheapest and easiest for the long haul might be conversion to regular spring suspension using junkyard parts. But nobody knows for sure because you might never find anybody anywhere who knows anything about troubleshooting and repairing the air suspension on the 116. Among Vintage MB fans, that's sacred science. But I hope one of the MB gurus from Stuttgart or somebody else will visit this thread and prove I'm wrong.

Here's my base assessment, doing your own work:

$500 (or free w/salvage title) for the 6.9
$150 junkyard suspension air to spring conversion parts
$450 fiddly bits, a couple of injectors, rubbers, battery, etc
$150 bolt on sheetmetal fender (used)
$ 75 Euro headlight

Okay, that's $1325 for a fully operative deluxe land yacht doing your own grunt work......... Now DOUBLE that figure for unknown variables (muffler, tranny probs, electr windows, etc) and realistically it's at least a $2,500 car.

And if you outsource mechanical labor, you can DOUBLE it again to $5,000 for everything including fender paint to match the rest of the car. That's 10 times the original $500 purchase price, isnt it?

Good Luck and Git Er Done, says me

[alabbasi]

I would double it again for good measure, call it interior, electrical and rust bits.

[Emmerich]

Originally Posted by 240DieselDog

DIY repair??

$500 (or free w/salvage title) for the 6.9
$150 junkyard suspension air to spring conversion parts
$450 fiddly bits, a couple of injectors, rubbers, battery, etc
$150 bolt on sheetmetal fender (used)
$ 75 Euro headlight

Good Luck and Git Er Done, says me

First off, it is not an air suspension - it is hydraulic. Second, converting to springs is non-trivial. There are kits to do it. I don't know that a conversion is any less expensive than redoing the hydraulics. A fuel pump is not $600, I paid about $150 for mine, new.

You could do this on the cheap, anything is possible. But I would not describe the process as easy or quick, even if you have the mechanical ability to do it yourself.

Gerry is right, spend the money for a good solid car and spend your time driving instead of fixing. Unless you get a kick out of fixing. And fixing.

[ctaylor738]

... but where's the challenge in that? Some of us are rescuers and renovators and problem solvers and fixers and are almost blind to the economics. What do you do with a good car - spend quality time waxing it?

Sorry - had to say it. I would rather (and have too often) spend the money and time to bring a car back.

[alabbasi]

I have owned a few cars before, many of which have been fixer uppers. The Mercedes Benz E420 is the only car that I have bought expecting it to be perfect. Even though it is a fantastic car, I must say I do get a massive buzz out of bringing cars back.

I will tell you if that buzz is still around by the time I get done with my 6.9.

[gerryvz]

Originally Posted by ctaylor738

... but where's the challenge in that? Some of us are rescuers and renovators and problem solvers and fixers and are almost blind to the economics. What do you do with a good car - spend quality time waxing it?

Because with a 6.3, 6.9 or 600, the challenge is multiplied several times over a normal 116 or 109, etc. The parts cost, if you are not prepared for it, WILL (not can, or could, but WILL) bankrupt you. And throwing parts at a fixer-upper M-100 car, rather than rebuilding replacing entire systems whole-hog, never truly fixes the problem nor allows one to enjoy the car as it was intended to be enjoyed.

Sure some DIY maintenance and fixing is great, and you get satisfaction and save lots of bucks at the same time. But attempting to take on a 6.9, if you don't know what to expect or don't know what you are doing, is tantamount to a free trip to the crazy farm, the poor house, or the grave !

Isn't the purpose of a vehicle to be DRIVEN, not sit in a garage bay most of its life being fixed or waiting for an owner to fix it? Personally, after having owned these cars for many years, I prefer to drive them rather than fix them. I guess others have different priorities.

In case you haven't seen it, you may want to look at the following document (you will need Adobe Acrobat Reader) for more information:

http://homepage.mac.com/gerryvz/M-100_0.9.pdf

Cheers,
Gerry

[alabbasi]

I love that PDF, it scares the crap out of me everytime I see it

[Toxicant]

What I would do is drain the gas out of the tank, put some gas in and a battery and crank it up. Of course check all the fluids first but these cars are solid as a brick.

If the car just cranks, or does start but runs poorly remove the warm up compinsator and clean the old gas out of it. It's on the rh front of the engine, has one two wire connector and two vac lines and two fuel lines. If you ever get that far, e-mail me and I'll tell you how to do it.

If the car does start give it about 15 mins to pump up the susp. After they sit for a long time it will take some time to build pressure. If you don't know anything about these cars there is a tank under the hood, LH side. Big silver cap with a dip stick attached. This is the fluid for the susp. takes special fluid you can get at the dealer or many aftermarket mb suppliers. Of course this is one of the fluids you should top off before cranking.

Once the car is up and running, bounce on each corner, if any feel real stiff then the ball has failed, again not a big deal.

I have three of them, one sits in Florida all summer long so that one sits for about 7 months and will settle about the same all over. The other two have been in storage for 2 years now and one is on the floor, the other one still is up in the front.

One of them is a '77 with 42k miles and it sat the longest, 4 years once. That's when I learned about the compinsator. I also have a '84 with the same susp and I have never done anything with that one.

I wouldn't be afraid of the car other then you can get one with less miles if you look around. Mine have 42, 50 and 65k on them.

If one end of the car comes up but the other one stays down check the little ball socket links that go to the ride hight valves. The front one is on the pass side near the fire wall, this one is hard to get at and is usually the one to fail. The rear one is on the drivers side behind the rear axel.

So after doing any or all of that and the car doesn't run right or pump up, walk away. To many out there to pick a needy example.

[gerryvz]

Originally Posted by alabbasi

I love that PDF, it scares the crap out of me everytime I see it

Well, it's just designed to give people a good dose of reality. Hopefully they'll spend a bit more money up front and get a better car. If one marriage is saved, or one additional child goes to college because a money-pit wasn't purchased, then I will consider that this PDF has done its job....

M-100s are great, just rust-free ones.

Cheers,
Gerry