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  #1  
Old 09-25-2006, 09:52 AM
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Maybe you can help this Newbie with an old car!

Hello, I am new to the forums. I have been looking at a vintage 1971 220. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=354221 It has some floorpan rust through but the frame is fine. The car doesn't start now, supposedly the carb needs cleaning. I am a college student and am on a budget and I was wondering if this car is a wise choice. I was looking for a 60-70 car any make that was 4 or 6 cyl and came across this Mercedes. He is asking 800 firm, but states that all the car needs is a tune up, carb cleaning, and there is a hole in the pass floorpan the size of a fist that is solid surrounding it. let me know what you guys think and what should I look for. Thanks Chris

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  #2  
Old 09-25-2006, 01:02 PM
Jim B.'s Avatar
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: N. California./ N. Nevada
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Welcome and good luck with your decision.

$800 isn't much for a Mercedes, but we say here, be careful: There is NOTHING more expensive than a cheap Mercedes.

With that in mind (if you want a Mercedes, get the nicest condition you can afford , keeping in mind it'll cost you more) at the beginning, because it will SAVE you $$$ in the long run

This one could work though, maybe.....and it's a big maybe, rust is a bugaboo on these older ones, so check it carefully, especially around the fenders, wheelwells, and jacking points. Make sure there is no rust around the windshield, cowl and rear window too. He's already admitted the car needs patching, if it looks too bad, just forget the whole thing, you don't want a structurally compromised car.

What about the engine? Kind of a bad thing if it hasn't been run a long time, you'll need to treat the car carefully before starting it, make sure all the cylinders have oil squirted in them etc before cranking the engine, there is a usual procedure for starting a car that has sat for a long while, so find out what it is, and have the seller do it so the car is running when you buy it.
Otherwise you'd be risking buying a car -a Mercedes, with a ruined motor, which you DON'T want!!

It mitigates AGAINST this car that it has sat a long time. These cars like and need to be driven a lot. Make sure it is running well before you pull the trigger and buy it.

Also, this car will have wonderful build quality, which means if the engine runs well (you don't state the mileage on the car) it will last for hundreds of thousands of miles, possibly, unlike ANY Japanese or American car that old...

However the 220 gas engine is VERY SLOW, and you will never win any stoplight drag races with it. It's really, really, slow!!

Keep checking here, hopefully there will be more responses, there a few members with this exact model and maybe they can chime in and help here.

Give it some serious thought, these are very safe , durable and comfortable cars.

And it comes with another benefit. Every Mercedes owner, no matter how old the car is, may call 1-800-for-mercedes, and get a free battery jump, flat tire change, or gas brought to him if the car runs out, it's free whenever you need it, and comes with the car, forever, even if you are the 10th owner.

Also, Mercedes supports these cars with parts availability like no other manufacturer, you will ALWAYS be able to buy parts for this car.

The fact the car has a mint or excellent interior is also a huge plus here.

If you decide NOT to get this car when it's all said and done, another possible choice for you ought to be a late 1970's to late 1980's Chevrolet Caprice/Ford Crown Victoria/Mercury Grand Marquis, they won't make such polite noises at the gas pumps, but they are well built, pretty safe and the good examples are almost unburstable, and will need little other than the occasional battery, brakes, tires, and fluid change. The cost to run them is absurdly cheap, dollar per mile.

Good luck with whatever you do
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1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ...

1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold)

2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp

1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k

2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive (sold)
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  #3  
Old 09-25-2006, 01:52 PM
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Location: Dallas, TX
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Carb cleaning and floor rust

I'm not sure about the carb cleaning part but you should always be weary of a non running car. Especially if your on a student budget.

You can buy aftermarket floor pans for the W115 cars and weld them up so I would be less concerned about the floor. However it's important to note that these cars rust like you wouldn't believe. I would check the lower six inches of the car.

Pay particular attention to the trunk floor, rockers A B and C pillars, rear quarters and front inner fenders. A hole the size of your fist will quickly grow to a hole the size of a basketball once you get rid of the rust to find some weldable metal. At the $800 dollar mark, it would be a tough sell for me. You should find a pretty nice one for around $2k.
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Al
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  #4  
Old 09-25-2006, 04:58 PM
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to let you know. the guy had the car running a few months ago, as it was always hard to start for him, but now it wont start lately, turns over but wont start. He said his MB friend thought it was a carb/tube up issue. So the car hasnt been sitting that long!
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  #5  
Old 09-25-2006, 05:42 PM
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Location: Long Island, NY
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Only if you have spare time

I am also a college student and have 2 mercedes that i actually paid less than that for, $657, and $520. If you have time to spend just about every weekend, or at the least once a weekend a month keeping the thing running, go for it. You can probably get it to run with some difficulty. Find somewhere to get parts, and by all means DONT TRY AND RESTORE IT, you will just waste time and effort. I am glad I bought my benz's (both 280SE's) I can keep up on the freeway, or better. Plus a benz has more style, comfort and safty than most cars, and at that price you cant beat it. Not sure how the 220 will do on the freeway, so keep that in mind. If you dont have at least a weekend a month to devote to the car forget it, and if its going to be your only mode of transportation realize that the "weekend" can come whenever it wants.

Hope that helps
-Eric
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  #6  
Old 09-25-2006, 05:42 PM
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Location: Dallas, TX
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Tune up etc

I understand and it may be a good buy if you do the work yourself. Again a good one should not cost more then a couple of thousand dollars. As most Mechanics charge $80/hour to work on these cars. If you put 12 hours of labor into this car, you would reach that magic number.

In the end, if it was an easy fix, the PO would have fixed it. If you decide to buy it, we will help you.
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  #7  
Old 09-25-2006, 06:02 PM
Dan Rotigel
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college budget

I maintained my benz through college, and agree about the one weekend a month bit. If I had to do it over again, i would go for a very common diesel model, like a 220d, 240d or 300d with NO options, no leather, no power anything, no airbags, alarm, probably not even a turbo or an automatic tranny. The less stuff to break means you have more money for the stuff that is required. If the model is common, you have the luxury of searching junkyards for the bits that go bad. The diesels do seem to be more reliable than the gas models, and the mileage is better as well.

I would absolutely reccomend a old diesel benz for a college student, but this example seems like a bad plan, especially with the rust! Do an e-bay search for 220d, 240d or 300d benz to get an idea of what to spend. Remember, simplicity is your friend!

cheers,
dan r.

EDIT: Some background that we haven't mentioned is that the w114 chassis (the one for sale) is known as one that is particularly susceptible to rust because of german (so the legend says!) steel workers going on strike in the 1970s. The w123 chassis that followed the w114 will rust much more slowly, but the body style may not appeal, and the handeling is thought of as not quite as good.

Last edited by Dan Rotigel; 09-25-2006 at 06:17 PM.
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  #8  
Old 09-25-2006, 06:31 PM
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Posts: 8
rust

according to the PO the car has rust on the floorboard on the pass side that could be patched according to him. He said the rest of the car is virtually rust free and that the frame and brake and gas lines are all good. I know here in ny the salt eats cars so when I saw this one, the pics, it looks better than my 1994 ford escort. He said the guy he bought it from garaged it year round. I wish there was someone to take with me so I could know if this car is worth the bother. This is not going to be my daily driver as I have a 1994 escort I use in winter and a 2002 camaro I drive in the summer. I am just looking for a neat vintage car to drive around town in
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  #9  
Old 09-25-2006, 09:55 PM
Jim B.'s Avatar
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Click 1978 s240D for sale - Airbus

Chris, Click on the cars for sale section at the bottom of this site, a well respected forum member in Long Island NY (not far from your area I think) has just put up for sale his '79 240 Diesel sedan, it's the real basic Benz, no power this or that to worry about, everything (except brakes) is in order and he's looking to avoid an ebay sale and sell it to someone her who'll give it a good home.

It's well described, with lots of photos, and seems basically without problems.
He's looking to get $3000 which might be out of your league, and it seems to me like a reasonable price. It might be worth your time to at least go and look at it, to get an idea of a benchmark car, and whether you could see yourself in one.

This particular model W123 body style, 240 and 300 Diesel is one of the toughest and sturdiest Mercedes EVER built and generally acclaimed to be one of the best ones there is. As always, rust is the biggest thing to watch out for, the engines on them are so tough that they'd likely far outlast the motors on them.

I have no personal stake or interest in this car, but it MIGHT possibly be a candidate for you. Mind, they are very popular these days, so their prices hold up well, as tghey are also candidates for Biodiesel conversions.

Even as old as this one already is, it'd still be running long after your 1994 Ford Focus and the Camaro are distant memories.

Take a look at the ad, wht do you think about that car?
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1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ...

1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold)

2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp

1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k

2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive (sold)
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  #10  
Old 09-25-2006, 10:36 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 8
Price on the 81 is a little higher than the 2000 I was looking to spend, but I really wanted to stick with something from the early 70's and I dont know why but I still like this 220, but am scared because it won't start now like the guy told me, it will crank all dan but not start and it had always been hard to start, I dont know what to do. Any more input on the 220?
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  #11  
Old 09-25-2006, 10:58 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 5,134
find another one!

You have some options, here is a listing of some Classic MB cars in the NY area.

Non running 75 240D for $300 http://newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/car/211956063.html

Running 300D http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/car/212170684.html

A nice non runing 280C http://newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/car/210999940.html

Another running 300D http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/car/211623979.html

nice looking 250 http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/car/211867919.html

Really clean 220 in the 2k range http://newyork.craigslist.org/fct/car/210691749.html

Restorable 560sel for $600 http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/car/211690451.html
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  #12  
Old 09-25-2006, 11:42 PM
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If you can do the work yourself, then get the car. If you have to pay some one, watch out. Parts prices are on the rise for the oler cars.

Speaking of proces, I just bought a 1989 420SEL (W126) for $800 and I already dropped $350 on tires from Tire Rack. Next is ball joints and I have a power steering leak to fix, then emissions.

I saw a W114 today at my ex's work place. Great looking car.
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Warren

Currently 1965 220Sb, 2002 FORD Crown Vic Police Interceptor

Had 1965 220SEb, 1967 230S, 280SE 4.5, 300SE (W126), 420SEL

ENTER > = (HP RPN)

Not part of the in-crowd since 1952.
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  #13  
Old 09-26-2006, 10:49 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central Ky
Posts: 6,265
I have been working on mine for nearly a year, mine was in a bit more sorry shape. If you can do the work yourself get it, if not do not, especially if it is not running. Too many unknowns - tranny- rings -valves- steering- carb
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Ron
2015 Porsche Cayman - Elizabeth
2011 Porsche Cayman - Bond,James Bond
Sadly MERCEDESLESS - ALways LOOKING !
99 E320 THE Queen Mary - SOLD
62 220b - Dolly - Finally my Finny! Sadly SOLD
72 450SL, Pearl-SOLD
16 F350 6.7 Diesel -THOR
19 BMW X5 - Heaven on Wheels
14 38HP John Deere 3038E Tractor -Mean Green
84 300SD, Benjamin -SOLD
71 220 - W115-Libby ( my first love) -SOLD
73 280 - W114 "Organspende" Rest in Peace
81 380 SL - Rest in Peace
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  #14  
Old 09-26-2006, 11:15 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 8
My knowledge of cars is only to the extent of tire change, oil change, plugs and wires, alternator, brakes and rotors. Those are the only repairs I know how to do and I learned by myself by trial and error. Is that possible with the 220, the guy says its engine bay is very roomy and simple to work on. Could this be something I could learn by books and online information? I really want the car but do not want to get in over my head. Thanks Chris
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  #15  
Old 09-26-2006, 11:18 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central Ky
Posts: 6,265
1971 220

Read through my saga, it may help you decide, granted mine had not started in many many years, bu issues will be the same

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Ron
2015 Porsche Cayman - Elizabeth
2011 Porsche Cayman - Bond,James Bond
Sadly MERCEDESLESS - ALways LOOKING !
99 E320 THE Queen Mary - SOLD
62 220b - Dolly - Finally my Finny! Sadly SOLD
72 450SL, Pearl-SOLD
16 F350 6.7 Diesel -THOR
19 BMW X5 - Heaven on Wheels
14 38HP John Deere 3038E Tractor -Mean Green
84 300SD, Benjamin -SOLD
71 220 - W115-Libby ( my first love) -SOLD
73 280 - W114 "Organspende" Rest in Peace
81 380 SL - Rest in Peace
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