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  #1  
Old 03-24-2007, 10:45 PM
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Will a 220D motor go into a 220.4?

I know, why would you want to? I'm still struggling with the 2.2 gas motor in the car and not making much headway. Everytime I fix one thing, something else fails. This might be a major nightmare idea but thought I'd throw it out here.

I picked up a 1970 220D today for parts. Turns out to be a good running car. They lost the front flex coupler, tore up the floor pan and broke the back end of the trans.

Anyway, here's the swap I'm looking at. 220D has a manual trans, it's shot. 220.4 is auto trans, it's good. Diesel motor with auto trans in the 220.4 chassis. Will it go together?

This is kind of a last resort since parts for the gas motor seem to be pretty rare. Couldn't find rings or pistons online, standard or oversize. The 220D isn't really worth fixing. It's got some serious rust issues on top of the driveshaft damage.

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  #2  
Old 03-25-2007, 02:13 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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no reason it cant be done.

but what troubles are you having with the gasser? it seems to me fixing that would be a lot simpler.

tom w
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #3  
Old 03-25-2007, 08:41 AM
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The logical move would be to transplant the manual tranny and related hardware, along with the diesel.
But if the manual box is shot, at minimum you're going to need the automatic flywheel that fits the 220 diesel, plus your 220's automatic may not be setup to work with a 220 diesel.

Happy Motoring, Mark
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Last edited by Mark DiSilvestro; 03-26-2007 at 07:30 PM.
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  #4  
Old 03-25-2007, 10:35 AM
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I'm sure I can get the top end issues resolved but the compression is pretty low. Well below spec on all 4 when you test it dry. Wet test is back up to spec. The cost of rebuilding the motor just couldn't be justified on a 220.

It may end up being too much of a hassle swapping the motors. If so, I'll run it until won't go and then get creative.
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  #5  
Old 03-25-2007, 12:58 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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did you do a leak down to determine it is not your valves leaking?

tom w
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #6  
Old 03-25-2007, 05:06 PM
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I didn't do a leak down. On 3 of the cylinders, wet test compression was right in the middle of the acceptable range listed in my manual.

Normal range is 130 to 145, min is about 109. Mine were running around 100 dry, 135 to 140 wet except for #3.

#3 picked up about 10 pounds but was still outside the range. I'm sure the valves are leaking on that one.

Is there something else I missed? I was taught if a wet test puts you back to acceptable compression the rings were shot, top end was probably ok. At least the valves weren't a major factor in the low compression reading dry.
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  #7  
Old 03-25-2007, 05:39 PM
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gimme a low-tech 240D
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IDTag View Post
I'm sure I can get the top end issues resolved but the compression is pretty low. Well below spec on all 4 when you test it dry. Wet test is back up to spec. The cost of rebuilding the motor just couldn't be justified on a 220.

It may end up being too much of a hassle swapping the motors. If so, I'll run it until won't go and then get creative.
Another option, what I'd call a poorman's rebuild...... just replace the piston rings on the existing 220 gasoline engine. Look for *soft metal* aftermarket Swedish rings designed to mate w/ old MB bores and pistons that wont cut into bores thus causing piston slap.

You dont have to bother with total rebuild - use the same bottom end bearings, pistons, cyl head etc. JUST REPLACE THE RINGS. Swear to God have seen a new set of piston rings add another 100k+ miles to an otherwise worn out gasoline engine, specifically an M180 of mine that ran well beyond 250,000 miles.

Otherwise toughest critical part of diesel conversion will be mounting the dashboard glow plug starting system in the dash of your 220/8. Part out the 220D engine along with associated glow plug wiring and idle adjust cables plus accelerator linkage and down the road you'll be glad you did, say in another 5 yrs or so - assuming you think on your 220 as longterm vehicle good for another 15-20 yrs or 200-300k miles at least.

Aint never any logic to treating these as disposable cars, assuming they havent rusted to smitherines. And with highly desirable 114/115 body style now commanding $5k USD, figure it'll be worth at least $10k in another 8 yrs as modern cars get ridiculously crummier and more expensive by comparison.
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  #8  
Old 03-25-2007, 05:51 PM
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Any sources for rings? I haven't had any luck.
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  #9  
Old 03-25-2007, 06:30 PM
300SDog's Avatar
gimme a low-tech 240D
 
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Maybe ask the dealership parts dept for replacement rings - NOT ultra hard tempered steel but designed to meld with old bores and pistons. But if they dont know what you're talkin about - then walk away.

Discovered the secret of aftermarket soft metal Swedish rings more than 20 yrs ago through an independent MB shop who special ordered em for me. Today with internet maybe try sending an email to Mercedes Benz of Sweden, they oughta know what you're lookin for.

(edit: "Deves" of Sweden I recollect was the manufacturer, but gotta get the ones soft tempered for replacement into high mileage engines.

Last edited by 300SDog; 03-25-2007 at 06:45 PM.
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  #10  
Old 03-25-2007, 08:39 PM
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Just visited the Deves website and they do list the rings. Just have to determine if my motor has Nyral pistons or not. Different rings listed for them but if I read right the others are 1973 only.
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  #11  
Old 03-25-2007, 08:55 PM
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Ok, how about an alternative. 220D engine in a W123 chassis. Another guy I came across has a 1978 300D with a bad motor, good trans.

I'm just trying to come up with something to do with this motor. I can never stand throwing something good away. Especially anything automotive related!
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  #12  
Old 03-26-2007, 10:38 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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my buddy who used to race funny cars and seems to know a few things about motors says that oil will also bring up compression on valves that are leaking.

so a leakdown test is mandatory to determine if the leaks are from bottom or top end.

imho.

tom w

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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