1966 230S - would appreciate your thoughts - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

thorsen · #1 08-15-2009, 01:13 PM

http://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/cto/1324441114.html

I went and looked at a 1966 230 today. I would appreciate any thoughts you guys might have.

Body - very little rust, there was some rust-through in the rear bumper, but the rockers were solid. A few dents here and there and some cracked paint which tells me there is some bondo on the car. Floors were solid, and there was some heavy rust on the trunk lid around the lock. The car would definately need some body work and new paint.

Engine - The engine does not turn over. When the starter engages, it makes an attempt but stops. The car is parked at a repair shop which tells me that the engine either needs a full rebuild or replacement.

Interior - fairly clean. Half the heater levers are stiff, the other ones would not budge.

The guy is asking $2800 which seems stiff for what he has. I have fairly decent mechanical skills and am not turned off by the engine or body problems. What do you think is a fair price to offer?

t walgamuth · #2 08-15-2009, 04:20 PM

Take a zero off the price.

Seriously if the body was clean and nearly rust free it might be somewhat in line but with all the issues you state you will be underwater as soon as you start investing money into it.

nhdoc · #3 08-15-2009, 04:43 PM

I would ask them the basis of their conclusion that the engine is bad. Was a compression test done? If so was it a wet or dry test and what were the results?

If the motor really is toast then they are dreaming if they think they will get $2800 for it, maybe $500-$1000 tops...OTOH if they can show you the cylinders build compression it is probably worth $2K.

thorsen · #4 08-15-2009, 04:56 PM

The owner is a used-car salesman, I suspect he has a "buy-here pay-here" type operation. My guess is that he bought it thinking he could turn it around quick, but the shop gave him the news about the engine. I would be surprised if they did a compression test given that the engine won't turn.

I'm going to think about it for a few days then make an offer.

nhdoc · #5 08-15-2009, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thorsen

The owner is a used-car salesman, I suspect he has a "buy-here pay-here" type operation. My guess is that he bought it thinking he could turn it around quick, but the shop gave him the news about the engine. I would be surprised if they did a compression test given that the engine won't turn.

I'm going to think about it for a few days then make an offer.

I misinterpreted your comments...I thought the engine would not turn over (meaning start) but you meant it would not turn...meaning it is seized...yeah, that would be bad...but still I would confirm it by putting a breaker on the crank and seeing if it would turn. Maybe the starter is bad.

JimFreeh · #6 08-15-2009, 09:27 PM

A nice set of bumpers for these cars approaches the cost of the car itself.....

A known rust magnet like this body series coupled with a Chicago location, AND strong visible evidence of rust lurking would have me passing long before the bad engine (and possibly transmission) were even considered.

This car likely is a bad deal even for free.

Jim

thorsen · #7 08-16-2009, 08:52 AM

I forgot to mention, the seller said "worse case scenario is it needs a new engine". I'm sure he knows exactly what is wrong with it.

nhdoc · #8 08-16-2009, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimFreeh

...This car likely is a bad deal even for free....Jim

I'll have to remember this line the next time I am negotiating

JimFreeh · #9 08-16-2009, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhdoc

I'll have to remember this line the next time I am negotiating

No charge!

Jim

thorsen · #10 08-16-2009, 11:22 AM

How can you NOT love this forum?

todds · #11 08-17-2009, 11:28 PM

Heh, AND it's got fuel injection! ;-)

As far as the finny, I tend to agree with the others, mine was in shockingly good shape when I got it, having been REALLY REALLY lucky on ebay. Even considering that, costs tend to rack up FAST. This is the case even on a car with no rust. The heater levers are familiar to me and probably par for the course. The seized motor is not. How good were the battery and cables? Did it sound like the starter was spinning fast or was it reluctant and clicking? If you could get a fresh battery on it or maybe a powerful booster and get the thing spinning it'd be much more interesting. That kuhlmeister unit is a nice plus. The seats looked a little dirty and the aftermarket stereo's a bad sign.

With these cars I feel like the less hands that have touched them the better. If it's been toyed around with by random folks who don't know the car no matter how well their intentions are, it could take a fair amount of detective work to get to the real issues. If the motor won't start then besides the obvious question of the engine itself, you also have no idea what the carbs or the fuel tank/etc is like. You know very little about the cooling system. You also know nothing about the transmission and very little about the suspension, steering and brakes without actually driving it.

The finnies are robust cars but this applies to any 40 yr old car and represents a major risk for that money. As far as the things you can actually evaluate, you've got tires, body condition (which you've already been doubting), interior, age of the exhaust, switchgear, shifter, electrical eqpt, general condition and cleanliness of parts, and honesty of the seller. Since the last thing can be doubted too, I'd say let it be someone else's headache. Even a museum-condition car could be suspect in that situation, when all you really have to go on is appearances and the seller's word. There are still plenty of more deserving fintails out there representing known good deals from good sellers who've cared for their cars and can prove it.

Get the price down to reality, get some honest info about the car from the dealer and the motor turning and it's starting to sound a little better.

thorsen · #12 08-18-2009, 11:48 AM

Thanks for everyone's input. I'll let you know what happens.

pch2021 · #13 08-18-2009, 11:18 PM

compression test is in order next.

Squiggle Dog · #14 08-19-2009, 12:31 AM

The fintail seems to be the least liked model Mercedes ever made, but it's my favorite. They can be picked up in fair condition for $50-500 in my area all the time. There was a running, driving, fintail with Kuhlmeister with almost no rust for $300 a couple years ago that I looked at, but then I got my 230S for free.

todds · #15 08-19-2009, 09:59 AM

Quote:

The fintail seems to be the least liked model Mercedes ever made

That's funny, my experience has been the polar opposite. Damn man, that does it, I'm moving to Seattle...