The 220 Diesel I didn't buy: Was I wrong? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

micalk · #1 11-11-2009, 12:18 AM

http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/1458916904.html

This was posted a couple months ago and pulled right away. No picture but described a nice car. I started a chat dialogue with the gentleman. Nice Italian guy from Milan. He was moving to New York, had to sell his home, etc., but very busy - overscheduled. So after about two months of looking and not finding anything nearby I was finally able to match his schedule. After meeting with him and discussing the car, I found he's only owned it about four or five months, bought it on a whim I'd guess, and now has to sell it. Did not know a thing about Mercedes diesels or cars in general. Had no receipts from PO. Didn't know what half the switches did except he did know how to start it. No owners manual. This was just a bit unfortunate because I've only owned 80's era diesels, and I wasn't familiar with this model either.

The car has been re-painted, same color as original, and it seemed like a fair job, nothing really to complain about. Tiny bit of rust in the lower rear quarters, but nothing serious. The rest of the car seemed very solid. No rust in the floor pan. Leaves inside the engine compartment, and in the vent intake at the base of the windshield. Hubcaps in good shape, new tires, suspension looked good - no ripped boots. Engine valve cover had writing on it, and owner said it had been rebuilt. All the doors were kinda hard to close. Not MB solid thunk, but felt like I had to slam it to get it to latch. Glove box has a wad of paper keeping it from rattling. All the door panels have cracks at the top, and the dash has a few cracks too. The driver's vent window crank wheel was missing, and one of the rear window cranks was missing the trim. Carpets had been replaced with something that wasn't the square weave (German velour?), but had the correct molded bottoms. Hood latch wouldn't return, had to to be pushed back into place. Aftermarket radio. Headliner looked kinda dirty.

Engine was cold (felt the valve cover). Glowed and started fine, settled in right away. Driving it, the first thing I realized is that it doesn't have power steering. Was this optional? Or were they all made that way? Or was it removed? Turn signal wouldn't return to center. Heater fan works! Engine smoked a little on acceleration, but it smoked alot while decelerating in gear. This didn't seem good. Tried the horn. Nothing. Same with wipers. Checked the fuse (short one? is that right), it appeared good, and wiggled it some and still nothing. Not sure what was going on there, but not my job to troubleshoot and fix it on the spot.

So I ended up walking away. But since I don't have any real knowledge of this engine or this model, I was wondering if my experience was unusual or if that's how these cars generally are at this age. I am still interested in this model (not this particular car obviously), but the few things that bother me are: no power steering? really? this is not a lightweight vehicle, I'd think that PS would be standard. What about the smoke? That would be unthinkable with an OM617, but what about the four-bangers? How about the doors? They swung easily enough, no creaks or groans, but had to slam to latch. Unusual or no? Is the door-vinyl cracking extremely common? Are they difficult to recover? One door had a bit of a chunk out of it. Or is this a "sat outside alot" kind of issue?

Am I too picky? He originally listed it for $2400 and said he had an offer for $3000, then asked $3500 when I was there. I think someone told him it was worth more than $2400, so he upped it. Now it's back on craigslist for $3250. Anybody got a clue what it should fetch?

Interested in anybody's thoughts on this. Looking forward to my next 220 Diesel experience. Got a feeling this is going to take a while...

GregoryV022 · #2 11-11-2009, 12:19 AM

220D's did not come with power steering. thats about the right price for this car considering that the 220's are so rare compared to the 240s

Zeppo2K2 · #3 11-11-2009, 01:08 AM

I have 4 220D's. The best is a '71 with 130K miles, I purchased 2.5 years ago with 103K from original owner. No rust, but lots of dents. He had lost his license due to advanced age and poor driving. Cost was $1200. Runs great, but nailing when cold is an ever present issue. Daily driver.

There's one that is wrecked from rear, runs great, has documented 40K miles on M-B rebuilt engine. $500. I'll pull engine and trans, and part out rest.

There's a worn out one, low compression on all 4 cylinders, $300. I'll pull trans and part out rest.

Then my big mistake, 240K, low compression on 2 cylinders, hole in floor, filler in other places along rockers, rear quarters plastic fill, a/c leaks, and auto (the others are manual) This DOES have power steering, and is '73. It has complete documentation, but was sold via eBay with claim of "no rust". Well, it had holes, but no rust I guess. With shipping $3400 - bad deal. I have to pull head to figure out what's wrong, engine only has 34,000 on complete rebuild according to receipts.

The 220D's come up about once per month on one of CA's Craig's lists. Keep checking. I've seen better deals than mine, and I've had to miss them, my wife says "no more please".

Ron

t walgamuth · #4 11-11-2009, 06:23 AM

It sounds like a decent car. I don't know about the price, the 2400 seems like plenty. The issues you describe seem minor.

Most 220d's had power steering. I had a manual steer and I liked it a lot. The feel was wonderful. Low speed maneuvering was tough but if you made sure you were moving when turning it was not a problem.

stimpy451 · #5 11-11-2009, 07:52 AM

My jaw dropped last night on the way home from class - there was a '71 220D on the corner, midnight blue, with a for sale sign in the window. Had current plates (historic vehicle) and updated CD player, very clean. I couldn't tell if there had been bodywork done or not, but it looked good at 11:00 PM. Very good.

Was asking $3500.

I paid $650 for mine but it's got a lot of filler in the quarters and needed some general maintenance work/TLC (see Umlaut thread).

JimFreeh · #6 11-11-2009, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregoryV022

220D's did not come with power steering. thats about the right price for this car considering that the 220's are so rare compared to the 240s

Yes, they did.

My 73 220D auto had PS. Both my 69 220D's did not, however, they were also manual trans.

I wouldn't skip on a car without PS. Once the wheels start rolling, it's fine. If you have a car without PS, your effort will increase if you fit lower profile tires. A non PS 220D with 70 series tires is much more uncomfortable than when equipped with the 185-14 VW bus spec tires (which are closer to an 80 series profile).

Jim

micalk · #7 11-11-2009, 09:10 AM

I'm not concerned about the PS so much as surprised that it wasn't there. It's been so long since I had a car without it.

The seats were in good shape (chocolate brown) but it was the other interior parts that bothered me, especially the vinyl cracks in the door panels. How normal is that?

Any comments about the smoky engine?

220DSC · #8 11-11-2009, 09:26 AM

My 73 has power steering. It is a 4 speed manual. I love this car! I have learned if you have the time to look for a car and set a price for yourself, you will find the car you want. It will take time but the hunt is fun.

micalk · #9 11-11-2009, 09:43 AM

Another question: does the antenna have a motor? Every one I see has the antenna up, and this one wasn't up all the way and I didn't want to mess with it. Is there no replacement if the antenna motor goes?

Mike D · #10 11-11-2009, 10:10 AM

The 220D was the "entry level" Benz. Very little in amenities. Electric windows/AC/sun roof were usually only available in U.S. models. I drove one for 8 years and loved the car. Be advised, don't be in a hurry to get anywhere, especially if it's an automatic transmission. Don't even think about merging on the interstate if you have the A/c operating.

My personal view is $2000 is way too much to pay for a 220D or 220 unless it is PERFECT! No rust at all. Dash and window arm rest rails cracks are a fact of life but the rest of the interior should be immaculate.

It will still need to have ALL the rubber bits checked (wind screens trim, sub frame mounts, trunk seals, flex disks, brake lines, etc.) and most likely replaced.

Sounds like a $500 car to me. Buy a W123 body instead unless like me, you like the W114-115 body style

220DSC · #11 11-11-2009, 11:25 AM

My 73 does have a electric antenna!! I don't know about the replacement.

meltedpanda · #12 11-12-2009, 10:53 AM

too much for that girl, lots of "little things" can add up.. All of what you described is minor but its what you dont know that may not be good. Really need to get under it , check for rust, check compression ect , if you are goign to pay that much for it, if not offer a low ball.
I am with MikeD on this one, for that much, you should not have to do much
I sold a 72 220 completely refurbished, except for valve stem issue ( 400$ job) for 1600, and it was really nice

JordaanDMC-12 · #13 11-12-2009, 11:24 AM

They're are great cars! I've been using my 70 220D for a daily driver for about six months now and it's been pretty enjoyable overall. The only thing is I live in the desert and it has a/c but it's not working at this moment so summer kind of sucked.

Mine does have power steering also, but it needs new seals in the gearbox because it was leaking fluid like crazy and I didn't want to damage the pump, so I disconnected the belt until I can afford to have it fixed.

On mine the antenna is manual and you can even lock it if you still have the keys! LOL As mentioned before the interior is pretty straight forward and really not much to it, which in my opinion makes it kind of nice.

Some 220's even came with hydraulic leveling devices (if the owner decided to get that option) in case the rear sagged too much! I've been waiting to come across one though with that feature. They are out there and for good prices, I got my mine for 500$ in detailing credit! From a "exotic motor cars" dealership that didn't have time/space for it.

stimpy451 · #14 11-12-2009, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JordaanDMC-12

Some 220's even came with hydraulic leveling devices (if the owner decided to get that option) in case the rear sagged too much! I've been waiting to come across one though with that feature.

Hello. *blink blink*

I have a '71 220D SLS. Just getting it back on the road.

strelnik · #15 11-12-2009, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stimpy451

My jaw dropped last night on the way home from class - there was a '71 220D on the corner, midnight blue, with a for sale sign in the window. Had current plates (historic vehicle) and updated CD player, very clean. I couldn't tell if there had been bodywork done or not, but it looked good at 11:00 PM. Very good.

Was asking $3500.

I paid $650 for mine but it's got a lot of filler in the quarters and needed some general maintenance work/TLC (see Umlaut thread).

Power steering, like air and AT, vary on these cars.

Mine has an ugly green leather interior that's perfect. No one knew how to start the one I have now, when I bought it a month ago, so I got it for 300 as a non-running car. Already got another one for 200 from TN, but that one needed some work to get going and has a rough paint job but little rust.