Engine Swap Thread 1962 Fintail 220Sb gets a motor swap! - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

JeffreyNMemphis · #16 05-19-2010, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercmad6.3

If you are using the W108 trans on the back of your new engine,you need to alter the rear of the trans tunnel to clear the flex disc and the speedo drive will need to be adapted to fit the W111 cable (which may be too short.)

I am keeping the W111 transmission. I like the 4 speed column shifting better than automatic transmission. The new motor should just bolt in with no modifications.

Question: Will the distributor from 180.941 work in the 130.motor?

mercmad6.3 · #17 05-19-2010, 09:14 AM

They interchange but have totally different ignition curves so you will lose power if you fit the wrong distributor.

Mark DiSilvestro · #18 06-20-2010, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffreyNMemphis

I am keeping the W111 transmission. I like the 4 speed column shifting better than automatic transmission. The new motor should just bolt in with no modifications.

I have a 72 250C (carbed M130) automatic that I may someday want to convert to a stickshift.
Were you able to fit your manual gearbox to the M130?
What flywheel did you use? were you able to fit a clutch pilot-bearing to the M130 crank?
Thanks.

Happy Motoring, Mark

wbain5280 · #19 06-20-2010, 09:50 PM

I went to the junkyard last week to get a manual trans from a 250SE. I looked at the engine and it was an early 220SE with the two piece intake manifold.

JeffreyNMemphis · #20 06-21-2010, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark DiSilvestro

I have a 72 250C (carbed M130) automatic that I may someday want to convert to a stickshift.
Were you able to fit your manual gearbox to the M130?
What flywheel did you use? were you able to fit a clutch pilot-bearing to the M130 crank?
Thanks.

Happy Motoring, Mark

Mark,

The motor in your car is the M110; which is a different engine block than the M130. The M130 and the M180 are identical on the outside; on the inside the M130 is bored out to 2.8 liter and it has different cooling flow.

The W111 Fintail 220Sb has steering column shifting. Your W114 Coupe has a floor shifter. You would have to modify the transmission's shifting mechanism and install a floor shifter, or swap out steering/shifting to the W111 steering/shifting assembly to make it work.

Next Saturday will be "engine swap day" if all goes according to plan. I expect my old flywheel to bolt up and transmission to bolt-on to the M130. All of the peripheral parts from the old engine like radiator, air conditioning compressor, water pump, etc. should bolt on to the M130 block.

If you want to convert to standard transmission, it will be easier if you can find a W114 or W115 or W123 with a standard transmission.

I hope this helps... I am not an expert on engine and transmission swapping. I think my observations are correct.

JeffreyNMemphis · #21 06-21-2010, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wbain5280

I went to the junkyard last week to get a manual trans from a 250SE. I looked at the engine and it was an early 220SE with the two piece intake manifold.

The BIG six cylinder engine served Mercedes from Pontons to Fintails, W111 Coupes and finally the W108s. The engine evolved from a 2.2 liter carburated engine in the Pontons to a fuel injected engine badged 220SE (The E was the designation for fuel injected). Mercedes offered carburetor engines and fuel injected engines variations of the BIG six engine. Over the years the engine displacement was increased from 2.2 liter to 2.3, 2.5 and finally the maximum possible 2.8 liter. The 280S was carburetor fed and the 280SE was fuel injected.

The engine block of the 280S appears similar enough to the 220S that it will look original and not like some alien engine has been installed.

mercmad6.3 · #22 06-21-2010, 05:54 PM

The m130 Flywheel wont bolt to a M180 Crank.

tonkovich · #23 06-21-2010, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffreyNMemphis

The BIG six cylinder engine served Mercedes from Pontons to Fintails, W111 Coupes and finally the W108s. The engine evolved from a 2.2 liter carburated engine in the Pontons to a fuel injected engine badged 220SE (The E was the designation for fuel injected). Mercedes offered carburetor engines and fuel injected engines variations of the BIG six engine. Over the years the engine displacement was increased from 2.2 liter to 2.3, 2.5 and finally the maximum possible 2.8 liter. The 280S was carburetor fed and the 280SE was fuel injected.

The engine block of the 280S appears similar enough to the 220S that it will look original and not like some alien engine has been installed.

i'm not sure, but isnt " se" short for "super einspritz" , meaning "super injection"? please correct me if i am wrong.

mercmad6.3 · #24 06-21-2010, 09:10 PM

Not quite but close. Einspritz means injection ,but "S" stands for 'Sonder' = Special. Hence the "S klasse " or Special Class . So we have have the special class of car with fuel injection ="220SE" or carburation "220S" . You'll note that a W110 is never a 190S 0r 180 S or 230S only the longer W111's had that designation.

JeffreyNMemphis · #25 06-22-2010, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercmad6.3

The m130 Flywheel wont bolt to a M180 Crank.

Will the M180 Flywheel bolt to the M130 crank?

mercmad6.3 · #26 06-22-2010, 09:50 AM

No,Off hand I don't remember the exact differences ;
M180 flywheel # A108 030 06 05
M130 Flywheel # A180 030 02 05
M127 Flywheel # A127 030 03 05
M110 Flywheel #A110 030 00 05
All are different diameters ,the bell housings are different bolt pitch circles.
The m130 is a four main baring crank where the M180 and M110 are 6 main bearing.
plus there are several M130's (eg 130-I,M130 II etc ) which started with the 1950 220 (side plate engine) which were all manual trans but the bell housing and flywheel clutch are tiny compared with a manual m180 unit.
The M110 block will bolt in where the M130 IV and M180 engines are fitted originally.
So it's often easier to swap in the engine and trans as unit. Column shift is available for both Auto and manual trans .

JeffreyNMemphis · #27 06-22-2010, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercmad6.3

No,Off hand I don't remember the exact differences ;
M180 flywheel # A108 030 06 05
M130 Flywheel # A180 030 02 05
M127 Flywheel # A127 030 03 05
M110 Flywheel #A110 030 00 05
All are different diameters ,the bell housings are different bolt pitch circles.
The m130 is a four main baring crank where the M180 and M110 are 6 main bearing.

Ouch!!

I thought I would just bolt on my M180 flywheel and be off to the races!

What are my options? My four-speed transmission works perfectly and I just installed new kit for the hydraulic clutch system. Is there any way to make the M130 engine connect to my transmission?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercmad6.3

plus there are several M130's (eg 130-I,M130 II etc ) which started with the 1950 220 (side plate engine) which were all manual trans but the bell housing and flywheel clutch are tiny compared with a manual m180 unit.
The M110 block will bolt in where the M130 IV and M180 engines are fitted originally.
So it's often easier to swap in the engine and trans as unit. Column shift is available for both Auto and manual trans .

There are several different M180 engines. My engine is the 180.941. Does this make any difference?

have mercy · #28 06-22-2010, 04:32 PM

Yes by all means keep those Solex carb's, they are a lot better. They are easy to adj. and you can do alot more with them.The solex come alive alot quicker.

mercmad6.3 · #29 06-22-2010, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffreyNMemphis

Ouch!!

I thought I would just bolt on my M180 flywheel and be off to the races!

What are my options? My four-speed transmission works perfectly and I just installed new kit for the hydraulic clutch system. Is there any way to make the M130 engine connect to my transmission?

There are several different M180 engines. My engine is the 180.941. Does this make any difference?

Your best option is find the bellhousing for your block and a manual flywheel for the engine . Use the clutch driven plate that fits your trans input shaft and the clutch cover to suit the flywheel.
The various versions of M180 also include two different block designs,S and SE . The SE has a different casting to enable the MFI to bolted on.
Somewhere in the archives is a comprensive answer to a lot of your questions but remember that the trans you intend to use wasn't supposed to used with a higher torque engine like a M180. They use a different trans altogether with a reinforced case.

JeffreyNMemphis · #30 07-01-2010, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercmad6.3

If you are using the W108 trans on the back of your new engine,you need to alter the rear of the trans tunnel to clear the flex disc and the speedo drive will need to be adapted to fit the W111 cable (which may be too short.)

Hmmm.... How do I "alter" the trans tunnel?

I am probably going to install the automatic transmission that was born with this engine attached. Is the drive shaft the same? Do I need the drive shaft? What amount the mounts? This is probably my last opportunity to pick parts from the donor before it goes to scrap. What about the shifter assembly? Will that W108 automatic shifter bolt into my W111?