1971 250C prepurchase checks - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

sldan · #1 04-28-2012, 10:00 PM

I am wondering what items should get special attention when performing a pre purchase inspection on a 1971 250C with 97k miles. I have has a number of MB cars over the years and I am familiar with the general issues to cautious of but I am not familiar with the 1971 250C or the 250 engine.

Any thoughts and comment would be appreciated.

JimFreeh · #2 04-30-2012, 07:43 AM

On the 250C body, aside the myraid of places a sedan can rust, there are special drain openings on the rear quarter panel between the door and the rear wheel opening, just above the rocker chrome. Make sure these are present and not bondo'ed over.

W114 cars rust with a vengeance, and your Columbus location would make me very suspicious that a 250C would escape rust problems.

Make sure the electric windows work. Parts are unique to the coupe, and the door window tracks are tricky to get aligned (and stay aligned).

Seat frames are known to fail as well.

All other sedan inspection points apply as well.

The M130 engine is very robust, but can require a valve job every 100k miles.

Jim

sldan · #3 04-30-2012, 08:19 AM

Thanks Jim,

Thanks for the good information. The comments on unique coupe parts are just what I was looking for.

Not sure yet where this car lived but it was not in Ohio. It is advertized as a one owner and never driven in the winter so I will beware!! The asking price is way too high at this point for 97K miles even if "well maintained" and the photos look great. Beauty is only paint deep!

My "well maintained" may be way off their idea of "well maintained"

Thanks again,

ScooterABC · #4 04-30-2012, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sldan

but I am not familiar with the 1971 250C or the 250 engine.
.

The 250C has the 2.8 liter engine, not the 2.5 liter engine. Don't ask why because I don't know why. Nice car, poor gas mileage (hope for 15 mpg), front and rear windshields may leak. Rear will end up in trunk, front will end up in front foot wells. Make sure heat / temp / AC knob actuates a vacuum control that switches between the AC fan and the heater fan (there are different fans for AC and heat and they are controlled by the temp knob). Interior from A-pillar backwards is unique to coupe body. Hold out for a really good rust-free car - definitely cheaper to buy a good one than to fix a bad one.

sldan · #5 04-30-2012, 05:27 PM

Thanks ScooterABC.

I understand and appreciate your final comment. I went through floor rust issues with a 63 230SL. I really liked that SL even though I had to replace all of the typical dash board and heater control parts. It did have a strong engine and working automatic transmission.

ScooterABC · #6 04-30-2012, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sldan

Thanks ScooterABC.

I understand and appreciate your final comment. I went through floor rust issues with a 63 230SL. I really liked that SL even though I had to replace all of the typical dash board and heater control parts. It did have a strong engine and working automatic transmission.

California is a great place to look for a 114 coupe. My opinion is that they are terribly undervalued given what a joy to drive they are and how somewhat rare the are. I paid $4500 for mine without working AC but otherwise in excellent condition. At some point (probably this summer) I'll spend the $$$ to have the AC put right. I wish it were not such a gas pig. I feel bad getting 15 mpg and buying premium.

JimFreeh · #7 05-01-2012, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScooterABC

My opinion is that they are terribly undervalued given what a joy to drive they are and how somewhat rare the are........ I wish it were not such a gas pig. I feel bad getting 15 mpg and buying premium.

Same here.

My coupe is one of the most enjoyable MBs I've ever owned. The handling is wonderful, the ride superb, and with the M130, the acceleration is decent (unlike my W115 220D). I'm surprised that these cars continue to be relatively inexpensive. My feeling about mileage is that it's relative, with a flatline value (no depreciation), fuel cost is a minor irritant. Plus, it's not my daily car, so the miles are low per year.

X2 on the interior parts. Aside from the dash, it's all unique to the coupe, even the back seat...

WRT to the M130, if it has the original Solex carbs, budget for the Weber carb conversion. Not cheap, but what a difference.

Jim

sldan · #8 05-01-2012, 07:12 AM

Thanks Jim,

Tell me more about the weber carb conversion.

ScooterABC · #9 05-01-2012, 12:44 PM

counterpoint on weber conversion: my 250C has the solex carbs, they were rebuilt by previous mechanic owner several years ago. The run great. Tom at the classic center says that they are great as long as people don't mess them up. I have the webers in my parts car - a 1968 280S. They are nice. I can't really compare the two since they have different characteristics in other ways (transmission, weight, etc). If you have good running solex carbs I would not replace them. Price new for a weber conversion is $800ish and I haven't seen them used but ebay is a good place to look.

JimFreeh · #10 05-02-2012, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScooterABC

counterpoint on weber conversion: my 250C has the solex carbs, they were rebuilt by previous mechanic owner several years ago. The run great. Tom at the classic center says that they are great as long as people don't mess them up. I have the webers in my parts car - a 1968 280S. They are nice. I can't really compare the two since they have different characteristics in other ways (transmission, weight, etc). If you have good running solex carbs I would not replace them. Price new for a weber conversion is $800ish and I haven't seen them used but ebay is a good place to look.

True, if you have a set of good Solex carbs, AND everything works, AND they are set up by someone who knows how to set them up.

If you are playing the averages though, many Solex carbs have warped castings, and few are properly set up and adjusted. It's tedious to make all the adjustments correct, and changing one adjustment can throw other adjustments out.

I've owned several M130 Solex equipped engines over the years, and the carbs have been a sore point on each. Alternatively, once I installed a set of webers, I was finished. No more constant fiddling. I have the JAM kit on my current 250C. Installed in 2007, and they have been pretty much maintenance free since.

Jim

ScooterABC · #11 05-02-2012, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimFreeh

True, if you have a set of good Solex carbs, AND everything works, AND they are set up by someone who knows how to set them up.

If you are playing the averages though, many Solex carbs have warped castings, and few are properly set up and adjusted. It's tedious to make all the adjustments correct, and changing one adjustment can throw other adjustments out.

I've owned several M130 Solex equipped engines over the years, and the carbs have been a sore point on each. Alternatively, once I installed a set of webers, I was finished. No more constant fiddling. I have the JAM kit on my current 250C. Installed in 2007, and they have been pretty much maintenance free since.

Jim

I have less experience with the Solex carbs than you - I would tend to agree that the Weber setup is better. But it's also apples and oranges - comparing carbs that were built 40 years ago with carbs that were recently manufactured and are new. Lots of bad rebuilds are done, including bad weber rebuilds. I would love to find a weber setup on a junkyard car and get those and have them rebuilt and put them on my 250 C. Oh, my Solex carbs haven't required fiddling with since I bought the car, which was probably about 4 years ago. I think I got lucky and the mechanic who had them rebuilt sent them to a good rebuilder...

What is the JAM kit?

Scott

JMela · #12 05-02-2012, 12:03 PM

JAM Engineering is a company making Weber conversion kits:

JAM Engineering Corp: Products

JimFreeh · #13 05-02-2012, 02:35 PM

One of the big problems with the M130 engine is that the flapper valves in the exhaust system (used to heat the intake manifold when cold) hang up and direct heat to the intake all the time, the excessive heat causes the Solex carbs to warp, making it impossible to keep them from leaking.

Since the carbs sit directly over the exhaust mainfold, I am uncomfortable with this....

If you get a good set of Solexes, and they are set up right, by all means keep them.

Sure, the Webers are not apples to apples, but it is sure nice to have set of carbs that perform well at idle, partial and wide open throttle.

Jim

kenny33012 · #14 05-15-2016, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimFreeh

On the 250C body, aside the myraid of places a sedan can rust, there are special drain openings on the rear quarter panel between the door and the rear wheel opening, just above the rocker chrome. Make sure these are present and not bondo'ed over.

W114 cars rust with a vengeance, and your Columbus location would make me very suspicious that a 250C would escape rust problems.

Make sure the electric windows work. Parts are unique to the coupe, and the door window tracks are tricky to get aligned (and stay aligned).

Seat frames are known to fail as well.

All other sedan inspection points apply as well.

The M130 engine is very robust, but can require a valve job every 100k miles.

Jim

Could you be more specific about the location of the body drain points? A picture would be even better. I have one of these and I suspect the left drain point is plugged, because I get water on the floor behind the driver seat. I ran it through a brushless high pressure car wash and that was the only place it leaked. I checked under the rear seat; all dry.