Future of the Performance Paddock

[Roncallo]

Just wondering what is going on with this forum. Very few people building or doing any kind of mods. 13 Years ago when I was building my M120 560SL, my thread would scroll off the page it I didn't post to it for a few days. Today there are threads from 2020 still on the first page. I get that Covid was a big thing but I took that time to install AC in my car.

There have also been several breakthroughs technologies and services available in recent years that make building and modifying significantly easier for more people. These include the availability of low cost or even free CAD programs, services like SendCutSend laser cutting and Xometry fabrication, as well as 3D printing.

Is this just a problem with automotive or is it the same in other areas like woodworking etc?

Is there absolutely no interest in working with ones mind and hands?

More importantly is there anything we as a community can do about it?

[greazzer]

Folks are still mod’d and doing “stuff” to their cars. I think most folks just stopped posting. I know I rarely post like I used to

[tbomachines]

Originally Posted by Roncallo

Just wondering what is going on with this forum. Very few people building or doing any kind of mods. 13 Years ago when I was building my M120 560SL, my thread would scroll off the page it I didn't post to it for a few days. Today there are threads from 2020 still on the first page. I get that Covid was a big thing but I took that time to install AC in my car.



There have also been several breakthroughs technologies and services available in recent years that make building and modifying significantly easier for more people. These include the availability of low cost or even free CAD programs, services like SendCutSend laser cutting and Xometry fabrication, as well as 3D printing.



Is this just a problem with automotive or is it the same in other areas like woodworking etc?



Is there absolutely no interest in working with ones mind and hands?



More importantly is there anything we as a community can do about it?

I think we are at the point where either (a) there are not many cheapo older benzes around worth modding/hacking up without much regard, and/or (b) a lot of the cars we used to talk about and dive into are considered classics now, and (c) the performance payoff is not really all that great compared to newer cars. Those have always somewhat been the case, but older mercs have hit the junkyard/restore decision point recently. W123 value has skyrocketed, even w124 and w126s are quite few and far between, and anything but a basketcase r107 is edging toward 5 figures and more.

[Roncallo]

Originally Posted by greazzer

Folks are still mod’d and doing “stuff” to their cars. I think most folks just stopped posting. I know I rarely post like I used to

But yet you posted today to a non-mod thread, why the reluctance to post some of your more recent stuff.

[Roncallo]

Originally Posted by tbomachines

I think we are at the point where either (a) there are not many cheapo older benzes around worth modding/hacking up without much regard, and/or (b) a lot of the cars we used to talk about and dive into are considered classics now, and (c) the performance payoff is not really all that great compared to newer cars. Those have always somewhat been the case, but older mercs have hit the junkyard/restore decision point recently. W123 value has skyrocketed, even w124 and w126s are quite few and far between, and anything but a basketcase r107 is edging toward 5 figures and more.

I certainly get that but it was never true when US 50's and 60's cars were at this point. People would still modify Chevy's and Ford's well past the point of when they were turning into classics. About 10 years ago the big attraction to the younger generation was the Japanese cars and the VW's. I wonder if they are seeing the same reduction in activity. I will bet they are.

[Tony H]

I have a few active threads here but progress is slow and I don't want to bore people with every little bit of progress so I save it until I have more to update. Any mods I make on my car are going to be bolt on and original drivetrain will be preserved. I do miss hearing what people are doing with their cars and I check everytime to see if there are new posts.

[tbomachines]

Originally Posted by Roncallo

I certainly get that but it was never true when US 50's and 60's cars were at this point. People would still modify Chevy's and Ford's well past the point of when they were turning into classics. About 10 years ago the big attraction to the younger generation was the Japanese cars and the VW's. I wonder if they are seeing the same reduction in activity. I will bet they are.

The people modifying 50s and 60s cars then were/are a very different generation than now. I am in my early 30s and do not really see any point in performance modding classic MBs to much extent beyond drivability or maybe period mods. Most of my peers (and me included) would rather restore and cruise in one, rather than get something like 300hp out of an old engine bolted to a 4 speed auto.

Don't get me wrong, I am very much a tinkerer and appreciate getting more power. However at this point, something like a 2.3-16 or older AMG is going to be restored rather than performance modded, and most other mercs are not great performance starting points. This forum has always been more geared towards older benzes for some reason, newer AMG/performance enthusiasts will probably hit mbworld first.

[Roncallo]

Originally Posted by tbomachines

The people modifying 50s and 60s cars then were/are a very different generation than now. I am in my early 30s and do not really see any point in performance modding classic MBs to much extent beyond drivability or maybe period mods. Most of my peers (and me included) would rather restore and cruise in one, rather than get something like 300hp out of an old engine bolted to a 4 speed auto.

Don't get me wrong, I am very much a tinkerer and appreciate getting more power. However at this point, something like a 2.3-16 or older AMG is going to be restored rather than performance modded, and most other mercs are not great performance starting points. This forum has always been more geared towards older benzes for some reason, newer AMG/performance enthusiasts will probably hit mbworld first.

I just met up with a friend in CT. He had just completed a 1936 Oldsmobile restomod. He says the same thing. The younger generation just does not have the heart to build. He just turned 70 and I'm about to turn 65. I guess we are dinosaurs.

[Roncallo]

Originally Posted by Tony H

I have a few active threads here but progress is slow and I don't want to bore people with every little bit of progress so I save it until I have more to update. Any mods I make on my car are going to be bolt on and original drivetrain will be preserved. I do miss hearing what people are doing with their cars and I check everytime to see if there are new posts.

That's a good idea to keep things as bolt on as possible and preserve the original stuff. Even Samson, my M120 560SL is still reversible except I didn't keep the engine and trans, and of course I would need a new sub frame.

But I know where the engine guts are.

[tbomachines]

Originally Posted by Roncallo

I just met up with a friend in CT. He had just completed a 1936 Oldsmobile restomod. He says the same thing. The younger generation just does not have the heart to build. He just turned 70 and I'm about to turn 65. I guess we are dinosaurs.

Completely disagree. Plenty of heart to build, just not a performance modded classic merc. My little 15 year old roadster can hit 320hp with just a tune, up to almost 400 with basic bolt ons alone. My point is few in my age look at a heavy soft w123/107/126/124 and thinks performance. The cars are amazing in their ways, but there are so many better options for performance builds unless you are dead set on the style of a MB, or want to build a cruiser.

[Roncallo]

Originally Posted by tbomachines

Completely disagree. Plenty of heart to build, just not a performance modded classic merc. My little 15 year old roadster can hit 320hp with just a tune, up to almost 400 with basic bolt ons alone. My point is few in my age look at a heavy soft w123/107/126/124 and thinks performance. The cars are amazing in their ways, but there are so many better options for performance builds unless you are dead set on the style of a MB, or want to build a cruiser.

If what your saying is true, then the Honda and Subaru crowd should be cranking them out as they were 10 years ago. I don't know if that is happening.

[t walgamuth]

I'm still here. I write about nearly all my cars but don't wrench much unless it is something my Indie won't do or cannot figure out. I am 72 now and just don't have the raw energy I once did.

[tbomachines]

Originally Posted by Roncallo

If what your saying is true, then the Honda and Subaru crowd should be cranking them out as they were 10 years ago. I don't know if that is happening.

Not sure what you are referencing here. Both of those communities are extremely active.

[Roncallo]

Originally Posted by tbomachines

Not sure what you are referencing here. Both of those communities are extremely active.

I'm not familiar with those communities. But it sounds like your saying they are just as active as they were 10 years ago. That's good to know that the younger generation is still actively working, but I guess they shifted platforms. Probably because more performance per $ is available from the Japanese cars. But its always been that way. Why haven't the 203's, 210's, 211's, 140's etc filled the place of the 126's 124's 123's 107's.

[tbomachines]

Originally Posted by Roncallo

I'm not familiar with those communities. But it sounds like your saying they are just as active as they were 10 years ago. That's good to know that the younger generation is still actively working, but I guess they shifted platforms. Probably because more performance per $ is available from the Japanese cars. But its always been that way. Why haven't the 203's, 210's, 211's, 140's etc filled the place of the 126's 124's 123's 107's.

Lets reverse this. Why would someone be compelled to mod a w203? Forgettable design, soft, poor build quality, and no aftermarket and/or little community support. Other than a cheap entry price...? The AMGs at least had some muscle and suspension inprovement but dont hold a candle to the M3 of the day, and the market/prices reflect it.

Compare that to many many other brands...in the last 15-20 years...turbo engines that are really tunable, lots of aftermarket (varies by mfg).