What happened to all the W116 - '73-'80 450 SEL's?

[-fad]

Hi guys-

my family owned since new a '73 450SEL (small bumpers & ltd smog equip) and it was a throughly enjoyable and reliable car for 20 years

we took it on a number of family road trips and it never let us down.....after about 200,000 miles though it turned very expensive to keep in 100% condition

not to down the 450SEL,
... now I have W124's: a '94 E500 & '94 E320 Coupe and these appear to embody much better quality and performace on every level vs. the 450SEL (imho)

if you have a chance test drive a 500e or e500 and/or an E320 Coupe, let me know what you think too- - that W124 coupe is silky smooth and pretty quick!

-fad

PS- also owned and worked on: '67 250S, '67-'69 250SE, '70 280SE and these are great cars too (if 100%)

[barndoor]

ok,
I just bought my second 116 Mercedes
a 1974 450 sel.
(column shift,no sunroof,hubcaps)
the car only has 84000 original miles.
BUT
the oil pressure gauge does not seem to be working correctly,unless what I fear is true,
low OIL PRESSURE ??? !!!
tHE CAR RUNS FINE,lots OF POWER !
starts right up and doesn't smoke.
anybody have any idea?
this is my first day with the car
I rescued it !



'85 380 SE
'60 190 b
'74 450 SEL

[jbrasile]

barndoor,
If your pressure gauge does not immediately climb as you step on the gas you could have two problems:
1) A true oil pressure problem. Requires immediate attention!!
2) These gauges do fail from time to time and a good instrument shop should be able to repair/replace it. Not expensive at all, had it done on my 1980 450Sel, I think it cost under $100.00
Note: Usually when the gauge fails it starts to leak oils all over the inside of your dash. Have it fixed soon to avoid a mess.
Regards,
jbrasile
1980 450SEL
1987 Jaguar XJ6

[barndoor]

thanks !
what was your gauge doing when it started going bad ?
I just pulled the cluster and checked the back of the gauge,no oil anywhere?
the gauge wont peg at all,
it goes up at first start up,(not all the way) then as it warms it gets less and less.
car still running and sounding fine ?

[Holson Adi]

Have you checked the oil level?

I guess the oil pressure is meant to be lower as the engine warms up. (Except for my 230E at one period of time before an oil change. I don't know what kinda oil it was, but the pressure stayed at 3 ALL THE TIME)

[jbrasile]

barndoor,
The gauge needle started to flicker at idle and I noticed oil coming out from under the dashboard. Made a mess of the side of the console as it ran across the dash and driped. The actual back of the cluster will most likely be dry, look at the metal crossmember under the istrument cluster, behind the ignition key and see if there is oil acumulated there. Basically look for oil inside the dashboard. What happens is the gauge may be leaking from the portion you can't see and the oil just runs down into several places.
If you see no oil in there at all, have the gauge checked by an instrument shop. Maybe the unit has an internal problem that can be detected at the bench. Also check if the line feeding the gauge doesn't have any leaks all the way back into the engine.
If all checks ok, I would definetely have the engine checked eventhough it runs fine. It would be a shame to have serious damage on such a low mileage car.
Let me know how it turns out.
Regards,
jbrasile
1980 450SEL
1987 Jaguar XJ6

[barndoor]

after letting the car sit for a couple hours.I started it and the gauge pinned instantly.
then I drove it for about 5 minutes
(up to operating temp)
and the pressure went down.
I can see oil spraying on the cam when I open the oil fill cap.
also,I pulled the air cleaner and noticed that I have some vacume line off the intake manifold that is not on ?
attached is a picture of this if anyone knows?????
thanks !!

[mikemover]

My oil guage stays pegged most of the time too...drops to about half or a little more at idle, but it pegs again as soon as I step on the pedal.

That's definitely something I'd have looked at right away...you don't want to mess around with low oil pressure on such a nice 116!!!

Mike

[barndoor]

I also just noticed that the oil pan is very dented in ! ?????
could this effect oil pressure ?

[mikemover]

Is it dented on a corner, or in the middle? The oil pump pick-up is very low, in the front/middle area of the oil pan. If it's dented badly in that area, I'd definitely pull the pan off and check it out. A new oil pan may be in order. I just put one on mine for the same reason...a previous owner had dragged it all over something...beat it up pretty good. You can get a bolt-on skid plate that's designed to prevent that, but they are kind of pricey...over $100, if I remember correctly. I think I'm going to get one soon, though.

Mike

[barndoor]

It is dented in the middle.
I ordered an oil pan gasket and oil filter for tomorrow.
I'm draining the oil and removing the pan tomorrow to pound it out.
maybe the pick up tube is damaged?
we'll see ??

[jbrasile]

barndoor,
Sure sounds like you are on the right track. If you need any more assistance with the car let me know. My 1980 450SEL has had quite a bit of work done to it by myself and my local dealer so if you need any more tips just drop me a line.
Good luck,
Regards
jbrasile
1980 450SEL
1987 Jaguar XJ6

[barndoor]

ok
I drained the oil,removed the pan,pounded it out on some plywood with a mallot.(came out pretty good)
changed the oil filter and now I am ready to fill the oil.
Can anyone tell me how many quarts this 450 sel (1974) takes ?
the pages on capacities is missing from my owners manual.
is it 8 quarts?
If I dont hear from anyone soon,I am going to start filling !
I am dying to know if the oil pressure probelm is fixed !

[mikemover]

Hmmm...not sure how much the SEL holds. Hopefully somebody else can jump in and let you know.

Mike

[barndoor]

ok,
back from test drive.
and oil pressure is NORMAL !!!!!!!!!!!!!
very good news to me !!!!
gauge pins on acceleration,
just like my 380 SE !
I guess the problem was the pan was touching the oil intake,
luckily there is a rubber on the end of it which cushions,so nothing will break.
I did find plastic bits in the pick up screen and the pan.
so I pulled the right valve cover (I noticed the right head has just been changed)
and noticed a new cam ,and a new tensioner "Rail"
but the other "Rail" is very dark brown or black !
so,I now will pull the other valve cover and check the rails on that side,I have a feeling they need replaced.
I guess this car already has the double row timing chain.
I have no service records with the car ( I am reserching that now)
but I can tell from experience the car only has 84 k miles.
it is very tight,trans shifts perfectly and it
drives beautifully !
and now with oil pressure,I can replace the rear brake pads
(came with the car,thats why it was parked in the first place)
and DETAIL it !
thanks for everyones help!
another 116 back on the road !!!