Saving A 1965 W111 220

[t walgamuth]

Scam artist.

Squiggle, I have not read every word of your thread but I have enjoyed what I did read. Keep up the good work!

[Squiggle Dog]

It turns out it was the previous owner who still had the door listed and forgot about it. He took it down. Mystery solved. Considering the price of the door, he gave me a really good deal on the whole car (a 100% discount). Haha.

[cleeves]

Great thread.

H

[Squiggle Dog]

I ended up removing and refurbishing the Mark IV air conditioning unit. Since I already have a Kühlmeister, I put the Mark IV up for sale.



I sold it and the black wheel covers that wouldn't fit the steel-look aluminum wheels that I put on my 1980 W116 300SD, and then used the money to buy five 14" W108 dog dish wheels that were for sale on Craigslist.

I think the seller liked me, because after talking about Mercedes, he gave me a great deal on them. We discussed a possible deal in the future regarding a complete W108 parts car so I can harvest the front and rear axles to upgrade to four wheel disc brakes and larger brakes up front.

I got four matching Sudrads dated 12/69, and one Lemmerz wheel dated 1/69. The Lemmerz is a pretty close match to the Sudrads. K&Z wheels have much smaller brake vent slots cut in them, so that's something to watch for when looking for wheels--even if they are the same part number, the appearance can be different based upon the manufacturer.


Unfortunately, the tires were rotten and wouldn't hold air. I really wanted the car to rest on tires which hold air. I ended up selling an air conditioning mounting bracket on eBay and used the money to have the old whitewall tires from my 1980 W116 300SD mounted onto the wheels.

It's funny, because the small tire shops didn't want to touch the tires due to them being 9 years old. Discount Tire was up for the job, however. I didn't need them balanced, but Discount Tire balanced them anyway and didn't charge me for it. They told me I'll have a smooth ride rolling around on my driveway.

I already had five dog dish hubcaps which had nearly perfect chrome. Soaking them in a bucket of Evapo-Rust removed the rust on the backside.


I had just enough money left over from my eBay sales that I was able to purchase a new set of stainless steel trim rings for $45 and free shipping. That sure beats paying over $400 for a dented and rusty original set.

[Squiggle Dog]

I'm very happy with how the 220 looks with good wheels and tires. It was really nice to be able to scrape together enough money to get further ahead on the project.

[Squiggle Dog]

After giving the original six cylinder gasoline engine to my roommate, the engine compartment is ready for an OM617 five cylinder turbo diesel engine.

[Usaguy]

Originally Posted by Squiggle Dog

...the engine compartment is ready for an OM617 five cylinder turbo diesel engine...

What axle do you have in this car? if it's like 4.08 then you will have about 3,500 rpm @ 60 mph

617 turbo cars came with a 3.07 axle for a reason.

Because it's a swing axle car then your choices are limited. W108 4.5 came with a 3.27 (rare, expensive and known for wearing out)

[Squiggle Dog]

Originally Posted by christuna

What axle do you have in this car? if it's like 4.08 then you will have about 3,500 rpm @ 60 mph

617 turbo cars came with a 3.07 axle for a reason.

Because it's a swing axle car then your choices are limited. W108 4.5 came with a 3.27 (rare, expensive and known for wearing out)

Not necessarily. The gearing of the fintail transmissions were much taller than later models. Where you run into a problem is when you use a later model low-geared transmission in conjunction with a low-geared differential.

The axle in there currently is probably something like a 4.08, which should be fine since I will be using a fintail 4 speed column shift manual transmission. However, I plan to install axles from a W108 so I have rear disc brakes and larger brakes up front. So, the gearing may change.

[Usaguy]

Originally Posted by Squiggle Dog

Not necessarily. The gearing of the fintail transmissions were much taller than later models. Where you run into a problem is when you use a later model low-geared transmission...

I'm pretty sure that the 4th gear in a manual transmission fintail is 1:1 ratio just like other mb 4 speed manuals or 722.3 equipped 617


These early benzes like to rev from my experience

[Squiggle Dog]

Originally Posted by christuna

I'm pretty sure that the 4th gear in a manual transmission fintail is 1:1 ratio just like other mb 4 speed manuals or 722.3 equipped 617


These early benzes like to rev from my experience

I'm probably going to end up using a 3.27 rear axle from a W108, anyway. The early 220 rear axles were a 3.90 ratio, and the later version was 4.08. The front half of my 220 is a 1965, and the rear half is a 1960, so it will be interesting to see what rear axle is currently in it.

[t walgamuth]

It is great to see progress!

The six cylinder cars I believe did have taller gears than the four cylinder cars, based on my experience changing one for the other back about 42 years ago.

[Squiggle Dog]

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

It is great to see progress!

The six cylinder cars I believe did have taller gears than the four cylinder cars, based on my experience changing one for the other back about 42 years ago.

According to the factory service manual:

190: 4.10
200: 4.08
190D: 3.90
200D: 3.92

And then the 6 cylinders had a 4.08 ratio except for early 220, which had a 3.90.

Anyway, I checked my ratio, and it's a 4.08. So, I'll likely be using a 3.27 from a W108 280SE 4.5 unless I can get a 2.82 from a W109 300SEL 6.3 and then use the gear set from it in a W108 disc axle. I don't see why just the gear set can't be swapped out from an air suspension axle into a spring suspension.

[Usaguy]

Originally Posted by Squiggle Dog

... unless I can get a 2.82 from a W109 300SEL 6.3 ...

I'm pretty sure that 6.3 axles are worth quite a bit of $$$$

Another way of lowering the gearing is to fit taller tires. It will work just like a lower ratio axle although there's a limit to how tall your tire can be. I think that the original full profile tires looked taller than the ones you have on it now.

You have a cool project. Looking forward to see how it evolves

[Squiggle Dog]

Originally Posted by christuna

I'm pretty sure that 6.3 axles are worth quite a bit of $$$$

Another way of lowering the gearing is to fit taller tires. It will work just like a lower ratio axle although there's a limit to how tall your tire can be. I think that the original full profile tires looked taller than the ones you have on it now.

You have a cool project. Looking forward to see how it evolves

Yeah, though sometimes stuff like that turns up in the self-service wrecking yards. I helped a friend remove an air suspension rear axle from a W109 they had here at U-Pull-&-Pay.

The car originally had 13" wheels with the equivalent of 185/80R13 tires on it. I just installed 14" wheels, so 195/70R14 would be the equivalent to that. I probably can't go much taller without going with a bias ply tire. I think 185/70R14 are what are on it now.

If I had a couple thousand dollars I could put a set of 15" wheels on it, and then maybe get some tires that make a difference, though 15" wheels were stock on the wagons, which is what it's eventually going to become.

I don't want to go any larger than 15", and certainly not anything that doesn't look stock.

[Usaguy]

Originally Posted by Squiggle Dog

... 195/70R14 would be the equivalent to that. I probably can't go much taller without going with a bias ply tire. I think 185/70R14 are what are on it now...I don't want to go any larger than 15", and certainly not anything that doesn't look stock.

That would give you a 2.5% increase in size which would be like going from a 4.08 to 3.98 / or / 3.27 to 3.19 axle.

I agree on the looks. Fitting a larger rim wouldn't look right.