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  #1  
Old 11-10-2002, 09:25 PM
gonzo
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W109 first-timer

Hello everyone, this is my first post. I feel rather fortunate to have found this website considering my present situation. A few weeks ago, my dad retired from his company and decided to buy a 1972 W109 300SEL 3.5 and restore it slowly. I'm now trying to help him out but this being the first time we're doing anything of the sort, we're pretty clueless. It is in running condition, the body is decent but the interior needs a bit of work. I was wondering if anyone can give us advise on how to go about this smartly. Being from Manila, Philippines, it is difficult to find a decent MB shop that we can trust to have ample knowledge of this vintage. It seems, everything they do is nearly guesswork. Just in case anyone has any thoughts on the matter, I have a few questions:

1. Everytime I drive the W109, there is a slight smell of gasoline that permeates into the cabin. It seems to come from the driver's side of the engine and wafts right in. There is no oil or gas spillage I see on the garage floor so I don't think its a leak. What might cause that?

2. The gas pedal and automatic transmission is quite jerky. When I shift to drive, it jerks a bit when it engages and it takes a sensitive foot to achieve a graceful takeoff. The engine is quite strong and a little push on the pedal makes it nearly lunge - a bummer when parking on a slope or lining up on a parking ramp. Is there any way to make this smoother?

3. The engine is loud. We're planning to replace the whole muffler. Does anyone recommend placing some kind of insulation on the hood and is that a part that has to be ordered and serviced or is it possible to find a DIY kit? Also, how does one go about placing sound insulation in the cabin, particularly between the engine and the cabin? Is that kind of thing done?

4. The leather (or whatever it is made of) interior looks a bit grimy. There are no tears or anything but there are black spots and streaks around some areas. What is the best way to clean it?

5. The windows have slight water stain marks. Is there a chemical cleaner that can clear it out?

Sorry if I have so many questions. I am aware that my restoration priorities might be all wrong at this point. Please bear with me, the beginner. It's a lovely car and I'm looking forward to seeing it completely restored. Any feedback would be appreciated.

Thanks!
gonzo


Last edited by gonzo; 11-10-2002 at 09:40 PM.
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  #2  
Old 11-10-2002, 11:39 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Evansville, Indiana
Posts: 8,150
Welcome to the list Gonzo!

I have a 72 280 SE 4.5 -- same horsepower, just bigger engine.

Ha, get used to a light foot. You can spin the tires on dry pavement rather easily with this beast. You may need to clean and lubricate the throttle linkage if it is sticky. A VERY light foot is a requirement. If you are used to "regular" lower horsepower cars, this guy is an eyeopener -- you will ram other cars in the rear all the time if you have a heavy foot!

However, a real lag then blastoff is usually a vac leak. Check the hose for the door locks, the injector seals (could also be the source of the gasoline smell), and all the many hoses up top on the engine. I've seen these with a large ball bearing in the idle control hose to shut off the "excess" air!

Gasoline smell can also come from bad hoses on the evaporative control canister by the rear passenger door, underneath. Mine smells of gas all the time, too, will have to investigate next dry day.

The vac leak will also make the tranny shift rather hard, and bang going into gear. The tube for the transmission is under the rear of the intake manifold, buried pretty deep. It has a banjo bolt (hollow bolt that goes through a banjo shaped fitting on the tube). Make sure there is a copper seal on the top, it seals against the aluminun manifold on the bottom. Check the connection to the transmission, too.

Sadly, another likely cause is the seals between the bottom and top of the manifold -- there are eight rubber rings in there. You can check by listening for leaks or by spraying some WD40 down there with the engine running -- changes in idle will indicate a leak.

Another possibility is a bad or out of adjustment throttle position switch. Big assembly on the side of the throttle housing. Could be not signalling throttle changes properly. Vacuum leak is the most likely though, since the tranny goes into gear hard.

Check the left exhaust manifold -- mine is split down the "y" in the center, makes the car rather loud. Also check the condition of both mufflers and the pipe connection in front of the front muffler, it often leaks.

Any good leather cleaner will take the crud off. You do need to get some Lexol or Leatherique leather treatment, too. Cleaning will remove the oils from the leather, and it will get brittle and tear. Don't wait, do this right away.

Good luck, ask questions, you will love this car!

Peter
__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #3  
Old 11-12-2002, 12:07 AM
gonzo
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Hey Peter, thanks a lot for the advice. I'll check on those things first chance I get. My father apparently ordered a manual so that will be a big help when it arrives. Here are some more questions though:

First, the suspension gets squeaky when going over speed bumps. Since this car has air suspension, I'm not so sure whats the best way to go about minimizing that noise. Are there any special tips on lubricating those parts?

Second, I think there are vacuum door locks on this thing but they don't work. Where do I begin???

Third, is there any way to clean up the chromed parts in the interior? i.e. the outline of the speedometer, door handles, etc... or is there an affordable way to replate them?

By the way, you're right, I love the car already- faults and all. Even though it rattles, squeaks and gobbles gasoline, its just too cool a car!

Thanks again!
Ian
(Due to my ignorance on these web stuff, I signed using my username gonzo in my last message. Sorry about that)
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  #4  
Old 11-12-2002, 07:35 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Evansville, Indiana
Posts: 8,150
Ian:

There are fourteen grease fittings up front and two (or three) in the back, all of which need to be greased every oil change.

The fittings on the front are at each end of the control arm pivots and the top, middle, and bottom of the steering knuckle. Good bet that the grease is dried up.

Get a grease gun and some nice synthetic grease. Get a flexible hose, the straight or slightly bent tube usually supplied won't do much for you.

You can reach all the fittings with the car on the ground, but will only be able to do the back or font side of the front end at a time.

Turn the wheels all the way one way, do what you can reach, then turn them all the way the other way, and finish.

The fittings for the upper control arm are at the ends of the bushings. Wipe all the grease off (and road dirt) -- you will find a small nipple there. Attach the grease gun fitting (it snaps over) and pump the handle four or five times, or until you see old grease being forced out.

Lower control arm inner fittings are inside the control arm just round the bearing -- probably can only feel them, not see them.

Top fitting on the kingpin faces to the back, in the middle of the outer end of the upper control arm.

Middle fitting is about half way down, on the inside. Wheel must be pointing the proper direction so the shock isn't in the way.

Lower fitting is just above the lower pivot, I think.

Grease them all and the squeaks will go away.

There are also two fittings on the rear axle pivots in the center of the rear axle. I've not done these yet.

Oh, and plan on new subframe bushings up front and new engine mounts. Unless replaced in the last few years, they are all smashed down.

Vacuum lock failure is either a leaking actuator in a door or at the trunk or gas cap lock, or a leaking supply hose. The supply hose attaches to the rear bottom side of the intake manifold and has a check valve up on the firewall. Black rubber hose to yellow plastic hose. If the hose or check valve is bad, no vac, hence no locks.

Try them and see if they work with the engine running -- if so, the check valve is bad, and the vac all leaks off. There is a tank under the left front fender that holds enough vac for about 8 lock or unlock cycles.

To fix, you will need a hand vac pump -- there is one sold in the US called the MitiVac, very handy. You should be able to find something similar in the Phillipines. Makes all this much easier. With it, you can attempt to pump down the whole system -- if it won't hold vac, you can isolate the leaks, etc. Very simple, except that the actators are buried in the doors and the vac lines are under the carpet.

The system supplied vac to the driver's door. There is a switch there that switches vac to the lock or unlock lines (yellow with red to lock, yellow with green stripe to unlock). Those lines go to all the actuators with the exception of the gas filler lock, it only has the lock line.

Peter
__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

Last edited by psfred; 11-12-2002 at 08:12 PM.
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  #5  
Old 11-12-2002, 09:29 PM
gonzo
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Wow! You're an incredible resource, Peter. I have my work cut out for me. Will post updates and maybe pictures when I can... and probably more questions. Thanks so much!

Ian
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  #6  
Old 11-12-2002, 09:49 PM
1967250s's Avatar
the monster
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 694
Peter is so busy with us MB newbies that i don't know if he as the time to sleep?
Ask im about brakes!

DAN
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http://w3.uqo.ca/gravelle/images/250S/flood.jpg
DAN
1967 250s The Monster Project a.k.a "The Monster" a.k.a "Rolling Coffin" --sold--
The photographic ART thread
+++Price Guide+++
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  #7  
Old 11-13-2002, 08:21 PM
gonzo
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lucky for us, huh? hey Dan, what kind of sound system do you have on that silver 250s? Mine carries the original Becker Mexico but it doesn't work anymore. Any suggestions on a replacement that will still look good with the dash?

Ian
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  #8  
Old 11-13-2002, 10:51 PM
1967250s's Avatar
the monster
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 694
I have the original Becker that plays on & off when it pleases.
If i can fix it, I'll never change it. Anyway, it's the last thing on my list right now! I'm giving this baby a second chance next spring. i have a 3 page list of things to buy and do on the "monster project".
It's hard not to fall in love with these beauties.

And yes, lucky for us.
Post some pics for us to see where you are starting from on your project.

DAN

__________________
http://w3.uqo.ca/gravelle/images/250S/flood.jpg
DAN
1967 250s The Monster Project a.k.a "The Monster" a.k.a "Rolling Coffin" --sold--
The photographic ART thread
+++Price Guide+++
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