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  #1  
Old 12-02-2003, 12:48 PM
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'72 280 SE -- looked today, info needed!!

Hello my new mentors, as I am not savvy in this form of communication yet and wanted to make certain my topic is noticed, I have started a new thread -- dunno if that is PC or not...
Spent three and one-half hours driving today to check out the '72 280 SE I mentioned in my last (and only) thread. Please, someone, squelch my unbridled enthusiasm so I do not purchase a bottomless money pit!!
I paid close attention to all the areas mentioned in response to my queries. I believe this auto is truly a 44,000 mile piece. It has been repainted but the light blue looks like the original color. I found no bondo, most if not all of the rubber is original and I believe the Michelin 185/70x14 in the trunk is the original spare. Interior was awesome for MB Tex. Also, I was expecting to find a 6 cyl 280 but instead stumbled upon a 4.5. It smoked not a bit, was smooth and responsive, excellent acceleration on the highway, and had great oil pressure (if the gauge is to be believed.)
My questions are many -- 1. Is it unrealistic to think I could use this as a daily driver for the next year or two while I "tinker" it into shape?
2. The AT is a bit sloppy in its mechanism but I found no discernible slipping, although a slight hesitation when going into reverse. Problematic?
3. The hood release cable has pulled from its lever so opening the hood requires pliers pulling on the bare cable. I had a Lancia Beta once with this malady and it was an astoundingly difficult repair. Similar situation here?
4. There is a noticeable rumble/oscillation at 40-45 mph. I suspect drivetrain issues rather than tires or alignment/balancing. I did not study the driveshaft, is not this a two-piece affair with a flex disc or joint? Would this be a likely source for this rumble?
5. Owner says it has occasionally stalled when hot -- fuel regulator/pump? There was no hesitation whatsover when I drove it and did not seem rich.
6. Now, this may be a biggie -- the LR door refused to open. Owner claimed ignorance. The lock knob moved up and down, very stiffly, but did not affect the door latch button. The button feelr moved but the door remained shut, as if locked. Inside handle did no good either. On top of this the LR window would not function -- again, a surprse to the owner. It sounded like the lock knob wasa ctually moving the mechanism at the latch but we never got thte dorr to budge. I do not think the car has ever been hit.
7. The resonator/rear muffler will not last much longer. Is this a PIA to find/replace/pay for?
Thanks so much for enduring the length of my monologue. I anxiuosly await guidance from the assemblage.

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  #2  
Old 12-02-2003, 02:44 PM
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I replaced my hood cable - ordered it online ($12 I think) and it was easy as cake to install!

The original spare would have been a bias-ply tire, not a radial. Also, if it WERE the original spare, you should never use a tire that old!

It isn't unrealistic at all to use it as a daily driver - I use my 4.5 as such! LR door sounds like a big PITA though. You will have to find a way to remove the interior panel with the door closed (not easy but perhaps not too difficult).

Try this: Lift up the rear seat and pull it out (the bottom bench part - pull up on the front of it until the retaining studs or whatever come out, then do the same on the other side, then lift it out). Then yank the panel out (shouldnt be TOO hard). You'll know by looking in there probably what happened. I have a feeling that someone tried forcing the door open while the car was locked. That (I believe) would most likely bend the contacts/pieces inside, resulting in the inoperable condition. PROBABLY a simple fix. The LR window might be that he forgot to reconnect the wires to the panel if he took it off himself in an attempt to repair it.
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  #3  
Old 12-02-2003, 07:46 PM
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kpb,
If the price is reasonable and there's no rust and bondo hiding under the repaint, it sounds like a decent car.

A slight delay going into reverse is common with these automatics.

The hood cable should be an easy fix.

The driveshaft has a rubber mounted center bearing and at least one rubber flex-joint, like your BMW. Worst case - if one of the metal 'U' joints is failing, they're not normally replaceable. The factory fix is to replace that section of driveshaft but there are driveline shops around that can rebuild the old shaft. I had the driveshaft rebuilt on my '72 250 for about half the cost of a new one.

The door problem wouldn't scare me away.

Power window regulators are weak on these cars.

As for a daily driver, don't expect good gas mileage. At least the '72 should be able to use regular gas (but check the owners manual).
Remember, this car IS over 30 years old. The care given by the previous owners and how much repair you can do yourself will determine how big a money pit. I wouldn't use it as my only car. Salt and snow will eat it up, if it's not rusty already.
I try to drive my '60 Fintail 220S as much as possible, sometimes 3 or 4 times a week if the weather is decent. If I do get caught out in the rain I don't mind but if we get a long spell of rain or snow it might be a week or two before 'Miss Daisy' leaves the driveway.

Happy Motoring, Mark
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  #4  
Old 12-03-2003, 04:13 PM
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The 4.5L requires minimum 91 octane in all versions, and you cannot even cheat with some 89 octane midgrade. Serious spark knock if you try.

Mileage will be 14-16 (or much less!) depending on driving conditions and style. Lots of power, but if you get into the habit of using it much, milage will be closer to 12 than 16.

Peter
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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #5  
Old 12-03-2003, 05:06 PM
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Be forewarned - mileage CAN be as high as 16 but as low (or LOWER perhaps) than 7.5! This is from first-hand experience!
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Current:
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Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k
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  #6  
Old 12-04-2003, 10:42 AM
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Grab this car!!!!!!

Replace the tires, including spare.
Replace all hoses, and belts as well.
Get an alignment.
Replace fuel filter....a must!!!

Flush the tank, if posible.

And use it evry day. Car will thrive on that.

Yes....this is a daily driver. Enjoy!!!!!
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  #7  
Old 12-04-2003, 12:50 PM
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Thanx all for the input and guidance. I was not really seeking a MB but I saw one, a 6 cyl. 280 SE, fell for it, waited too long, and it was snatched away by a wiser buyer (apparently for less than the advertised $1750.) After that I was back to looking at older but low miles American iron until I saw ths fellow advertised. Reading these many threads I guess I was getting a bit jaundiced because they all deal with problems. Of course, I've gotta realize, that is the purpose of this forum, right? Anyhow, think I'm going to jump into 280 ownership if I have not (again) sat on my hands too long. This auto has been advertised for over one month and I was the first test drive although others had called.
Now, another question -- the spring contraption above the differential, a hydo-compensator?? Whathehell is that about? Hydro/hydra -- water/oil under pressure? Is it an automatic ride leveler? AND, how problematic are these devices on a 32 year-old beast? I think I stumbled onto an old thread where one of the wizened vets here mentioned the device is pressurized by the movement of the rear wheels, is this it?
Again, info/support/guidance/condolences(if need be) appreciated.
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  #8  
Old 12-04-2003, 01:12 PM
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It sounds like this is a quite decent car. And I think you would have NO trouble using it as your daily driver (unless you have a 50 mile commute, of course, since the gas mileage already discussed is not conducive to long commutes unless you don't care about money).

I used my 73 280C as a daily driver for 2 years until this month. I found that the more I drove it (it was parked for 5 years by the prior owner), the better is got. As others have mentioned, vintage MBs don't like to sit. Indeed, it does seem like they deteriorate more by being parked than by driving them!

You never said what the asking price is... I think that would be the final variable. If the owner is willing to let it go for a reasonable sum, then it's a taker. If he or she is expecting $8k than you just need to walk away. From the shopping I've done it seems like $2k-$4k would be reasonable, but I will defer to other who have more expertise with this particular model. Personally I think the 72 280SEL is about the best car, all-around, that MB ever made. I prefer the 6 cylinder but the 8's seem to be worth more. I always thought the 8 was just MB's answer to Americans who liked their Buicks. They were never very popular in Europe.

Catrinus
73 280C
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  #9  
Old 12-04-2003, 03:41 PM
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Catrinus -- Owner wants $3000 and says he is firm. From speaking with him it is evident he knows very little about MB generally. When the rheostat on the dash failed (for A/C?) he just plunked in an On/Off switch from the local hardware store. Another is advertised in my area for $10,000 and it claims to need "TLC." I'm going to try to knock a few hundred off the $3G, particularly in light of the unknown LR door/window malady. Will post with news as it happens...
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Old 12-04-2003, 04:44 PM
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The hydro-compensator is a gas-oil spring mounted over the differential, across the swinging halves of the rear axle.
Usually, if it fails, the rear of the car will sag, kind of like it has 500 pounds of bricks in the trunk and a new hydro-compensator will be expensive.
Alternately, you may be able to replace it with a much cheaper coil-spring unit, like the one used on the '59 - '68 Fintail cars. My Dad had his hydro-compensator replaced with the coil spring unit on his '66 250SE and it worked just fine. If the car is sitting level now, I wouldn't worry about it yet.


Happy Motoring, Mark
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  #11  
Old 12-04-2003, 04:50 PM
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Seems like a reasonable price, then. I would go for it and enjoy fixing the little things that might need a little work.
Keep us posted as to your decision and progress! For example, the rheostat a rotary switch that dims the dash lights. You can buy them on eBay at around $25.00 or new for around $40.00. Not an expensive items at all. Or just leave the on-off switch in (these bulbs are not real bright, so I leave mine all the way "bright" anyway).
Good luck,
Catrinus
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  #12  
Old 12-05-2003, 08:35 PM
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Talking

Well, I did it!! Will be fetching MY 1972 280SE 4.5 on Sunday. Hope it survives the 90 miles home intact so I can really start going over it. Thanx all for the insights and advice. I am certain you will see me here often in the coming months. Catrinus, I mentioned the replaced rheostat as perhaps an A/C control because it is right above the vents and I thought it may have been associated with the A/C. Odd spot for dash lights, at least it's conspicuous...I did not even worry about the air because I do not care if it works or not. Also, did not quite have time to figure out the heat controls, although all levers were present (4) and movable.
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Old 12-06-2003, 12:39 PM
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Heater controls:

Upper left lever is the air flow control -- right is off, left is full speed fan (fan has two speeds, you can feel the switch click). Upper rigth is defrost/floor, marked by arrows. I think full right is floor, full left is full defrost, but check the arrow on the right side.

Bottom levers are heat -- right lever is for passenger, left for driver's side. Off is to the right for the drivers side, left for the passenger (pushed toward the center of the panel), reverse for full heat.

AC is not integrated, it has it's own blower moter under the right kickpanel. You can use it in damp weather to defog the windows. Two knobs -- right on is temp, left is on/off and blower speed.

The "bullseye" vents on the outer ends of the dash blow either cold AC air or heated air when the heater is on with the lever in the closed (up, I think) posistion, unconditioned outside air with the lever open.

Rear defogger is the round switch on the dash with a white center -- pull to turn on, push to turn off. The knob next to it is the fornt/rear fader control for the fatory radio.

Dash lights dimmer is the long stem on the left side of the instrument cluster, the trip odometer reset is on the right.

Peter
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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #14  
Old 12-06-2003, 08:00 PM
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kpb,
I know that, by 1972, cars sold in the US were required to be able to run on unleaded fuel, which at the time was only widely availible in regular grade. For 1972 both Audi and Mercedes (at least on the 6 cyl.) had reduced compression.
The specs I have for the US market W108 4.5 give an 8 to 1 compression ratio (8.8 to 1 outside the US).
For more fuel-octane controversy, check out the Vintage Forum thread "Knock sensor for a 108 4.5?.

Happy Motoring, Mark
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  #15  
Old 12-06-2003, 09:21 PM
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Peter -- Thank you for the info, I am ready to bust my britches I am so pumped about driving and owning this piece of work!!

Mark -- Since discovering this site I have checked it consistently (about 8 time per day) and have followed every new/updated thread, so I have seen the whole octane discussion/fight as it developed. Thank you for the tip. You appear to be one of the stable voices of reason here. I cannot wait to get my knuckles bloody on this auto...Will post more as I bleed!

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