Ok, I took my right cam off - it's stamped "53" on the back with the only part number on it "4701" (117 051 4701, I guess?)

I replaced it with a cam stamped "57" on the back, with the full part number "116 051 4801" on it.

A QUICK look and GUESS at the cams looks like the intake and exhaust lobes are closer together on the 56/57 cams than on the 52/53 cams. I can't say any more. I am going to play around with them later once I clean them off.

I THINK that it's a LITTLE less powerful off the line, but it seems a LOT more responsive in the higher RPMs (above 2500 I'd guess). Does this make sense?

For now, I'm going to leave this cam on. I want to see if my one side's headers get red like before I put the new chain on, while the other doesn't (with the 52 cam). Also, my other cam looked like it was on its way out at one of the tower bearings - it has some play in it and scoring on the bearing

edit: Hrm, I should add that I didn't adjust the valve clearances when I switched the cams, which MIGHT be why my off-the-line power seems a tiny bit lower (as in 5HP, nothing major)

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k

Hi,
Are the two cams interchangeable? On diesel engines for example you have to have in mind whether the rocker arms are hardened or softened(hardened camshaft must not be installed with hardened rockers and so on..).Just curious...

As far as I'm aware, ALL m116 and m117 rockers are identical, from the 3.5 all the way to the 5.6. What matters is if the lifters are mechanical or hydraulic, but both of these cam sets are for mechanical studs, so I'm safe there.

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k

Tomguy:

I just checked my CD ROM, job 05-215, and the cam table it contains. Looks like the 56/57 cams have a net of about 6 degrees more duration for both intake and exhaust over the 52/53 cams. The opening and closing events are all different, but the totals add up to an increase. So your performance change at higher revs is consistent with what I would expect if I had done something similar to my Mustang: Longer duration usually gets you better high rpm performance with a slight drop off at lower revs. All other things being equal. I guess I'm surprised that with such a small change you can feel the difference. My US V8s usually need a bit more change than that to have the performance change be so apparent.

The cam specs seem kinda funny from what I am accustomed to with american V8s. Opening events seem later than typical and closing happens a bit early. For high rev V8s this seems odd, but hey, it seems to work.

FWIW,

230/8

Yeah, I can't even enter the cam timings into Dyno2000 because it's designed to have the exhaust valve close ATDC. If the exhaust valve stayed open that long on the 4.5 the valve would smash against the piston!

I really think the 56/57 cams are off a Euro 350. But I wish someone could shed more light on this for me! It looks like these may have been my eBay bargain of the centruy for my 4.5 when I picked them up for a song and a dance about 2 years ago!

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k

You got me curious so I looked again at the data tables on my CD. The engine is a 117.992, which I cannot decipher as to model. But I did a Google and located a numerical reference to this number and it is a regular 4.5 with 8.0 compression ratio. Sounds like an export model of some sort, but it is not one of the listed numbers for the USA. Maybe third world?

230/8

I found this chart which lists the 117.992 as 140KW/190PS. Don't know exactly how to interpret these numbers, BUT, the 117.984, my engine, is listed at 135KW/183PS. Both are 8:1, so all else being the same (?), the cams would make up for that difference. It says "450 SL (107) 03.1793 -> 08.1975, M117.992. Now, I don't know how accurate this is, because it ALSO says, 280 SE 4.5 (108) 12.1975 -> 04.1980, M117.984. The 4.5 though is 1971-1972 (with some titled as 1973 but technically still 1972's).

What does it list for cams on the 117.986, and 116.98x?

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k

Caution advized to me was to keep original towers (or camshaft carrier) with their respective camshafts when replacing cams and carrier on my twincam 280/8.

This might explain how the Euro cam has excessive play in one of the towers, if you didnt follow this procedure.

Hell, camshafts are so easy to pull that you might get lucky and dig up a tighter fitting set of towers for the Euro cams at your next junkyard expedition. It would really suck if swapping cams using the same towers ruined the towers so *both* sets of camshafts had excessive play.

__________________
'80 300SD/ w116
'79 240D 4-spd
'71 750cc Guzzi

previously owned:

'83 240D 4-spd
'77 280SEL 4-spd
'74 280/8
'72 250/8
'65 220Sb 4-spd
'63 220Sb 4-spd
'63 190c 4-spd
'61 220Sb 4-spd
'60 190b 4-spd

Actually, I have the matched towers with each set of cams, and I kept them matched so that this sort of thing wouldn't happen. It is possible I somehow messed it up and put that tower on the wrong spot but I doubt it. There is ONE tower I needed to use, from the 56/57's, on the 52/53 cams when I put them on last time. BUT, only 1 and I'm hoping nothing bad came of it. It's because that one tower from those 52/53 cams was messed up. MAYBE I accidentally switched where that tower was to a new tower and put the 56/57's tower on the wrong spot? If so, it might be a good thing, as it might have kept that tower from going bad as I will need it again!

Edit: And the play is in the 52/53 cam and tower, and NOT the 56/57 set that has apparently more power.

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k

Since 746 watts = 1 horsepower, 140,000/746= 187.7 HP.

__________________
1970 280S M130 engine- good runner
1971 250 M130 engine- #2 rod bearing, gone
1971 280SE (blown engine,parts car)
1977 German 280S W116-only 33 years old

Tomguy:

My CD ROM lists a a bunch of cams for these engines. The table shows USA and other country versions.

116.98X engines: .982, cam set 30/31
.983, cam set 42/43

Both of those engines show the replacement to be cam set 52/53

116.984 and .985: use cam set 58/59 which is a hydraulic grind.

engine 117.985 (world) and .986 (USA) use cam set 58/59, which also is a hydraulic grind.

Send me a private email and I'll try to forward you a copy of the job and data table in PDF. The table shows the various specs (but not lift) for each cam set.

By the way, the table link you found was the same one I located. Would be nice to know what all the reference numbers mean.

230/8

Which would be the "hottest" cam that you could put in a 4.5? Would that include a cam form a 3.5?

it does let you put in a -number, !

mike

US V-8's are typically pushrod engines, except for the newer OHC engines, and need to get the longer valve mechanisms moving and stopped. With OHC, you can pop the valves open and shut much faster.

Then too, MB engines are set for higher PRM power, US engines for low end torque.

IMHO.

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Regards

Warren

Currently 1965 220Sb, 2002 FORD Crown Vic Police Interceptor

Had 1965 220SEb, 1967 230S, 280SE 4.5, 300SE (W126), 420SEL

ENTER > = (HP RPN)

Not part of the in-crowd since 1952.

Not the software I have!

__________________
Current:
2021 Charger Scat Pack Widebody "Sinabee"
2018 Durango R/T

Previous:
1972 280SE 4.5
2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited "Hefe", 1992 Jeep Cherokee Laredo "Jeepy", 2006 Charger R/T "Hemi"
1999 Chrysler 300M - RIP @ 221k